Remove MF completely from game

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

When you need to stack MF in order to run maps, because otherwise your loot-per-map is too low to make them worthwhile, the solution is to fix both MF and maps, not to leave them both alone.

Or just stop wasting currency on map rolling. It doesn't have to be maze with champions, really.

[edit] So here's my counter argument, remove maze and champions from map affix pool, all problems solved. Legacy maps a non-issue due to being consumable. Stop wasting currency on maps = more profit from maps.

What about area larger and pack size map affixes?

Edit: hardcore legacy items are a non-issue as well, as they will be sooner or later removed from the economy.

I don't know why people keep saying that to get high magic find you have to gimp yourself. The best MF builds are just as fast and generally a hell of a lot safer than your standard character. Removing magic find won't make dual spork any less powerful but a buff to base MF rates will make a plethora of other builds viable for farming too.

I JUST DON'T SEE HOW THIS IS A BAD THING

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lukeiy wrote:

I don't know why people keep saying that to get high magic find you have to gimp yourself. The best MF builds are just as fast and generally a hell of a lot safer than your standard character. Removing magic find won't make dual spork any less powerful but a buff to base MF rates will make a plethora of other builds viable for farming too.

I JUST DON'T SEE HOW THIS IS A BAD THING

Magic Find builds are an awesome thing. Other builds are currently not. That's what the whole topic is about.

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Daefecator wrote:

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lukeiy wrote:

I don't know why people keep saying that to get high magic find you have to gimp yourself. The best MF builds are just as fast and generally a hell of a lot safer than your standard character. Removing magic find won't make dual spork any less powerful but a buff to base MF rates will make a plethora of other builds viable for farming too.

I JUST DON'T SEE HOW THIS IS A BAD THING

Magic Find builds are an awesome thing. Other builds are currently not. That's what the whole topic is about.

Other builds are currently not because the loot drop rates have to be balanced and are balanced around MF builds. The only awesome thing about MF builds is that they get five times more loot than other builds with the same amount of effort. I don't even know what the point of your statement was...

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Arhadon wrote:

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Hovergame wrote:

you'll pay in a field of characteristic one (you can ask to Yuri Manin about what they are, he's in Grenoble - France atm, as I am).

AGAIN you show that you are extremely knowledgeable in abstract algebra. But lets take a look into it.

A field of characteristic n means that sum of n ones equals to zero. (1+1+...<n times>...+1=0)
You are talking about a field of characteristic one. So just 1 = 0. Just for you know, set with an equality 1 = 0 is not even considered a domain.

To sum up: you tell me about field that actually is not field and offer me to ask famous Russian mathematician about it. Nice try!

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Hovergame wrote:

If you're as clueless in the game as you are in mathematics...

How can you even say that, if you fail so hard in maths yourself?

OFF-TOPIC !!!!!!

Boy, if you don't understand why I pointed Yuri Manin, please don't answer :) He gave us a lecture, 2 days ago, in Grenoble about numbers as functions, and he gave a first definition of F_1, what he's calling "a field of characteristic one" and hope to be able to resolve RH. Check this if you don't believe me.

Then, my dear boy, EPIC FAIL :) Of course what he consider isn't a field, his definition is just the group of all the roots of unity and zero (wich is just a monoid). The analogy with the fields is simple : any algebraic extension of a finite field of characteristic p is just a collection of roots of unity but without any p-th root of unity (since the frobenius is a bijection) and he tries to get the "limit" as the characteristic tends to one. And when you study the projective spaces associated, you're studying a construction really close of an algebraic closure of a finite field.

Next time, don't talk about math please. Ah, and you're definition isn't perfect. The correct definiion is : for any ring A there is an unique morphism f between from Z to A (sending 1 to the identity element for the multiplication of A). There exists n in N such that Ker(f) = nZ and the characteristic is that n.


END OF OFF-TOPIC !!!!!!


Sorry for talking about math. MF isn't required to run map. You don't have to spend several chaos per map to make them worthwile. Many players are playing without MF without any problem.

