Are complains about portals, exp loss, and similar coming from zoomers (as in "kids")?

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Doomhammer5#4010 wrote:

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kamiknx#1162 wrote:

If you're a boomer that played games, there's a high chance your played some MMO or some other game where you had to grind for real to get to the end game.

I remember playing Priston Tale and being extremely happy when my exp went up 0.5% in an entire day.

Maybe the difference was that the game was better to play with friends? So I didn't mind the grind because I was chatting with people and stuff?

But I've also played another game that was solo, and it was the same, maybe you'll get 1% a day.

There's a very niche game that one of my friends play, he says it's worse than Priston Tale, you'll hit a point that you'll not get 0.5% not even in a week.

Have you had experiences in games like this? And what's your opinion on exp loss and portals?

Defo not a kid and I've been playing games my whole life.

The death penalties in this game are too harsh and rarely deserved. They need to be toned down.

I guess you were spared from the brutality of playing some of the older games, because in comparison to those POE's 10% exp loss is nothing. Playing for 1 month straight without dying just to make 1 level, and deleveling when you died at 0% exp...now that is harsh and undeserved.

i like how OP's tone and language seems very neutral but in the very title he sneaks in the word kids.

then again, a lot of people not having a problem in poe2 are usually people who use overperfoming builds or even follow build guides.

play a trumelee mace toon and let me know how it feels.

then again forget it. ggg is gonna talk about what theyre gonna do about all the feedback in a few hours lol.

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lupasvasile#5385 wrote:

I guess you were spared from the brutality of playing some of the older games, because in comparison to those POE's 10% exp loss is nothing. Playing for 1 month straight without dying just to make 1 level, and deleveling when you died at 0% exp...now that is harsh and undeserved.

But in them games you died because it was YOUR own fault, not to a random after death explosion with a 5 sec delay, or a boss that hat 3 one shot attacks + pools of Poison/Blood/Fire/Ice that make dodging a nightmare and near impossible.

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Avaricta#4758 wrote:

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suutamulumi#5617 wrote:

You contradict yourself here. You claim it's only for yourself and that you don't care about others, but then you go on to talk about others when you say things like "not everybody should have x". You're competing with others when you say this.

If it was honestly just a self thing you did, you could just make your own goal of reaching 100 without dying. Heck, the sky is the limit, you can set yourself any goal you want and continue "not caring about others", couldn't you.

You're dishonest when you say it's not about others.

You misunderstood. Maybe I explained poorly. Or maybe you try to misconstrue what I typed an purpose.

When I say not everybody is expected to reach level 100. I mean the game is not designed for everybody to achieve everything in the game.

There are very different types of players playing the game. Some have only 1 hour a week to play, others play 16 hours a day, 7 days a week.

The game offers something to do for everybody. Someone with 1 hour a week is not expected to achieve the same things as someone who plays all the time.

If you want to reach level 100, you simply have to play accordingly. It is that simple.

Yeah ok that's fair. I object to phrases like "people want everything handed to them" because even with exp loss removed, it's quite a grind to hit 100 if you're playing solo. People say that builds stop progression around 93 but idk, 7 passive skills are quite juicy. If it really is just a personal goal to hit 100 then maybe we should stop getting skill points at 93, remove exp loss until 93, then bring it back for 93-100. Perhaps this is a bit hand-holdey though.

I think the main reason I'd be in favour of removing exp loss (or altering it somehow) is feeling trapped in the content. I'm fine with playing carefully and grinding levels when I want to, but if I get bored of it and want to try an uber or some other challenge, I "can't" until I level. Exp loss only in maps, maybe?

These mechanics are similar to THAC0 in D&D; they served their purposed at one time, but that time is gone. We didn't realize it at the time since we didn't know better, but it was (IMHO) bad design then, and it is bad design now.

* 6 portals before map and XP loss seems the best solution. It prevents people from just trying to brute force stuff they shouldn't be doing, but allows for the occasional mistake and learning fights.

* Remove XP loss entirely but keep 1-death is OK, but doesn't help with bosses (can't learn bosses if you only get one chance after hours of work).

* 1 death on maps but 6 chances at pinnacle bosses is another option I suppose.

Really depends on the design vision by the devs.

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exsea#1724 wrote:

sneaks in the word kids

To mean age, not zoomers as in people who doesn't give a shit about the game and just wants to go fast.

its real simple. You dont need to reach level 100 or 95 or even 90 to do all the content in the game.

You want to reach level 100? The requirement is to get there without dying or dying less than the xp you are able to farm.

Ive gotten 100 in poe1 beta as well as almost every single league, even before breaches and 5ways were introduced.

I see no issues with the system, i always liked the xp penalty in D2, although i like the idea that you can recover most of the xp lost by getting your body back in the same game, PoE2 dsnt have that but it does have the Omen which is cool and ive used it many times.

