Controversial AF. Crafting negatively impacts this game.

"

way2stupid#9491 wrote:

I am what could be considered a new player, i started playing in Sentinel league!
I was drawn in by PoE1 reputation of having the most complex endgame systems in combination with nearly endless character customization.

Needless to say, i was not disappointed - on the contrary, i grew to love this game very much, despite or maybe even because of all the obstacles and challenges it threw in my way.

One thing became very obvious very fast - i really dont like trading. It is simply not for me. But i know quite a lot of people who love the trading and economy, they almost play it as a game of its own. I can respect that, even if its not for me. My path to becoming a 100% SSF player was only a matter of time.

And as much as i disliked trading, there was on particular system that fascinated me like no other, more or less right from the start: crafting.

Crafting in PoE1 is such a joy for me. Its such a deep system in PoE1, you can put hours upon hours in it and still learn so much. You can plan your entire league around it, structure your whole progression.
But you can also just essence slam some fractures to get any type of gear to make almost all builds functional on a basic level.
Its reputation makes it seem a lot harder than it actually is.
Its a brilliant system!

But what boggles my mind and i hope i get some answers:
If you dont like trading and you dont like crafting, arguably 2 of the most refined and most integral systems of PoE1, why even bother playing the game?
For its combat?! Its graphics?

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I just want people to wake up and realize that the amount of people that like the economy system in this game, are not representative of the majority of players. And it's especially bad on the forums, because most players don't care enough to voice an opinion on a game if it's bad, they just stop playing. And then on the forums/reddit, you've got people with 20 supporter packs talking about how good crafting is. It's out of touch.

You read reviews on this game and most people will stop playing when exposed to the reality of the crafting/trading system after they finish the acts. Most of my friends have quit this game over the years, people who all grew up loving ARPG's and still play other ones.

Why do I play? Because I like the builds, I like the world. And I always quit when the game becomes crafting simulator. I come back once or twice a year to play a character or two to 85 and leave. Like the majority of players.

And PoE 2 has a chance to actually set itself apart from PoE 1. We can keep the economy intact in PoE 1 and people can go play that if they want it.

The reality is, either GGG makes a game that appeals to the whales and addicts of PoE 1. Or they make a game that has more widespread appeal. But with the game being separated, it's clear they're trying to change the game. And feedback on systems like this is necessary if the game is to have a more widespread appeal.

"

Jooker360#7907 wrote:

He has a great point. 11 years is a lot of time and you are still here. So it seems to me they got something right. I think the complaints are a byproduct of the experience the game provides. There are ups and downs and that's the good thing about it.

I mean, the last 5-6 years in PoE have been joining in to play one or two characters to level 80 something. Because I enjoy the builds and the passive tree and blowing enemies up.

Which is why I'm saying they should.. focus on that sort of gameplay, because tons of players are in the same situation I am, or never continue playing when they realize that crafting/trading is necessary.


And that's the point of this thread. To stop PoE 2 becoming another crafting simulator for a small percentage of players that like it. To actually ask GGG to make the game different. Not just copy and paste systems into the game.

They separated it for a reason. I would assume that's because they're looking to change the formula and get rid of the bad systems that is stopping the game from more mainstream appeal.

Yeah. The loot system and craft are annoying. At first you have the game experience, that values your skill over your equipment, but then you start "end game" and it all falls apart. Your skill becomes obsolete, but your equipment becomes the only gate. Period.
GGG tried to combine ARPG with Souls-like, but what they've managed to achieve is another gacha (BAD one, may I add) with the only difference being not playing to roll for characters, but for the equipment itself. Thus, the "end game" turns the good game into mindless time sink, where you pray to RNGesus for something to drop, for something that will allow you to sink your time in the same way, but with bigger numbers. They really need to either make better drop table, or to improve (COMPLETELY RE-DO) crafting, while bringing the importance of player's skill back. I want to play ARPG, not the slot machine.

"

Rakshatra#3659 wrote:

Yeah. The loot system and craft are annoying. At first you have the game experience, that values your skill over your equipment, but then you start "end game" and it all falls apart. Your skill becomes obsolete, but your equipment becomes the only gate. Period.
GGG tried to combine ARPG with Souls-like, but what they've managed to achieve is another gacha (BAD one, may I add) with the only difference being not playing to roll for characters, but for the equipment itself. Thus, the "end game" turns the good game into mindless time sink, where you pray to RNGesus for something to drop, for something that will allow you to sink your time in the same way, but with bigger numbers. They really need to either make better drop table, or to improve (COMPLETELY RE-DO) crafting, while bringing the importance of player's skill back. I want to play ARPG, not the slot machine.

I never cared that a game had crafting. I just always want it to be a choice. The loot in PoE 1 and PoE 2 is literally designed around the crafting system, and for many players, it's a big negative to the game. Much of the games balance is done around the economy.

The only reason I play is mostly because of the builds and the world. The skills are very fun, the passive tree is super customizable, and it's fun to play that. Just never found enjoyment in trading/crafting.

I agree 100% with the OP here.

The current 'crafting' system is just gambling, and the loot drops from even act bosses are 9 times out of 10 extremely unsatisfying.

