Sheer Frustration: 27 5L's later, no 6L...... Yes, Twenty-fucking-Seven 5L's.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

Spoiler

So what you're telling me is you want to go from...
A1. throwing Fusings at an item in your stash, getting all kinds of wacky random results until you hit 5L/6L
A2. if you hit 5L you sell it, which is just fine because it gives you more fuel for later
...to...
B1. throwing Fusings at an item not necessarily in your stash, getting absolutely zero results — as in, the orb vaporizes and literally nothing changed — until you hit 5L/6L
B2. if you hit 5L you don't have to sell it, but you don't you're being foolish because you can still get a 6L off of a 4L (or worse) so why would you not sell a valuable 5L and replace it with a less-linked piece to work on?

I mean, as far as I'm concerned, your "solution" changes nothing which actually matters. If anything, it turns Jewelers and Fusing use into more of a tedium, because instead of simply having nothing relevant happening, you have literally nothing happening, which is even more of a surreal self-flagellation. Given that wince-worthy drawback and no benefit which actually matters, I'll pass.

My example started with a 4S 3L, not necessarily in stash. Nowhere did I mention selling anything. Aren't we talking about the process of socketing/linking?

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

B1. throwing Fusings at an item not necessarily in your stash, getting absolutely zero results — as in, the orb vaporizes and literally nothing changed — until you hit 5L/6L

Yes, so that, in theory, one could actually use the item being rolled the entire time, while chancing for an improvement. Would you rather go from a 4L to a 2L to a no link to a 3L to a no link to a 4L, or just have a 4L the whole time and not be pushed to spend more Fusings to get back to status quo upon a downgrade? If the item is in your stash, there would be little reason to care. If you are trying to use the item, you probably care.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

B2. if you hit 5L you don't have to sell it, but you don't you're being foolish because you can still get a 6L off of a 4L (or worse) so why would you not sell a valuable 5L and replace it with a less-linked piece to work on?

Maybe you like and/or are using the item that is now 5L? Maybe you would rather use it and try to 6L it than sell it and trade for a replacement item.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

I mean, as far as I'm concerned, your "solution" changes nothing which actually matters. If anything, it turns Jewelers and Fusing use into more of a tedium, because instead of simply having nothing relevant happening, you have literally nothing happening, which is even more of a surreal self-flagellation. Given that wince-worthy drawback and no benefit which actually matters, I'll pass.

I never claimed that my idea was a "solution", and what is it that "actually matters" then? One aspect of the socketing/linking process that bothers me, and hopefully others, is spending one Jeweler's/Fusing, being faced with a downgrade, and having to spend a significant amount of Jeweler's/Fusings just to get back to where one started. Would you rather be able to have "nothing happen" on your 5S 5L or have "something relevant happen" as in "you now have a 5S 3L" or "you now have a 3S 2L"? At some point (generally after the 4L stage) "something relevant happening" equates to "a downgrade happening" most of the time. My "solution" could provide an avenue to bypass potential downgrades while rolling for more sockets/links. The drawback might be higher cost, but the benefit is saving socket/link progress (AKA seeing nothing happen unless upgrade or equivalent), which actually could make getting a new socket/link more meaningful than it currently is. A nice side effect of a "nothing happens unless upgrade" mechanic could be that Jeweler's/Fusings no longer have to be mutually exclusive. For example, you have a 5S 4L, you can save your progress and chance for more sockets OR more links, it doesn't matter which you go for; you could even toggle back and forth so long as you are doing the thing that forces "nothing to happen unless upgrade".

First thing I am practically noob/casual player (around 2 hour a day) so excuse me if my opinion is noobish.

But for me it is interesting that nobody mentioned that number of fusing orbs in game is practically infinite, after all you can buy them from vendor so to have small chance to get something from thing that you theoretically can have in infinite amount (in contrast to exalted orb that are drop only so you always have fixed number of them in "world") shouldn't be something that should give that much rage.

Also I would like to know if there is iLevel requirement for number of links on item, we know that item must be iLevel 50 to have 6S, so is there level requirement for 6L?

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Boksa wrote:

First thing I am practically noob/casual player (around 2 hour a day) so excuse me if my opinion is noobish.

But for me it is interesting that nobody mentioned that number of fusing orbs in game is practically infinite, after all you can buy them from vendor so to have small chance to get something from thing that you theoretically can have in infinite amount (in contrast to exalted orb that are drop only so you always have fixed number of them in "world") shouldn't be something that should give that much rage.

Also I would like to know if there is iLevel requirement for number of links on item, we know that item must be iLevel 50 to have 6S, so is there level requirement for 6L?

But...the time you need to get 3000 fuses...

On a happier note, making a 5L from a white using full armor scraps every time has been working great for me lately.

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iamstryker wrote:

On a happier note, making a 5L from a white using full armor scraps every time has been working great for me lately.

What are the odds?

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Perfect_Black wrote:

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

B2. if you hit 5L you don't have to sell it, but you don't you're being foolish because you can still get a 6L off of a 4L (or worse) so why would you not sell a valuable 5L and replace it with a less-linked piece to work on?

Maybe you like and/or are using the item that is now 5L? Maybe you would rather use it and try to 6L it than sell it and trade for a replacement item.

[Removed by Support] Trade is part of the game, and as a result it's just wasteful to squander resources out of some kind of sentimentality for a collection of pixels. Instead of being overly attached to a particular piece of gear just because you happen to have been wearing it in the past, you should be evaluating each item on its actual merits and making frugal, rational choices.

What you want is bad choices to be incentivized more to the point where they're not bad choices anymore. What I want is for Fusings to offer more meaningful choices, which requires offering a more diverse and truly variable array of results. 6 results is simply too small of a result pool.

@ScrotieMcB: I don't see how wanting to add sockets/links to an item one likes and the game facilitating that happening incentivizes "bad choices". Also, I don't see how incentivizing a bad choice makes a choice any less bad, it just entices making the choice. Also, we are not talking about trading or what choices are most resourceful for players to make in order to maximize wealth; we are talking about the process to 6L, the journey. Right now, that journey is very painful, composed of hoarding, Hail Mary quick-burning, and massive waste, generally leading to rage and a feeling of being punished that disincentivizes using Fusings for anything beyond a 4L unless one has a large Fusing safety net, not to mention the widely accepted "only use Fusings on items that you are not using" philosophy. Fail design - incomplete design - sadistic design (imo).

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Fail design

-false

"

incomplete design

-false

"

sadistic design

-true
You expected to suffer and it is working as intended. Suck it up or don't fuse anything or whatever.

Maybe your theories on game design differ from mine, but I consider sadistic design to be an automatic fail.

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Stas88 wrote:

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Perfect_Black wrote:

Fail design

-false

I'll admit, it's not a complete fail, but it is damn sure not elegant or enjoyable.

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Stas88 wrote:

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Perfect_Black wrote:

incomplete design

-false

The fact that Chris has mentioned changes to the system seems to support my theory of incomplete design.

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Stas88 wrote:

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Perfect_Black wrote:

sadistic design

-true
You expected to suffer and it is working as intended. Suck it up or don't fuse anything or whatever.

Actually, no, I didn't expect to suffer.