Why does Lioneye's Glare have no drawback?

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Catchafire2000 wrote:

Instead of touching ES, they should go back to the way HP was before and simply nerf Kaom's.

No.

1. GGG aren't exactly just gonna undo everything they've recently done, period.

2. Life in large quantities is better than ES in those same quantities because of things like stun/shock procs and pots.

3. It's easier for a life tank to get additional things like armor or evasion while ES users won't have comparable armor/evasion along with high ES.

4. Life can take advantage of things CI users can't like BM and EB, meaning generally they can have much fewer issues with mana.

Life NEEDS to be less than ES total but as it stands now with stuff like ZO and GR maybe the general rule of ES pools being on general twice as large as life pools should be cut down.

Also a simple nerf to kaoms would be to put kaom users in a similar situation to CI users, remove their ability to use other forms of defense (gear wise) so make it so while using kaoms armor and evasion are 0.

Kaom's should be an example of a rare version of a build enabler.
For what you say?

Pure regen builds.
No evasion. No armor. No ES.
Gigantic life pool to prevent oneshots, supplimented by VERY high regen.

Also, i'd much rather see life increase overall rather than ES decrease, because as it stands the game is too annoying and tedious to play due to the life being low.

Remember that not only did life builds lose more life than ES, but this also means they lost more regen, often to a point of requiring them to either replace blood magic with clarity + mana leech, or dropping even more life nodes for Reduced Mana Cost nodes, or extra regen nodes.

Dropping life did not just drop life, it changed builds in a way that requires even more additional life (or gem slots) to be dropped.

So, instead of making builds less dependent on HP the opposite happened. There are arguments for HP over ES, but I'm not really buying it. Most top players I see are working their way to CI, and there's a point for that. There are items out there that negate stun and nodes such as vaal pact that help ES to survive. So I have a high ES pool, unwavering stance or eye of chayula to prevent stun, and vaal pact for survivability. Couple this with the added benefit to ES from getting int nodes and the high damage out put from broken builds and I think that ES builds are stronger than HP builds.

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Catchafire2000 wrote:

So, instead of making builds less dependent on HP the opposite happened. There are arguments for HP over ES, but I'm not really buying it. Most top players I see are working their way to CI, and there's a point for that. There are items out there that negate stun and nodes such as vaal pact that help ES to survive. So I have a high ES pool, unwavering stance or eye of chayula to prevent stun, and vaal pact for survivability. Couple this with the added benefit to ES from getting int nodes and the high damage out put from broken builds and I think that ES builds are stronger than HP builds.

There's an ebb and flow to the CI/HP battle. It's gone back and forth many times. In CB just before OB hit CI was king, there were even many popular melee CI builds (victordoom's very popular ele cleave build was originally CI) then OB came and everyone went for life, before kaoms started popping up everywhere.

It will be a while before these two are balanced perfectly with each other because there's so many factors to consider, many new uniques always being introduced and if they add new keystones that effect either one then there's more rebalancing. It seems GGG has put life where they want it now they need to readjust ES to fit with it, not just buff life.

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Xendran wrote:

Kaom's should be an example of a rare version of a build enabler.
For what you say?

Pure regen builds.
No evasion. No armor. No ES.
Gigantic life pool to prevent oneshots, supplimented by VERY high regen.

Also, i'd much rather see life increase overall rather than ES decrease, because as it stands the game is too annoying and tedious to play due to the life being low.

Remember that not only did life builds lose more life than ES, but this also means they lost more regen, often to a point of requiring them to either replace blood magic with clarity + mana leech, or dropping even more life nodes for Reduced Mana Cost nodes, or extra regen nodes.

Dropping life did not just drop life, it changed builds in a way that requires even more additional life (or gem slots) to be dropped.

I agree on kaoms.

I doubt life is getting buffed when they spent so much time balancing out the nerf, it doesn't fit GGG's MO. I wouldn't be surprised by an ES nerf though.

The other problems you mentioned is the growing mana problems that I've been complaining about since November. It seems they don't want people spamming skills which means the only thing not in line with that is leech, which the gems recently received a buff, so I'm all confused on GGG's stance on mana. Either everything works or nothing works but giving 1-2 ways to completely ignore it just doesn't make sense to me.

Disallowing the spamming of skills would only be viable if they allowed us to use supports on standard attacks.

Math in the op is off- rare bows cant get the top ias mod, they top out at 11-13%. Combine this with the cant miss mod and a rare bow can only equal lioneye, not beat it. Plenty of lioneyes around... dont see many perfect rare tri phys + ias bows around. Actually, i dont see any. Perfect example of a unique being bis and trivializing itemization within its base type and among multiple mainstream builds.

The only outliers are explosive builds that generally prefer quillrain, elem hit builds that want a +3 thicket with 35% wed and max ias / crit / multi rolls and a niche poison arrow cloud-only build that no one runs anymore due to massive wall of hp syndrome come endgame.

Comparisons to shavronnes are almost relevant, though shavronnes is still clearly weaker than perfect rare torsos (top rares can achieve almost double the es with 40% trires). Comparison to kaoms is poor, as kaoms forces either a 4-link cap or a huge armor/evade/resist/block hit for its 900 extra life, which is a significant and noticable downside, something lioneyes (and shavronnes) lacks.

You people +1ing the comparison of an elem thicket to lioneyes need to remember that elem builds arent adding flat phys, arent running vuln and have base phys on their bow, so that tiny phys damage come endgame is going straight into the monsters armor. Redo the math without that base phys and you see that lioneye ends up 50-75 base damage higher along with its slightly better attack speed and 100% hit rate.

And lastly, regarding Chris statement: We are always reminded that its beta and we should expect things to change. So, im expecting things to change, and this is one of them.

I think removing the flat phys mod would be enough, no need for extravagant measures here. The cb version was balanced just fine.

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KoTao wrote:

I think removing the flat phys mod would be enough, no need for extravagant measures here. The cb version was balanced just fine.

First of all, check how gigantic of a dps difference that makes, even with a crit build. It's way more of a loss than you realise.

Second, why don't we change it in a way that makes the bow actually unique, and function differently than other bows?

How about GGG improves the Ranger Tree first before nerfing the Glare?

switch
Hits can't be Evaded
into
Resolute Technique

item is fixed