I was really hoping that PoE2 would learn a thing or two from Last Epoch's crafting system. For those unfamiliar, in LE you can break down any item you come across and retrieve essence shards corresponding to some (potentially all) of the affixes/suffixes the item had. Those shards could then be applied to new gear with free affix/suffix slots - except for uniques.

To pre-empt the inevitable snarky replies: I prefer PoE's world, lore, story, delivery, combat, and potential for build diversity - but that doesn't mean LE doesn't have some good ideas.

Imagine if a similar system were devised for PoE2? Imagine if folks who like trading were trading specific and sought-after affix/suffix shards, rather than slot machine orbs? I bet chaos resist shards would be quite sought-after. Imagine if SSF folks could find meaningful upgrades by breaking down otherwise junk loot from bosses or mobs (a blue two-handed mace with a +cold damage affix would be a nice find for an ice monk under this system, but a useless one under the current one), rather than exchanging them for gold or slot-machine orbs?

Hell, the systems wouldn't need to be mutually exclusive - could always throw Transmutes and Augments at a white item and, if you like the affixes, break 'em down and hope you get the shards.

Just my 2 cents.

"

Xndar#6927 wrote:

I agree 100% with the OP here.

The current 'crafting' system is just gambling, and the loot drops from even act bosses are 9 times out of 10 extremely unsatisfying.

I was really hoping that PoE2 would learn a thing or two from Last Epoch's crafting system. For those unfamiliar, in LE you can break down any item you come across and retrieve essence shards corresponding to some (potentially all) of the affixes/suffixes the item had. Those shards could then be applied to new gear with free affix/suffix slots - except for uniques.

To pre-empt the inevitable snarky replies: I prefer PoE's world, lore, story, delivery, combat, and potential for build diversity - but that doesn't mean LE doesn't have some good ideas.

Imagine if a similar system were devised for PoE2? Imagine if folks who like trading were trading specific and sought-after affix/suffix shards, rather than slot machine orbs? I bet chaos resist shards would be quite sought-after. Imagine if SSF folks could find meaningful upgrades by breaking down otherwise junk loot from bosses or mobs (a blue two-handed mace with a +cold damage affix would be a nice find for an ice monk under this system, but a useless one under the current one), rather than exchanging them for gold or slot-machine orbs?

Hell, the systems wouldn't need to be mutually exclusive - could always throw Transmutes and Augments at a white item and, if you like the affixes, break 'em down and hope you get the shards.

Just my 2 cents.

Haven't played Last Epoch, but it certainly sounds like a better way to do things than what this game has.

You're right. It's essentially gambling, and it's done this way to hook players. The entire game is balanced around forced crafting/trading and an economy. This drives players to the systems, and then gets them hooked on the gambling. It's basically what PoE 1 was like for years.

Makes sense why people end up with 15,000 hours in the game..

Either way. Not a healthy mechanic, either for the game or the players. It needs to be reworked or removed.

The most fun I’ve had in EA has been the Trial of Sekehemas and chasing unique relic drops from Zarokh. To me, this is A+ loot design—offering rare and challenging gameplay with the potential for game-shattering gear or wealth. It captures the thrill and reward that make ARPGs so engaging. We need more loot like this that feels earned and exciting, and fewer systems that rely on slot machine-style randomness to create artificial engagement.

"

Xenus_Paradox#7530 wrote:

Crafting is just glorified identification.

Exactly this.

You are identifying an item one affix at a time, at the cost of an orb each.

"

AintCare#6513 wrote:

the crafting sucks because drops are better in comparison. remove the drops or heavily restrict their quality and you will see ppl crafting more

Drops are not always better.

"

QticaX#4168 wrote:

"

Akedomo#3573 wrote:

"

QticaX#4168 wrote:

It negatively impacts you is what you meant to say.

You've played the original for 11 years and you're suggesting they change their method? Why, it's worked for 11 years.. and it's not gonna just stop and fail because you and a handful of people do not enjoy it.

No, it negatively impacts most players.

Hey, lets do a bit of a thought experiment. How many hours in PoE do you have, and how much money have you spent on it?

Do you think you're an 'average' player, and thus capable of speaking on the issues that they encounter without bias?

This top trading crafting has been complained about for years almost a decade and GGG has stated exactly why they won't make and automated AH or want crafting the way it is...

BECAUSE it will make the game to easy. You would get all your gear so fast then quit playing... I think you should do some research because this is something they stand firm on and it will not change.. it hasn't for a decade.

"You would get all your gear so fast then quit playing"

Aren't there multiple builds you can do in this game? If GGG just recognized that AND balanced the skill gems to do equal damage throughout the game, then that would be PERFECT. The skills are fun, but most need to get balanced, along with supports.

"

way2stupid#9491 wrote:

If you dont like trading and you dont like crafting, arguably 2 of the most refined and most integral systems of PoE1, why even bother playing the game?
For its combat?! Its graphics?

The crafting system in POE1 is okay.

The one in POE2 is not. It is a casino.

And yes, I was still playing because of the fun skills and what you can do with them. The combat is mediocre, due to monsters doing too much damage/one-shotting you, which is mostly due to them just not being balanced, and I understand it. It's EA. Most of the things in the game need balancing.