When people say PoE has no competition...

IMO Poe is not the BEST by far. THE WAY of arpgs... its not that much better as d3. Serious. its different.



poe has some real good stuff but it has it bad stuff too.

The skill tree and build diversity is only a illusion. Must of the builds are 0815tree..

A lot of different builds are not out there. Some skills are cleary better than other. Every league you get a new favor of the month op skill/meta and the last get nerfed.

The charackter progression feels ok till you trade the first time for your starter gear for maping.
After that nearly everything comes down to grind currency. And buy your new hero progress with new gear. If you play ssf. Its come down to grind currency to craft new gear.
If you twink, the new char is more or less done after uberlab and after buying the gear for the new build and level 84 or so.
After some time running maps feels so dumb like running greater rifts or grim dawn crucible.

Its a grind game like other arpgs too. For me. After 1000+ hours in grim dawn, poe, d3, and a lot of hours in d2 and titan quest.
Every arpg had it flaws. its pro and cons. And poe is far away from being the best overall. Grim dawn, d3 and poe are not far from each other for my taste.

I really hope the early-alpha ARPGs catch up to PoE and offer some real competition, but for now, I_NO is right, nothing is remotely competitive.

D3, Torchlight 2, and Grim Dawn all had their day as popular ARPGs (though I'd argue that D3 was never actually good--I would know, I played it at launch for over two months, then again when reaper of souls came out, and again when Greater Rifts were a thing, and tried at least two Seasons since then. It always just becomes differently bad. The core itemization was so awful that it just could never become a good game), but development on them has stopped (GD's most recent expansion is supposedly the last?) so they can never become true competitors.

The others listed by the OP are either too early in development or just kind of jokes to mention.

In 2012 it would've been hard to know how successful PoE would be, but now that we've gotten to this point, I can't see anything catching up with less than 3 years of work and community-building. The only chance PoE has of competition is if Blizzard rehires all of the old Blizzard North to make Diablo 4. And Activision doesn't have the courage nor wisdom nor interest to do anything of the sort.

I would of left poe long ago if you can just bring me something to beat it but there is literally nothing out there like I said in my opinion right now right here.

No competition not even close to it.

"

Johny_Snow wrote:

A new Torchlight is coming however.

It really doesn't feel much like and ARPG tho, at least not to me. :/

Wolcen finally has potential, Last Epoch is still fresh in dev so time will tell, Grim Dawn is apparently jiggling on it's last leg after taking forever to release a lackluster expansion so they're also slating to pump out QoL that barely address how boring the game is, aside from the want to make the game harder at earlier levels (even tho, to be frank, it's only easy when you know exactly what you're doing, like with PoE).

Torchlight / 2 / Frontier is a joke, but at least it's an in-season joke unlike Diablo:iPhone or D4 if they keep dragging it along...


-------------------


OH SHIT! We forgot about Pagan Online! XD
Love the crafting system idea of being able to roll an item multiple times and picking the best outcome : hate the idea of farming crafting mats from breakables...

"

Katalaeia wrote:

"

satanttin wrote:

p2w in a mainly singleplayer game? xD

Here's the devs' post that started the whole "wtf" reaction.

https://www.torchlightfrontiers.com/en/news-article/11014403?fbclid=IwAR0JprVVNp5wu0Gy74GxhaB6n8etzvupEQZedwrSRh6iq19IAX-l_g54lds

A few tidbits:

"

We believe that you should earn your game play rewards through adventuring and killing monsters! However, we understand that some people's time is constrained by real-life responsibilities, so within reason we will allow for limited acceleration of various metrics, like gold, luck, etc. Whenever possible, we think these powers should be shareable with your friends, and will still require that you earn your loot through adventuring.

"

We believe that normal gear, like your armor and primary weapons should be attainable only by adventuring and finding them. That said, we may sell some special items, like specific Relic Weapons. If we do, we will always strive for there to be a reasonable way to attain or craft them through normal gameplay.

Which is then followed by

"

We reject "pay-to-win".

We'll see how it turns out, I guess, but for now it's a hard pass for me.

lol that's so fucking lame. Once p2w creeps in it only escalates and they make it harder and harder to get the good stuff through gameplay. Looks like LoTRO all over again. Wouldn't waste my cat's time on that game.

"

I don't know anything about Titan Quest or Grim Dawn, but all of those others were meant to be single player offline games, that is completely different.

Need examples, you speak of other games but not give any examples.

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derbund666 wrote:

The charackter progression feels ok till you trade the first time for your starter gear for maping.
After that nearly everything comes down to grind currency.

if so try ssf!

"

Kasapnica wrote:

"

I don't know anything about Titan Quest or Grim Dawn, but all of those others were meant to be single player offline games, that is completely different.

Need examples, you speak of other games but not give any examples.

Neverwinter is the only one that comes to mind (Don't pull that "the camera is different" shit). Doesn't change the point though, that there is nothing being given to paying players that free ones can't get.

"

"

Kasapnica wrote:

"

I don't know anything about Titan Quest or Grim Dawn, but all of those others were meant to be single player offline games, that is completely different.

Need examples, you speak of other games but not give any examples.

Neverwinter is the only one that comes to mind (Don't pull that "the camera is different" shit). Doesn't change the point though, that there is nothing being given to paying players that free ones can't get.

The MMO? Man i sure had hope for it, was one of the first to jump in. It was the Crystal system that eventually drove me of from the game, that and the broken AH at the time, absolutely non existent class balance.

This one was a clear P2W game, i have no idea how it fares today in that regard, but back then if you didn't buy crystals and opening boxes, you were royally screwed. Low amount of population, extremely important enchant system and clear bias against anyone who didn't pour money in their character.

It had potential but there is a reason why it is in maintenance mode. The FTP model was bad, and the game had tremendous problems, mostly during the start.

Also it's not an ARPG. Its MMORPG. The difference is massive. It was a western take on Korean FTP model and it drove the game into maintenance mode.

Bad example. So yes, you said ARPGS, and you provide MMORPG. It doesn't work that way. Imagine a trade based ARPG with boosters, how fun does that sound to you? And if it doesn't have trade, then there is no reason to get boosters and that's the moment where the "5 months or 5$" jumps in.

If it's party based content, you will be ridiculed for not investing. And the more the playerbase dwindle, the worse it gets. It was shown by literally EVERY Korean MMO that ever came to the west.

Every
Single
One


You either make your FTP model fair or you are fcked. And Torchlight Frontiers not only seems like a game that has nothing to do with ARPG but it will have boosters.

None of the true successful online games today in the west have P2W in them, none. Don't mistake convenience for P2W.

When it comes to updates, new content added and so on PoE is currently in a league of its own, 'the' popular online arpg game to play.

But despite lack of dev attention people still play D3, heck even D2 remains a thing in 2019. Grim dawn etc and older games. Personally i'd be bored really quick if all i played was PoE, it's still a good game but kinda old looking as well. Poe will likely continue to dominate as long as new leagues don't get boring to quickly( Synth stuff)in the near future(2020-21).

I don't think Last epoch or any known upcoming arpg will have that much of an impact on PoE(but sure anything is possible) competition will mainly come from other genres. The exception is Diablo 4, if Blizzard went back to their darker D2 setting(As rumoured) and hired some knowledgeable arpg devs it could in fact be the next major game to play. If D4 is good PoE is likely going to need some major technical(graphics) updates to compete with it(Which is possible what Wilson is referring to ''next gen arpgs'' with 4.0 update).