Again, the problem usualy lies between the keyboard and the chair.


Edit

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The only awesome thing about MF builds is that they get five times more loot than other builds with the same amount of effort. I don't even know what the point of your statement was...

Don't throw random numbers please. They will NEVER DROP (I said DROP) five times more currencies. Imho, I wonder if they even DROP more currency/time at all. Then we have rares and uniques, and most of them are just trash if you are in a lower level area. But, again, we have the "pros" like you telling us how they farm as fast as anybody else (which isn't true, a LA ranger will clean the map faster, a discharage will clean it faster too), in areas around their level (which is also usually false) and whine about "balancing" the loots.

They get more loot/time ? COOL ! I level A LOT faster. Yes I do.

Not everyone plays the same and magic find is good enough to make many players gravitate towards stacking it high on an easy to farm characters which makes the not so easy to farm characters loot really unappealing.

This doesn't mean that low mf characters can't adequalty farm. It just means that magic find is too appealing for certain players because of the huge differnce it makes in a short period of time without being required to jet through maps/areas at lightning speed.

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Hovergame wrote:

Don't throw random numbers please. They will NEVER DROP (I said DROP) five times more currencies. Imho, I wonder if they even DROP more currency/time at all. Then we have rares and uniques, and most of them are just trash if you are in a lower level area. But, again, we have the "pros" like you telling us how they farm as fast as anybody else (which isn't true, a LA ranger will clean the map faster, a discharage will clean it faster too), in areas around their level (which is also usually false) and whine about "balancing" the loots.

They get more loot/time ? COOL ! I level A LOT faster. Yes I do.

What level are you, 81? I would like to read your comment as soon as you hit at least 87 please. This is the exact point when even 68-69 maps start to give negligible amounts of experience, and you will see that even sustaining 70's maps is an issue for soloing without stacked Magic Find.

From the way your posts look like, it seems there is something wrong with either your shift or caps lock button, can you confirm they are ok? By the way, you've already shown us that you are an overly educated person, and now you are arguing about Magic Find to not affect any currency drop at all in your opinion?

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Hovergame wrote:

Don't throw random numbers please. They will NEVER DROP (I said DROP) five times more currencies. Imho, I wonder if they even DROP more currency/time at all. Then we have rares and uniques, and most of them are just trash if you are in a lower level area. But, again, we have the "pros" like you telling us how they farm as fast as anybody else (which isn't true, a LA ranger will clean the map faster, a discharage will clean it faster too), in areas around their level (which is also usually false) and whine about "balancing" the loots.

They get more loot/time ? COOL ! I level A LOT faster. Yes I do.

You are correct. No Mf --> higher clear speed and faster leveling. I can just speak out of my own experience (elts take luanris 3):

Mf dual claw: 6k dmg, 250/50 mf. Clear speed was alright, due good crit chance and high crit multiplier. Per luanris run (no piety) i got nearly 2 full inventories of rares. Every day i dropped at least 1 low lvl unique, sometimes more.

I change my build from mf to full dmg cause i wanted to lvl (mf: 40/0). Clear speed doubled I would say, but per run i get like 1/2 inventory of rares, an no uniques anymore.

So loot/time drastically decreased. I now play full dmg because this is the way i wanna play this game, but it always leaves a foul taste, knowing, that I wont rly build up currency that way.

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Daefecator wrote:

What level are you, 81? I would like to read your comment as soon as you hit at least 87 please. This is the exact point when even 68-69 maps start to give negligible amounts of experience, and you will see that even sustaining 70's maps is an issue for soloing without stacked Magic Find.

From the way your posts look like, it seems there is something wrong with either your shift or caps lock button, can you confirm they are ok? By the way, you've already shown us that you are an overly educated person, and now you are arguing about Magic Find to not affect any currency drop at all in your opinion?

Basing your argument on high level play? When the game is incomplete, and not geared towards high level play. Cool. Awesome. Legit.

Also, MF has no bearing on map sustainability (as in map drops), the argument of map rolling for optimal mods (and becoming broke doing so) is an entirely different discussion.