OP mechanics: cast on crit, vaal pact, surgeon flasks [2 boss, vuln Vaal Temple DEATHLESS]

Its surprising that you dont know what happened to CoC after shutter chuck build of tom94. Cast on crit almost no place to fit in meta since then. CoC's occurance interval multiplied by 5. That means 0.2x dps compared to 1.2

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MatrixFactor wrote:

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nait2k4 wrote:

This raises an interesting opportunity to set some basic benchmarks for the community to look at when trying to decide whether a skill is OP, Balanced, or Working As Intended.

Well here's a video of a CI reaver doing p2 of core malachai with almost entirely mirrored gear, one of his rings isn't mirrored but it has T1 Phys, Wed, and Accu. Reaver 2:02.

Here's a video of me doing p2 in 2:28 CoC discharger 2:28.

My entire gear is worth about 1/2 of his dagger (well it would be if my voll's wasn't +1 curse). Yet I have almost the same EHP as him (15% less), and almost the same single target damage as him (15-20% less) with him using conc effect. Overall his gear is worth over 1k exa, over 10x what mine is.

In terms of effectiveness per cost, it's a complete joke. I think that is a good way to measure over-poweredness.

I respect your point, I just have a different point of view of what the measuring stick and end result could be.

You're using a very complex set of mechanics that are individually working as intended, in a very intricate manner, to achieve your results.

It's a Hybrid Life and ES Witch using an almost free mana cost Melee Skill buffed with crit chance and a specially modded hits can't be evaded dagger to proc free spells via jewellery that reduces skill mana cost which are in turn buffed with high spell crit chance and damage which are socketed into a chest that provides free power charges on critical strikes that further buff crit strike chance as well as spell damage which are then converted via another piece of jewellery into defensive endurance charges that provide survivability while further buffing spell damage while mitigating incoming damage and providing protection from physical damage-spikes through powering an Immortal Call spell socketed into a trigger gem all while using those critical strikes to maintain charges in your flasks that provide increased APS to your melee skill as well as damage mitigation of both incoming elemental and physical damage which gives time for your spell damage buffed leech to refresh your energy shield via an instant application keystone passive and a leech conversion keystone passive.

There are so many facets to this one build that simply saying just 3 of them are broken does it a disservice.

I'm not saying there aren't things that need to change, just that I don't think that these 3 individual elements are the key problems, when individually they provide significant benefit to a wide variety of builds that do not use the above (or similar) combination of mechanics.

Synergy stronk
collateral damage op

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nait2k4 wrote:

It's a Hybrid Life and ES Witch using an almost free mana cost Melee Skill buffed with crit chance and a specially modded hits can't be evaded dagger to proc free spells via jewellery that reduces skill mana cost which are in turn buffed with high spell crit chance and damage which are socketed into a chest that provides free power charges on critical strikes that further buff crit strike chance as well as spell damage which are then converted via another piece of jewellery into defensive endurance charges that provide survivability while further buffing spell damage while mitigating incoming damage and providing protection from physical damage-spikes through powering an Immortal Call spell socketed into a trigger gem all while using those critical strikes to maintain charges in your flasks that provide increased APS to your melee skill as well as damage mitigation of both incoming elemental and physical damage which gives time for your spell damage buffed leech to refresh your energy shield via an instant application keystone passive and a leech conversion keystone passive.

Well IMO these are the most OP mechanics of this build. And hammering some of them down would bring the rest of the build down into line with a multiplicative effect.

Without surgeon's granite I would have 11k armor a few times, and not for hard bosses. With surgeon's I have 11k armor permanently. Same with 88/92 resist. Take that away and the other mechanics aren't as strong, as you said, it wouldn't give vaal pact enough of a buffer to releech without these effects.

Likewise, if both voll's were changed to 25-30% chances to gain a charge, that would solve some issues with damage, but then Romira's would have to be addressed as well. It would let everything besides CoC discharge work fine, maybe self-cast discharge would be hurt, but that's a niche build already.

If I didn't have vaal pact my build simply wouldn't work. My leech rate would be 20% of 5k = 1k, which wouldn't be enough to out-tank any damage with the relatively low mitigation I have. No leech is a very hard mod for my build. With vaal pact my leech rate is 6k ES/sec single target, and probably 20-50k ES/sec multi-target. Thru vaal pact we basically allow damage to increase both clearspeed and survivability as long as we don't get one-shot.

New expansion make build cast on crit easier and stronger, if we take a look at present cast on crit with fastest clear speed and boss kill new changes make it better.

I didn't see any changes to make crit harder or lesser crit damage, that mean non crit will even less popular and less usable.

I think it's bad idea to buff Synergy build (Mjölner; cast on crit; others) and not buff non crit (RT). It's GGGs game, so we can't change their opinion.

So I finally looked at your video. Nice, but constant flask spam to make up for poor defense. This is not what I would choose to get to 100; and if your suggestions to nerf both Volls to 25% go through, people just won't play CoC cyclone. Don't get me wrong, GGG love that kind of 'meta change' - which is really just obliterating a certain approach.

Cyclone CoC is nowhere near the most played build to 100; so I'm curious why you think this, of all builds, needing vagan dagger, Volls devotion, Voll's chest, preferably 6l, ideally +1 gems etc etc... is somehow the thing that will break the game if it's not changed tomorrow. You say your build costs half what the dagger of some builds cost; some builds getting to 100 cost a fraction of yours and kill single targets way, way, way faster.

Edit: if there's any spelling mistakes, blame the stupid Mac i typed this on. Autocorrect stinks.

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Ashen_Shugar_IV wrote:

Synergy strong
collateral damage op

In 2.1 - even more stronger, in 2.2 just breaking game OP.

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Rupenus wrote:

Its surprising that you dont know what happened to CoC after shutter chuck build of tom94. Cast on crit almost no place to fit in meta since then. CoC's occurance interval multiplied by 5. That means 0.2x dps compared to 1.2

It's actually a shit build; Like it still works I was able to mimic it in standard but took like 5 pieces of mirror gear to be decent compared to other high tier classes using the same value of gear. Any form of CoC still works just to the fucking point where it's super god tier like some of these people are exaggerating.

Don't touch my CoC wand witch. i'll kill you

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davidnn5 wrote:

So I finally looked at your video. Nice, but constant flask spam to make up for poor defense. This is not what I would choose to get to 100; and if your suggestions to nerf both Volls to 25% go through, people just won't play CoC cyclone. Don't get me wrong, GGG love that kind of 'meta change' - which is really just obliterating a certain approach.

It's not constant flask spam. They're surgeons flasks and they're meant to be used all the time. I use them before engaging any pack in any 75+ map.

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Cyclone CoC is nowhere near the most played build to 100; so I'm curious why you think this, of all builds, needing vagan dagger, Volls devotion, Voll's chest, preferably 6l, ideally +1 gems etc etc... is somehow the thing that will break the game if it's not changed tomorrow. You say your build costs half what the dagger of some builds cost; some builds getting to 100 cost a fraction of yours and kill single targets way, way, way faster.

Edit: if there's any spelling mistakes, blame the stupid Mac i typed this on. Autocorrect stinks.

Multimoded Vagan dagger = 4ex, Devo 20ex depending on how early you buy the cards, 5L volls 1ex-6L voll 15ex, rest of gear 5-10ex. 26-45ex.

26ex is around how much you need to gear up SRS or PA with a 6L +3 to make it uber viable.

And if there's a 100-viable build with better clearspeed than coc discharge and significantly cheaper than 40ex, let's see it. If you mention SRS or Scold VMS I'm going to laugh.