Haven't really ever commented on lab, but I hate it.

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Turtledove wrote:

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ShaUrley wrote:

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

The new monsters with new skills do literally nothing because they die instantly like everything else, nice try though lmao.

I dare say that's true if you happen to have great gear. But I lost a lvl 58 witch to cruel Triskeriaki in Kaom's path (after foolishly mashing my skill keys instead of my potion keys). He definitely seemed worse than before. And, having got another witch and a ranger to merciless Lunaris at this point, that area also feels significantly more dangerous than it used to be -- my poor ranger has resorted to using a decoy totem for protection. Of course, if she happened to have an uber-bow, she'd be instantly slaughtering everything in sight.

Tin_Foil_Hat is using a what I'd call a silly definition of optional. Just because you can complete content without it then it's optional. You can call it optional, I agree. If you want to use the definition that it's optional if you don't need it to complete the content then practically everything in the game is optional making the definition meaningless.

No, you just dont understand the definition of CORE which is why your definition of OPTIONAL is completely skewed.

Please enlighten me as to how content is impossible to complete with no ascendancy points. As soon as you can prove that theres content that cannot be completed without them ill agree.

But... There isnt anything. Like i said before, 2.2-2.3 builds work EXACTLY how they did before without Ascendancy points. The points only make you stronger, they do not make you weaker. You guys are ignoring that fact and are saying its mandatory and required, just like you guys did when Master Crafting was introduced.

Im done arguing, because it will just blow over exactly how the complaints over Masters did before. Frankly its a waste of time to try to argue with people who refuse to acknowledge the facts of the matter.

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

Frankly its a waste of time to try to argue with people who refuse to acknowledge the facts of the matter.

At least here's one statement we can all agree with.

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

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Turtledove wrote:

Tin_Foil_Hat is using a what I'd call a silly definition of optional. Just because you can complete content without it then it's optional. You can call it optional, I agree. If you want to use the definition that it's optional if you don't need it to complete the content then practically everything in the game is optional making the definition meaningless.

No, you just dont understand the definition of CORE which is why your definition of OPTIONAL is completely skewed.

Please enlighten me as to how content is impossible to complete with no ascendancy points. As soon as you can prove that theres content that cannot be completed without them ill agree.

But... There isnt anything. Like i said before, 2.2-2.3 builds work EXACTLY how they did before without Ascendancy points. The points only make you stronger, they do not make you weaker. You guys are ignoring that fact and are saying its mandatory and required, just like you guys did when Master Crafting was introduced.

Im done arguing, because it will just blow over exactly how the complaints over Masters did before. Frankly its a waste of time to try to argue with people who refuse to acknowledge the facts of the matter.

I'm trying to use your definition of optional. As I understand it, Optional: An item or construct is optional it it can not be used and the PoE content can still be completed.

Is that your definition of optional? If so then why is almost everything in the game not optional? If that is not your definition of optional then what is your definition?

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Turtledove wrote:

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

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Turtledove wrote:

Tin_Foil_Hat is using a what I'd call a silly definition of optional. Just because you can complete content without it then it's optional. You can call it optional, I agree. If you want to use the definition that it's optional if you don't need it to complete the content then practically everything in the game is optional making the definition meaningless.

No, you just dont understand the definition of CORE which is why your definition of OPTIONAL is completely skewed.

Please enlighten me as to how content is impossible to complete with no ascendancy points. As soon as you can prove that theres content that cannot be completed without them ill agree.

But... There isnt anything. Like i said before, 2.2-2.3 builds work EXACTLY how they did before without Ascendancy points. The points only make you stronger, they do not make you weaker. You guys are ignoring that fact and are saying its mandatory and required, just like you guys did when Master Crafting was introduced.

Im done arguing, because it will just blow over exactly how the complaints over Masters did before. Frankly its a waste of time to try to argue with people who refuse to acknowledge the facts of the matter.

