Haven't really ever commented on lab, but I hate it.

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Aim_Deep wrote:

Anyone that says lab is fun is lying IMO. SC or HC.

Lab IS fun, up until the reset on death. I'm pretty sure people would enjoy this so much more if you weren't punished so hard for dying.

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Fruz wrote:

But Atziri's loot as well in that case.
And most people are just doing fine without it.
Poweful uniques are desired by everyone, but thanks god they are not all easy to get ( And yes, despite all what people can say, I definitely believe that people bitching about the lab because "we don't like that kind of gameplay" is because they are bad at it, and feel frustrated. Maybe they don't like traps, that's for sure, but if it was much easier with almost no risk, they would not be complaining ).

Most of Atziri's loot can be emulated, somewhat, either by the passive tree or by gear. And if it can't it can be traded for.

If people are bad at it why not accept their complaints? Lab requires different sort of skills than the rest of the game, like patience or timing, or frustration tolerance when you die after spending an hour in it. It's not like they want PoE to be a different sort of game, it's rather the opposite: that to get something that can be considered a "core" aspect of the game you have to do something that is not what the rest of PoE is about.

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Jojas wrote:

"

Fruz wrote:

But Atziri's loot as well in that case.
And most people are just doing fine without it.
Poweful uniques are desired by everyone, but thanks god they are not all easy to get ( And yes, despite all what people can say, I definitely believe that people bitching about the lab because "we don't like that kind of gameplay" is because they are bad at it, and feel frustrated. Maybe they don't like traps, that's for sure, but if it was much easier with almost no risk, they would not be complaining ).

Most of Atziri's loot can be emulated, somewhat, either by the passive tree or by gear. And if it can't it can be traded for.

If people are bad at it why not accept their complaints? Lab requires different sort of skills than the rest of the game, like patience or timing, or frustration tolerance when you die after spending an hour in it. It's not like they want PoE to be a different sort of game, it's rather the opposite: that to get something that can be considered a "core" aspect of the game you have to do something that is not what the rest of PoE is about.

Why do you think they should adjust it for a small portion of players ? GGG has stated that Ascendancy points are a reward for completing difficult content, its their full intention to make sure that players have to earn them.

Better yourselves instead of dragging others down to your level, its as simple as that when it comes to the skill argument.

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Casual_Ascent wrote:

If you didn't plan your build around an ascendancy class, you don't know how to play an rpg.

Nothing less I would have expected from you, considerign your previous posts.
I'm sorry ... you are ...?
Private profile that joined the game this year, I see ...

Yeah, I don't like add hominem, but I kinda had to point this out after this quote, because it's funny.

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Pizzarugi wrote:

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Aim_Deep wrote:

Anyone that says lab is fun is lying IMO. SC or HC.

Lab IS fun, up until the reset on death. I'm pretty sure people would enjoy this so much more if you weren't punished so hard for dying.

People probably got used not to get punished anymore in PoE, too much.
As an example, implementing checkpoints was ( imho ) a terrible idea, and I have no idea why GGG did it.

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Jojas wrote:

If people are bad at it why not accept their complaints? Lab requires different sort of skills than the rest of the game, like patience or timing, or frustration tolerance when you die after spending an hour in it. It's not like they want PoE to be a different sort of game, it's rather the opposite: that to get something that can be considered a "core" aspect of the game you have to do something that is not what the rest of PoE is about.

Some bosses already required that.
Lab just requires much more of it.
And more important, lab does allow you to faceroll and copy paste a build brainlessly, and that's great.
The lab is as core to the game than the asendancy classes are, those things go together.
( And are imo not core, at least not yet. Those are great additions )

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

Why do you think they should adjust it for a small portion of players ? GGG has stated that Ascendancy points are a reward for completing difficult content, its their full intention to make sure that players have to earn them.

Better yourselves instead of dragging others down to your level, its as simple as that when it comes to the skill argument.

Sure, as I said before, an ascension shouldn't come easy, it should involve a trial of some sort, and I think GGG did a good job of making it about skill rather than stats. I just think the complaints are not to be ridiculed or outright dismissed.
And some people really can't get the hang of it, no matter what. They just can't. They get confused by traps moving all over the place, they feel too pressured by the rogue-like aspect, whatever. Not everything is a learning matter, sometimes you just hit your limit.
And others just hate the concept because they hate the concept. Complaints are natural when something like the lab gets introduced. Ridiculing people or telling them L2P helps no-one.

