Haven't really ever commented on lab, but I hate it.

"

Severance2hBlade wrote:

Can we now stop connecting the fun factor with skill & ability? It's getting old.

It's not, it's probably one of the most relevant things we could discuss about.
People don't complain about things that they have no problem to deal with ( or they say that they find it too easy maybe ).

EDIT : fucking bug, need to retype the biggest part of my message.

"

Severance2hBlade wrote:

- There are many players that haven't died to traps but still don't like the Lab
- Something been trivial has nothing to do with entertainment & fun
- You should include the Human factor to your "conclusions". We are humam beings & not robots. No matter how skillful you are eventually you will make a mistake. Human beings do not have the exact same performance when they execute the same exercise (in this instance playing the Lab) again & again
- You should also include the Internet factor. Skill & ability give their place to Entropy & Luck when you play an Online game
[...]
- Do you believe the Lab content as a whole is fair for a HC player?

- Haven't died to traps yet != being good at avoiding / handling traps.
- It does, if you suck at traps, you will find the experience tedious, chances are it won't be fun ( orsome other players will like the fact that some of the content scares them and that they need to improve )
- This apply to PoE in general :
sometimes, in PoE, you will die : deal with it.
Same goes about the internet connection. It might be a bit higher in the lab, but essentially it's the same, good internet connection are getting available more and more easily to most people.
In PoE in general, when you desync, it's dangerous, some bosses will be as dangerous as the few traps in the lab on desync ( let's say .... desyng on shock and horror and realize that you were actually not behind a pillar during the beam. chances are, you're dead ).

I do believe that HC lab is fair, definitely.
I can't speak for Sid, I think he does too tho.

"

Turtledove wrote:

Traps do not scare me

How long is your average lab run you said ? 40 mins ?
How much of this time is dedicated to going through traps ?
Because the rest is just standard PoE, only with more rewards ( and slightly more interesting areas imo ).

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Severance2hBlade wrote:

I didn't say we shouldn't discuss it..Only that we shouldn't necessarily accuse everyone that dislikes the Lab for been less skillful.

I'm actually still wondering about that to be honest.
There might definitely be other elements that people don't like, but I do think that it's ease of doing and likeness are correlated, a lot.

Many people take that as an insult ( because some people are being rude using that ), and should not I think.

The most power creep moment I find, is after completing the cruel lab, where one can pick one of the very powerful ascendancy keystone, and cruel lab comes more are level 60~65 if built correctly.
Maybe for some specific builds, Scion do have a big powercreep on merciless' completion also.

There are many HC racers, probably doing it over and over again.
Those guys are for most part very good no doubt, but it does mean that with some knowledge, it's not as rippy as some would want to make other believe, at all.

It's like some specific high level bosses, it's better to practise in standard before.

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Casual_Ascent wrote:

I find it all EXTREMELY easy. And also repulsive.
I'm literally fighting my gag reflex while in the lab.

Same question than I asked TurtleDove then :
- How much time for one run ?
- How much of this time is spent dealing with traps ?
If traps are as you said "EXTREMELY easy", it should be take maybe one min of your run ( 2 mins if you are going for silver keys maybe ). And if you are only spending at most 2 mins per run dealing with traps ... then it's not tedious.

"

Casual_Ascent wrote:

I'm literally fighting my gag reflex while in the lab.

Lol, +100 :D

Ok, let's discuss how fair traps are from a hardcore perspective. True story: I was in the lab and encountered a passageway where just a single trap was rotating and i had to go through it in order to proceed. I was at the spot in which the trap changes direction when it arrives and the trap was coming towards me. Now, one small lagspike as i was passing the trap while walking caused me to stand still, tank the trap while coming towards me and a little bit as it changed direction, i don't think it was more than a second. That second caused me to drop <20% hp. If i had that lagspike in one of the rotating traps gauntlets where more than one of them converge, i would absolutely be dead.

So, now you are gonna say, why not use a movement skill? You can jump from one safe platform to another and not die! That's skill right? What kind of skill though? One that fits an arpg or mario? Walking through a level and jumping from platform to platform when they are "Green lit" and safe. What do you think this argument is about, difficulty?



All done in hardcore. I am a pro mario player. I don't want that in my PoE though. If i wanted to play Mario i would. That's not why i am here.

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Casual_Ascent wrote:

[...]

You did not answer my second question =(.
The actual parts where one has to go through traps is very short, if it's extremely easy, then it's very fast.
Then it's not just the traps that you don't like, maybe you don't like looking for something inside a level, idk ( do you dislike lodstone finding Zana missions ? ).

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Pyrokar wrote:

[..]

Always play with the latency onverlay on.
When you are in a situation where it could be dangerous, and possibly lethal ( that seems really ovious to me for people playing HC, like really ), flask.
This is one of the basic of HC, really, if a lag spike might endanger you, FLASK, if it keeps going like this, log out.
I would not play lab HC if I know that my provider is not operational.

But as I said, some high level bosses are like this too, this is not just specific to the traps.

Btw if you are fighting the villa boss and jump out of the traps not to take damage, are you playing Mario ?
lol ... see how that's silly now ? It's essentialy the same thing.

"

Fruz wrote:

Always play with the latency onverlay on.
When you are in a situation where it could be dangerous, and possibly lethal ( that seems really ovious to me for people playing HC, like really ), flask.
This is one of the basic of HC, really, if a lag spike might endanger you, FLASK, if it keeps going like this, log out.
I would not play lab HC if I know that my provider is not operational.

But as I said, some high level bosses are like this too, this is not just specific to the traps.

Btw if you are fighting the villa boss and jump out of the traps not to take damage, are you playing Mario ?
lol ... see how that's silly now ? It's essentialy the same thing.

Are you fucking serious right now? I was farming merciless lab for enchants. I had one single lagspike in 2 hours of lab playstyle. I have a 95 hc char i know the basics what the actual fuck. I can make a char that tanks the villa boss while i order a pizza, wait for it to come, answer the door, pay the guy, eat the pizza, have diarhhea because of the pizza, come back and see that i am still tanking the boss. That's an arpg. Holy fucking shit.

Edit: From a softcore perspective, so that you can understand. I can make a char that comes into the boss room and one shots the boss. Where are your traps now? ARPG style bro. A FUCKING R FREAKING PG STYLE

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Casual_Ascent wrote:

I answered: The only time I ever looked, it took 20 minutes. It felt like 2 hours.

I have no idea how much of that time was spent dealing with traps. Not much.

Most of the time is spent looking around trying to find the correct ways out. Not 'difficult' but boring and tedious.

So that's not the trap part, but the kinda labyrinthic aspect of it that you dislike, fair enough, that's much easier to understand to me.

Not much GGG would do in that case, it's a labyrinth after all.

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Pyrokar wrote:

Are you fucking serious right now? I was farming merciless lab for enchants. I had one single lagspike in 2 hours of lab playstyle. I have a 95 hc char i know the basics what the actual fuck

How could you drop down to 20% if you did pop a life flask when you noticed the spike ? Oo
Of course sometmes ( or often for some ) the spikes just come out very unexpected.
You can keep your swearing for yourself you know, this is an internet forum related to a video game ....
I don't care if you can tank the Villa boss, that's not the point.
GGG does NOT want the whole game to be facetanked :

deal with it.