Yet you still say you can't see how it's a bad mechanic, when its sole function is to limit build diversity.
By that logic the fact that you can die is a bad mechanic.
It is true that reflect limits the viable builds even more, but in the end its impossible for you to die to reflect if you play cautiously. If you take it slow you will notice a reflect pack before actually attacking it, but thats not what most people do since they love fast paced gameplay.
But if you love it to move and attack fast and by doing so make it harder to avoid getting killed by reflect damage, how is that the games fault and not your own? After all there wouldnt be any build diversity if reflect didnt exist since everybody would stack crit multiplier since nothing can compare to its damage. I dont really see how that would solve anything.
Last edited by nynyny#3398 on Jun 27, 2013, 7:43:29 AM
What youre asking for is that the devs remove all the effort so you can collect the items without having to invest anything.
I thought killing the monsters was the effort. Your logic fails because its not at all hard to stack magic find, thats the whole point. Its boring and it kills the builds that can't stack magic find effectively.
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nynyny wrote:
If a person invests more time he deserves it to get more, and if you cant be bothered to play a build that is focused in IIR/IIQ youre in no position to whine about how unfair the mechanic is.
Now your making assumptions. When did I ever say that I don't have a designated magic find character? I do have one and thats the only one that I ever want to play because the game feels much more pointless if I'm playing anything else.
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nynyny wrote:
If the game was only interesting to people who play 12+ hours a day there would probably be a playerbase of 100. Look around, how many people do you think play this game? Pretty sure its more than that. So its current state is far from not appealing to people like yourself. What needs to be fixed is how Wondertraps work, not giving every player more items.
I'm starting to see why you get into arguments with people so frequently. Again I never said anything of the sort that the game wasn't interesting. What I said was is the game only interested in being balanced for people who play all day long/exploit/RMT or does the game also care about people who can't no life it and play legitimate. I brought this up because I saw the suggestion that the game is fine because there are people swimming in exalts over in (I think it was onslaught). That doesn't automatically mean that the game is fine just because theres rich people who no life the game.
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nynyny wrote:
You cant invest more time then put up with having to play something you dislike if you want a shit ton of currency or simply use your time more efficiently. To make compromises is what life is about, why remove it from games? Because you dislike it?
Acutally if you read everything I put in this thread you would see that I realize the devs would never remove magic find so what I would like to see is a better balance. Reduce its usefulness, give it more diminishing returns. Or any other good ideas to make it less mandatory.
Standard Forever
Last edited by iamstryker#5952 on Jun 27, 2013, 7:42:22 AM
Now your making assumptions. When did I ever say that I don't have a designated magic find character? I do have one and thats the only one that I ever want to play because the game feels much more pointless if I'm playing anything else.
It was pointed at the whole playerbase, not you in particular.
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iamstryker wrote:
I'm starting to see why you get into arguments with people so frequently. Again I never said anything of the sort that the game wasn't interesting. What I said was is the game only interested in being balanced for people who play all day long/exploit/RMT or does the game also care about people who can't no life it and play legitimate. I brought this up because I saw the suggestion that the game is fine because there are people swimming in exalts over in (I think it was onslaught). That doesn't automatically mean that the game is fine just because theres rich people who no life the game.
How do you define balance? How is the game not fine in its current state? Because not everybody can afford any piece of gear they so desire? The game is balanced for people who play a couple hours a day, but those people simply cant accept that they arent handed the full content.
Its the same thing over and over again. People who cant invest time want more than the game offers because they "have a life/work". The developers now make the content more accessible but also want the "hardcore" crowd to be happy so they add some specific stuff for them. Guess what the casual playerbase will cry for next? Exactly, the stuff they cant get due to not having enough time. A cycle that never ends.
Last edited by nynyny#3398 on Jun 27, 2013, 7:59:01 AM
Its the same thing over and over again. People who cant invest time want more than the game offers because they "have a life/work". The developers now make the content more accessible but also want the "hardcore" crowd to be happy so they add some specific stuff for them. Guess what the casual playerbase will cry for next? Exactly, the stuff they cant get due to not having enough time. A cycle that never ends.
I really understand your fears here but honestly thats not at all what I am suggesting. I really think magic find can be reduced to make the game more interesting for builds that can't stack a bunch of magic find. As we all know using little to no magic find yields a terrible amount of rares/currency/uniques. Its not very fun, especially for those who play solo.
I've accepted that the game is far more rewarding for those who have A LOT more time to play, oh well. However I do have a problem with magic find being so important that low magic find builds get screwed over.
You avoided the main point of your own shitty post while focusing on a single word. Maybe I just misworded my sentence? Never came to your mind that not everybody on this forum in a native english speaker did it?