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Fruz wrote:

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Casual_Ascent wrote:

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Fruz wrote:

They are not in the game as a core aspect, that is why this whole argument is about.

Yes, they are. The entire game is based around the ascendancy points now. The game is now called: Path of Exile Ascendancy

When forming build ideas, ALL players base their ideas around what is available in the Ascendancy classes.

No.
Speak for yourself, not as everyone.
I bet many new players don't give a damn about ascendancy classes.
( By the way, when I first started to plan the build I'm currently running, I found out what I wanted to do, and THEN, AFTER, I checked the ascendancy classes, and it fits what I wanted to do because it fits the class I chose first ).

It's called like this because it is the last content / expansion patch to date, and all the marketing around it it still active obviously !
Prophecy is also there but it is just a league, not a major content update.
2.4.0 will have it's own new marketing interface and stuff.

So if you don't give a damn about something then it becomes optional? Do you want me to list the things you can't do in PoE without ascendancy classes? It's a lot.

@Pyrokar- There is not a single core part of the game that can not be done without Ascending.

In before you say "well you cant play x/y/z builds without them!". Specific builds arent a core part of the game, theyre entirely optional as to how you set them up to play. Quite literally optional, based on personal preference.

Ascendancy points are akin to uniques you build around, if you choose to build around them then you are expected to earn them, they are not going to be given to you. If you plan for a Shavarones of course youre going to need a Shavarones. If you plan for a Mjolner, then of course youre going to need a Mjolner.

GGG does this two ways, you do it yourself, or someone does it for you, which is absolutely fine as is (AKA You find it, or you buy it in the case of items).

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Jojas wrote:

And some people really can't get the hang of it, no matter what. They just can't. They get confused by traps moving all over the place, they feel too pressured by the rogue-like aspect, whatever. Not everything is a learning matter, sometimes you just hit your limit.

and why these people should be rewarded? they do not achieve 'results'. they might put the 'effort' but.. this is - as brutal as it is - irrelevant. both here and in real life.

we make a challenging content with rewards and then give the rewards to everybody? whats the point?

and 'the limit' you talk about is frequently higher than a person in question wants to admit - but it takes some effort to raise it. some societies created an interesting way of solving problems: whining until the problem is gone. it does not work this way. people who attempt that never get very far.

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Pyrokar wrote:

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Fruz wrote:

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Casual_Ascent wrote:

Yes, they are. The entire game is based around the ascendancy points now. The game is now called: Path of Exile Ascendancy

When forming build ideas, ALL players base their ideas around what is available in the Ascendancy classes.

No.
Speak for yourself, not as everyone.
I bet many new players don't give a damn about ascendancy classes.
( By the way, when I first started to plan the build I'm currently running, I found out what I wanted to do, and THEN, AFTER, I checked the ascendancy classes, and it fits what I wanted to do because it fits the class I chose first ).

It's called like this because it is the last content / expansion patch to date, and all the marketing around it it still active obviously !
Prophecy is also there but it is just a league, not a major content update.
2.4.0 will have it's own new marketing interface and stuff.

So if you don't give a damn about something then it becomes optional? Do you want me to list the things you can't do in PoE without ascendancy classes? It's a lot.

.....
I was answering a quote ( you know, I quoted, and then I bolded the part that I was refering to ).
You seem to just take it out of the context and try to make me say something that I didn't.
Please don't.
Please list those things tho.

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sidtherat wrote:

and 'the limit' you talk about is frequently higher than a person in question wants to admit - but it takes some effort to raise it. some societies created an interesting way of solving problems: whining until the problem is gone. it does not work this way. people who attempt that never get very far.

Welcome to the internet :p.

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Casual_Ascent wrote:

The point I was trying to press, is that planning a build WITHOUT ascendancy points as part of the idea is gimping one's character heavily. Even a casual scrub like me looks at the UNIQUE build opportunities that ascending provides. These special features that are not available in the game from any other route than the ascendancy classes (points).

This is a fact. And it is also the reason that Ascending IS mandatory for anyone looking to make their unique character all it can be.

I don't want to waste too much of my time, so since it has all been said before, I will just go with :
NO.

EDIT for below :
sure lol.
And here it came.
w/e.