I'm trying to use your definition of optional. As I understand it, Optional: An item or construct is optional it it can not be used and the PoE content can still be completed.

Is that your definition of optional? If so then why is almost everything in the game not optional? If that is not your definition of optional then what is your definition?

And do you understand the ACTUAL definition of what core means ? Clearly you dont when youre saying Ascendancy points are a required, mandatory, part of the the game where you cannot and will not progress without them.

As mentioned in past pages, youre using semantics to try and prove what is and isnt optional while ignoring actual facts. Just like that guys retarded statement on how wearing gear and using skill points is optional.

They arent optional, theyre core to the game and you quite literally cannot progress past certain points without them. You get stone walled. The game is literally balanced around having them. There is NOTHING in the game right now balanced around having an Ascendancy, and thus it is not core to the game and is entirely optional.

Edit - You seem to think im completely close minded on the subject, im not. Im acknowledging the facts of the matter.

As soon as content is created and balanced entirely around Ascending ill HAPPILY oblige to agreeing, until then, im done on the topic.

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

And do you understand the ACTUAL definition of what core means ? Clearly you dont when youre saying Ascendancy points are a required, mandatory, part of the the game where you cannot and will not progress without them.

As mentioned in past pages, youre using semantics to try and prove what is and isnt optional while ignoring actual facts. Just like that guys retarded statement on how wearing gear and using skill points is optional.

They arent optional, theyre core to the game and you quite literally cannot progress past certain points without them. You get stone walled. The game is literally balanced around having them. There is NOTHING in the game right now balanced around having an Ascendancy, and thus it is not core to the game and is entirely optional.

Edit - You seem to think im completely close minded on the subject, im not. Im acknowledging the facts of the matter.

As soon as content is created and balanced entirely around Ascending ill HAPPILY oblige to agreeing, until then, im done on the topic.

I get it. Ascendancy points not part of the core game. You say that passive skill points and rare helmets are part of the core game. But ascendancy points are not part of the core game because ? ??? (core is magical and won't let ascendancy points in?)

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Turtledove wrote:

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

And do you understand the ACTUAL definition of what core means ? Clearly you dont when youre saying Ascendancy points are a required, mandatory, part of the the game where you cannot and will not progress without them.

As mentioned in past pages, youre using semantics to try and prove what is and isnt optional while ignoring actual facts. Just like that guys retarded statement on how wearing gear and using skill points is optional.

They arent optional, theyre core to the game and you quite literally cannot progress past certain points without them. You get stone walled. The game is literally balanced around having them. There is NOTHING in the game right now balanced around having an Ascendancy, and thus it is not core to the game and is entirely optional.

Edit - You seem to think im completely close minded on the subject, im not. Im acknowledging the facts of the matter.

As soon as content is created and balanced entirely around Ascending ill HAPPILY oblige to agreeing, until then, im done on the topic.

I get it. Ascendancy points not part of the core game. You say that passive skill points and rare helmets are part of the core game. But ascendancy points are not part of the core game because ? ??? (core is magical and won't let ascendancy points in?)

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

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Turtledove wrote:

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

And do you understand the ACTUAL definition of what core means ? Clearly you dont when youre saying Ascendancy points are a required, mandatory, part of the the game where you cannot and will not progress without them.

As mentioned in past pages, youre using semantics to try and prove what is and isnt optional while ignoring actual facts. Just like that guys retarded statement on how wearing gear and using skill points is optional.

They arent optional, theyre core to the game and you quite literally cannot progress past certain points without them. You get stone walled. The game is literally balanced around having them. There is NOTHING in the game right now balanced around having an Ascendancy, and thus it is not core to the game and is entirely optional.

Edit - You seem to think im completely close minded on the subject, im not. Im acknowledging the facts of the matter.

As soon as content is created and balanced entirely around Ascending ill HAPPILY oblige to agreeing, until then, im done on the topic.