If you ask me, it is impossible to one shot yourself with Vaals Pact while using multiple projectiles. Then again, I never specified how much ES you need. When I say that its nearly impossible to one shot yourself I am taking people like yourself into consideration, people who would run around with maxed resistances but 2000ES. In that case you might still be able to die, depending how big your hits are. It is impossible when running end game gear though (which is only taking into consideration the builds I know since I have no idea if you can actually hit for 150000 and really cant be bothered trying to find out), but thats not what you were assuming anyway since you seem to think Vaals Pact is a mid game node.
Keep talking shit.
When did I ever run around with 2000ES? Where did I ever say I did this? Even my discharger (with Voll's as chest obviously) has 3.3kES with a shitty (low ES) shield.
She's running at 50k+ average damage per discharge. It can spike a lot higher. She cares not about reflect.
I know how these mechanics work, I have to or I will kill myself. Vaal Pact (not "Vaals") is taken when it is needed, depending on build, not some arbitrary milestone you assign.
All you do is prove more about how little you understand.
Keep grasping at straws and know that you will always lose.
Last edited by Herpy_Derpleson#6025 on Jun 27, 2013, 8:09:54 AM
Its the same thing over and over again. People who cant invest time want more than the game offers because they "have a life/work". The developers now make the content more accessible but also want the "hardcore" crowd to be happy so they add some specific stuff for them. Guess what the casual playerbase will cry for next? Exactly, the stuff they cant get due to not having enough time. A cycle that never ends.
I really understand your fears here but honestly thats not at all what I am suggesting. I really think magic find can be reduced to make the game more interesting for builds that can't stack a bunch of magic find. As we all know using little to no magic find yields a terrible amount of rares/currency/uniques. Its not very fun, especially for those who play solo.
I've accepted that the game is far more rewarding for those who have A LOT more time to play, oh well. However I do have a problem with magic find being so important that low magic find builds get screwed over.
If you want magic find you have to trade it for either damage or survivability, simple as that. What they could do is implement IIR/IIQ nodes in the tree. Getting those would automatically nerf your survivability and damage output from talents, but you could still run normal gear and wouldnt have to find decent IIR/IIQ items. In all honesty, I would even support such a change as long as the nodes are hard to reach and make you go out of your way.
Last edited by nynyny#3398 on Jun 27, 2013, 8:08:15 AM
Keep talking shit.
When did I ever run around with 2000ES? Where did I ever say I did this? Even my discharger (with Voll's as chest obviously) has 3.3kES with a shitty (low ES) shield.
She's running at 50k+ average damage per discharge. It can spike a lot higher. She cares not about reflect.
I know how these mechanics work, I have to or I will kill myself. Vaal Pact (not "Vaals") is taken when it is needed, depending on build, not some arbitrary milestone you assign.
All you do is prove more about how little you understand.
Keep grasping at straws and know that you will always lose.
Obviously, right?
Besides, why are you bringing up Discharge? Last time I checked its not a multi projectile attack and I ruled it out in my very first post.
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Herpy_Derpleson wrote:
And as for damage... you ignore most of the equation. If you have very low max life and resistances, you will 1-hit yourself much easier. We are talking about how it works, not "I'm lvl 80 with over 9000ES and I do weak damage so it doesn't matter".
So.. what is very low? I would say 2000 is, hell even 3000 is. By my standards even 6000 is too low.
Last edited by nynyny#3398 on Jun 27, 2013, 8:12:51 AM
You know some people literally CAN'T invest more time into the game. We all aren't kids who have nothing at all better to do. Don't you think the game should feel fun to everyone and not just no lifers?
I don't get the point. How your fun is related of how much time you play ? Do you have more fun if you play more ?
If you want magic find you have to trade it for either damage or survivability, simple as that. What they could do is implement IIR/IIQ nodes in the tree. Getting those would automatically nerf your survivability and damage output from talents, but you could still run normal gear and wouldnt have to find decent IIR/IIQ items. In all honesty, I would even support such a change as long as the nodes are hard to reach and make you go out of your way.
I understand what magic find is supposed to do but I don't think it succeeds. This is because
A) You don't have to trade damage for survivability if you choose an easy magic find build which most players do. Doesn't that defeat the point?
B) I also think that the game is still overly harsh for not having a ton of magic find. If your not rich then getting high MF on a regular build is very very expensive. Players can't use basic magic find gear because it gimps them too much and they will die. As a consequence to this they get rewarded with junk, kill a boss and get no rares at all...
I don't know if magic find passives would help or not but its an idea to explore.
You know some people literally CAN'T invest more time into the game. We all aren't kids who have nothing at all better to do. Don't you think the game should feel fun to everyone and not just no lifers?
I don't get the point. How your fun is related of how much time you play ? Do you have more fun if you play more ?
You should simply ignore that comment because its so full of flaws that analyzing it really is a waste of time. The whole "hurrdurr I have a life you dont" debate never made any sense.
