Lab is terrible
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I also agree lab is terrible, I wish it did not exist and that there was a different way to get Ascension points.
I however disagree and say lab is easy, with only Uberlab being somewhat challenging because of the small arena and traps in the final fight. Do I fail them occasionally? Sure. Are they hard? No chance. There was a time several years ago when I agree the Uber lab was VERY challenging and seemingly unfair. And posted as such. Nowadays, with the game and power we are at now, it has been mostly trivialized. I have not made a single meta OR non-meta build in the last 2 years that has not been able to do all the labs. |
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Sure, every build can do it, but once again, it's a skill-barrier.
The major point still is to lock main-progression behind mandatory game-play which is completely different from the core-experience. Wanting to get skill from a new-ish player is a bit frustrating for them. The first time real 'skill' is needed is during the Shaper fight after all. Those players already have issues with proceeding towards maps, not to speak of proceeding through maps for one way or the other, making a barrier about one of the most important upgrades behind such a mechanic is very very frustrating then. Once again to point it out. I personally enjoy lab, I run it commonly... well, ran it commonly before butchering my lab-runner in standard, got to re-do him, then I'll once more. Nonetheless the game-design based around it is objectively bad. The subjective part of lab is up to everyone personally. GGG balance is like getting a pizza which is burnt on the sides, raw in the middle and misses the most of the toppings.
Then upon sending it back you get a raw side, burnt middle and enough toppings to drench everything in grease. Everything fixed but still broken. |
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Multiple things make no sense about lab. For example, lore for lab makes no sense. Plus, it makes no sense to gate the core of character definition and progression in an ARPG behind an arcade mini-game, rather than the main game. Why do that? Why not make the main game more engaging and challenging, instead of relying on a mini-game with a separate rule set to try to raise the difficulty when providing access to prestige class skills?
Also, lab is boring. Wandering around in mazes is boring. Traps are boring. Izaro used to be an interesting fight. Now he's just predictable and boring. GGG should give him the title "Izaro the Boring" so they're more honest with others (and themselves) about what a borefest fighting Izaro is these days. Now that prestige classes will finally leave lab in 4.0, will GGG get it right this time or will they find new ways to repeat old mistakes?
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This is what the Labyrinth feels like to me...
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I just came back awhile ago and I was one of the huge anti lab ppl. I have changed my mind on removing lab and instead offer this solution which is quite elegant and satisfies all parties and fits POE theme. This is already happening to some extent as well with carries it just makes it easier and fits orb theme.
Summary is that on Izaro defeat an Ascendancy Orb drops for that difficulty. These would be sellable items each granting 2 ascend points for a total of 4 needed. So all players can still do the lab exactly as it is now. This changes nothing with regards to lab farmers being able to farm lab but it lets lab haters skip the lab entirely and play the content they like and earn currency and use that currency to buy ascendancy. As I am told we have other ways to get lab enchants so lab haters could 100% skip lab and have it not affect lab farmers in any bad way. It would be even better for them as they could prefarm tons of ascendancy orbs and sell them. EVERYONE WINS. Last edited by Prebornfetus#2771 on Apr 10, 2019, 12:39:51 AM
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" nope. lab is fine. get good ppl. Trust your mind and strengthen your abilities!
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" Once again, it's not about 'git gud'. Lab is easy as soon as you have the hang of it. Nonetheless, it's outdated, breaks pacing of the overall game (much like some league mechanics) and is a clear sign of bad design. It's high time to overhaul it completely. Has its place, is fun to run - for some - and offers ok-ish rewards for the invested time. Still, lab is boring and not supposed to be in the way of main progression. New people have major issues with it, some people who are veterans have issues with it, it locks progress behind content which fits more into a jump&run rather then an ARPG. As side-content without a need to go in: Fine. As main-content: Not fine. GGG balance is like getting a pizza which is burnt on the sides, raw in the middle and misses the most of the toppings.
Then upon sending it back you get a raw side, burnt middle and enough toppings to drench everything in grease. Everything fixed but still broken. |
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It's been 3-4 years and people are still complaining about the lab b/c lab sucks. It sucked 3-4 years ago. Since then it's become a lot easier. Still sucks though.
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" Nop, in many (most?) cases, it's about 'git gud', to some extent. Because if people complaining were already 'gud' at it, they would breeze through it in less than 10 mins and would likely not feel the need to come and bitch about it here. About the nonsense "it does not fit arpg content" ... just no, it fits perfectly an "action role playing game", and on top of that, what other arpgs have or lack is completely irrelevant : it fits PoE, period. SSF is not and will never be a standard for balance, it is not for people entitled to getting more without trading.
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Everything in this game I don't like should be changed immediately.
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