I get it. Ascendancy points not part of the core game. You say that passive skill points and rare helmets are part of the core game. But ascendancy points are not part of the core game because ? ??? (core is magical and won't let ascendancy points in?)

Dear Tin_Foil_Hat, it is silly to use a different definition of core/optional for everything EXCEPT ascendancy points. We'll have to let the record show that Tin_Foil_Hat cannot support his position that ascendancy points are not a core part of the game and because of the silly reasons above yet claims that the same defintions do not apply to anything else in the game except for ascendancy points. Why are ascendancy points treated special like this? Simply because Tin_Foil_Hat says so. That argument may work fine for Tin_Foil_Hat. Sorry but that doesn't work for me and there may be a few other people that are not convinced.

Tin_Foil_Hat says,

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

Your clear lack of understanding of the meaning of core is funny, its very funny how you think its a "logical" argument to compare an impossibility.

Its a fact that gear is a core element to the game, you cannot progress without it. You cannot go through every act of the game, including maps with no gear or points allocated. The core design of the game makes that apparent.

You can progress without rare or unique helmets through every act of the game. But that doesn't count according to TFH because ???? No reason just because. I assert that you could complete all acts of the game while leaving two passive points open. But that doesn't count as optional to TFH because ????? No reason just because. TFH says that I lack an understanding of what core means, and it amuses him. Well TFH can't explain explain his definition of core. He apparently just knows that ascendancy points aren't in there but other examples are but he can't explain why. Why not? I assert he can't because he is just making it all up.

"You can progress without rare or unique helmets through every act of the game. But that doesn't count according to TFH because ???? No reason just because. I assert that you could complete all acts of the game while leaving two passive points open. But that doesn't count as optional to TFH because ????? No reason just because. TFH says that I lack an understanding of what core means, and it amuses him. Well TFH can't explain explain his definition of core. He apparently just knows that ascendancy points aren't in there but other examples are but he can't explain why. Why not? I assert he can't because he is just making it all up."

Where did i say that ? Oh wait, you took things out of context without reading again and twisted them because you cant fucking read what im saying. I said you need gear and skill points to progress, i didnt say what gear or how many. You have a minimum set requirement of what you can and cant do without gear or skill points before being stone walled by instantly dying and being unable to progress. The game is literally balanced around the aspect of having both, unlike Ascendancy points where there is no aspect of the game that requires having them.

Also love how youre still ignoring all the facts with shitty derailing statements.

Seriously, you wonder why no one takes your arguments seriously when you dont even take two minutes to even attempt to comprehend whats being said to you.

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

"You can progress without rare or unique helmets through every act of the game. But that doesn't count according to TFH because ???? No reason just because. I assert that you could complete all acts of the game while leaving two passive points open. But that doesn't count as optional to TFH because ????? No reason just because. TFH says that I lack an understanding of what core means, and it amuses him. Well TFH can't explain explain his definition of core. He apparently just knows that ascendancy points aren't in there but other examples are but he can't explain why. Why not? I assert he can't because he is just making it all up."

Where did i say that ? Oh wait, you took things out of context without reading again and twisted them because you cant fucking read what im saying. I said you need gear and skill points to progress, i didnt say what gear or how many. You have a minimum set requirement of what you can and cant do without gear or skill points before being stone walled by instantly dying and being unable to progress. The game is literally balanced around the aspect of having both, unlike Ascendancy points where there is no aspect of the game that requires having them.

Also love how youre still ignoring all the facts with shitty derailing statements.

Seriously, you wonder why no one takes your arguments seriously when you dont even take two minutes to even attempt to comprehend whats being said to you.

Sorry, you're not making sense. If ascendancy points are optional then it seems you are here saying that unique helms are optional, rare helms are optional and using all passive skill points are optional. Doesn't that then lead to the conclusion that almost everything in PoE optional? and if so by your definition of optional, it seems that your definition of optional is useless?