Would the game be "fine" without the death penalty? sure.... But i can say the same about every single system i dont like also.

Personally, i don't even think the death effects on the game are that bad. There is one specific mob i dont like which is the caster that casts detonate dead from 2 screens away red circle thing. That got me once or twice lol.

In general i like the death penalty, it has often separated me from my friends who i know just arent really that good or serious about leveling.

I hate the xp penalty, i also hate the one portal penalties. But i hate the portal penalties more than i hate the experience loss. Ill take that if i play badly maybe i should be punished for it, but at least i can keep trying.

But when i both lose my map, my loot, my exp, my waystone and most importantly my precious time, all at once, because of 1 mistake (or worse, ode, bug etc) It's too much penalty. This is earth last i checked, not the depths of hell. Im 35

I'm almost 50, so Gen Xer, and I remember when most games were 3 tries and your out, before arpgs were even a thing. Played through a lot of games that required skill and have always been good at them. The most fun with one of these games was the original Guild Wars, so much to do and have fun with, neat mechanics with the hunting skills, actual MMO (my first) requiring internet connection, and I remember it fondly.

Out of the things the OP mentioned, the XP loss on death is the thing that gets me (haven't gone back since, so I haven't experienced the losing maps). As far as I can remember, I've never liked it, always thought it was an artificial gate and a stop-gap measure for actual game balance. A player should be able to tell when their build/gear is getting weak, because you should have a harder time getting through things and/or staying alive while you are playing. This game doesn't do that, many people here have said the same. When you would normally reach that point, that's when you would start scrutinizing your build more and maybe farm some gear. It doesn't take essentially deleting a players progress to get to that point, which imho is akin to when you didn't have autosave, you forgot to save, then died and had to start over from your hours old save.

Since I've never liked it, I've never participated with it when it is present. It's not a constructive mechanic, it's destructive by it's very nature. I'll skip all the specific negatives, since they've been covered in countless posts, and I'll skip all the other gripes to stay on topic.

However, to all the proponents of keeping it, you can skip it, too. If I wanted to play the game as intended, in it's current state, I could go look up a meta, too. I could make one, go get gear from an rmt, and make it to 100. But, to me, that's the cheap way of playing, and I also know that that would make the game not fun, which is my #1 priority for playing a game. So, please, keep your juvenile "get good, go play D4/etc." and fanboy praise to yourself.

This is not a game of skill, it's a numbers game, and neither was PoE1. It won't be a game of skill until gear becomes less king than the passive tree and everything is well-balanced. Never happened in 1, and I doubt it will happen here based on the state of EA launch. But, I can have hope, and I see (just like with 1) the possibilities for this game. And, I hope beyond hope that the devs will finally try to make this game better, and more accessible (as they have stated they want to). Get rid of all the artificial gates and make a truly skill-based game.

I don't know, we will see.

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nitefox1337#3569 wrote:

This feature is so contreversual and hated by the majority, and yet it's still there.

Controversial, yes. Hated by the majority, entirely conjecture.

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nitefox1337#3569 wrote:

This means that the game doesn't aim to gather more players than the PoE1 players who for some reason defend useless features.

You're assuming 100% of new players are like one type and not the other. That's just objectively wrong.

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nitefox1337#3569 wrote:

What's more funny is their silence when you say "if you want difficulty so much, why don't you go play Hardcore"?

Because losing a couple hours of exp at level 95 vs losing 7 days of progress AND gear is a WAY bigger jump than just "losing xp or not"

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nitefox1337#3569 wrote:

Then for some reason they just stfu and disappear.

Because that's the line that lets people know you don't mean to have a real conversation. They disappear because they're bored of you.

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nitefox1337#3569 wrote:

Why isn't there an option where you don't lose XP? Any "Easy League"?

Why not make 3 leagues so everyone plays like they want?
Easy League: No XP Loss ever.
Normal league: Current State.
Hardcore: Current State.

Please, outline how you would make that work from a technical standpoint. That's 50% more servers (assuming SSF easy would exist too). That's also splitting the economy further, and would allow the "elites" to basically control the "easy" economy anyway, because the ones that would chose Easy mode, would be the ones who would price fix the shit out of everything. It would be a disaster.

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nitefox1337#3569 wrote:

You can already hear m...ns shouting "then everyone would chose Easy!". Yeah because everyone hates that stupid outdated obsolete XP loss mechanic! Just let people play like they want, and go bother someone else!

And if you want a medal because you managed to reach 100 with XP Loss, then take one from the Medal Dispenser. No one cares.

Not everyone would choose easy, but most of the people who did would be extremely disappointed by all the day 2 level 100s farming T18s and endgame because guess what? Making the game easier doesn't make you better.

The irony I find is how many of these posts say that the people who are FOR the xp loss want a "medal" or "award" or "recognition" for their achievements, when...

...you're asking for level 100 to be a participation trophy. Literally.