Are complains about portals, exp loss, and similar coming from zoomers (as in "kids")?

It is simply a player issue.

Instead of looking at the situation and adapting to it, people just want everything handed to them.

The penalties in place for dying is the current situation. Deal with it and stop whining. There may be changes in the future but right now this is how it is. If you don't like it or just refuse to adapt, you have the wrong game.

The player has 100% control over the game. The player decides the difficulty, the player decides their playstyle. The only reason the penalties effect players is because they keep failing. Have you tried doing something different to avoid failing? Have tried improving your gear? Have you tried farming on a lower difficulty in order to be able to afford gear upgrades?

I am convinced that 100% of the whiners jump to the highest possible difficulty they have waystones for because they think there is the best loot and they are greedy. Instead of maybe take a break, farm currency/items at a lower difficulty and progress their character. And that is the issue. Not the game. The players.

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Securetate#3464 wrote:

For example.
In D2 i had all chars at lev 100 as a casual player.

Unless your total number of characters in D2 was 1, I call BS. I played pretty much my entire childhood D2, have done everything in that game, uber tristram, uber diablo and pretty much every build. I am leveling faster in PoE 2 than I did in D2.

Edit:
And I bet less then 1/3 of the whiners look at the affixes of the waystones they run.

Old enough to remember the brutality of old games, young enough to somewhat understand the demands of the younger generation.

POE 2 is not even close to the old "pain in the ass" games, but we live in a world full of ADHD and Autism. People have the attention span of fruit flies; they cannot handle anything that requires you to focus for more than 5 minutes. With that being said, some game mechanics seem to be outdated, because they were put in place in a time where games were limited by technology and they needed something to prolongue their life. Game devs have the tools to make longer, and funner games without forcing you to grind until you puke.

Personally, the only thing I do not like in POE 2 is the 1 portal rule. POE 1 had the good idea, and as some random guy on youtube once said: I "paid" for 6 portals, I'm gonna use 6 portals.
My proposed fix would be: let us use 6 portals, and if a boss is involved and you die, just reset its life each time.

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lupasvasile#5385 wrote:

Personally, the only thing I do not like in POE 2 is the 1 portal rule. POE 1 had the good idea, and as some random guy on youtube once said: I "paid" for 6 portals, I'm gonna use 6 portals.
My proposed fix would be: let us use 6 portals, and if a boss is involved and you die, just reset its life each time.

The issue with that, and one of the reasons why they introduced the 1 portal mechanic in the first place is, that it highly promotes glass cannon builds. Glass cannon builds seem like the only logical way to play the game if we have 6 portals.

Because there is zero chance of losing when you have 6 portals. In PoE 1 with a glass cannon build you kill everything within two screens and kill bosses within two seconds. There is nothing that can kill you, because there is nothing alive on your screen. If for some odd reason the boss manages to one shot you within the two seconds it is alive, you simply use a portal and continue looting.

In PoE 1 glass cannon builds are faster and have no chance of failure. So they are always the better option.

In PoE 2 they tried to promote more balanced/tankier builds. That's where the idea for 1 portal came from.

don't die so you won't lost exp, I don't die so I don't lost exp

you die? learn what dodge roll is

~dark souls veteran

I'm over 40 and played some brutal mmo's years ago. Those horrid Eastern imports where dying in pvp meant dropping your items (or losing an expensive cash shop item to prevent it) and dying in pve meant losing literal days or weeks worth of grinding (or again losing the cash shop item). There was even a legal bot (in the cash shop) that allowed you to grind mobs 24/7, as long as no one pk'd you or dragged your toon into a ditch or pulled too many mobs onto it so you would die and they could escape the pk penalty.

We did this to our rivals every single day/night. We would hunt them and waste their days/weeks/real life money to spite them and set their progress back. And we had it done to us too. Thousands of real life money going down the drain. You know how many people made it to max level in that game? No one. Not a single person hit the cap before the game shut down, even after years of legal botting. But the game wasn't about hitting max level, it was about playing the actual content, which is what I think poe2 should be about too.
I see no harm in letting everyone hit max level. Not in 1 day of course, but you know, make it a grind but remove exp loss, or even reduce it a bit. Make the content the challenge, the bragging rights. Then you get to flex your actual skills rather than your no-lifing. Doesn't that sound better?

If it were put to a vote, I'd vote to remove exp loss in poe2. I think you're falling into fallacies (anecdotal, equivalency, appeal to tradition) when you assume it's zoomers that don't like it (because they've never experienced it before?)
Sometimes you want change because you've been through it before, and are tired of it when it doesn't add anything. I could just as easily make the argument that it's zoomers that want the exp loss, because they're young and need something to feel special about/give them self-worth or respect amongst their peers, as if reaching 100 before their friends wins them cool points. I'm a bit old for that :grin:

I find replies like this one:

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b_ko#7756 wrote:

That's merely your opinion. This isn't the game for handing everything to you easily.

and this one:

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people just want everything handed to them

very immature and backs up my theory. These people seem to need this artificial competition and that to me looks like a young man's game. It makes zero sense to me to gatekeep other players from hitting 100. I really do not care what level people I don't know are. People say you don't need the extra skill points from around 93 or so, that they're not a deciding factor in builds, so why do they care? Wanting to feel special for not dying in the game already exists in HC mode, does it not? Feeling special for not dying/racing to level cap in SC is just weird. If it makes you happy that you did it then fair enough, but the people around you don't care you did it. It seems very silly to me. It's a gimped trait from HC mode which these guys are too scared to play, but they still want to pretend they're HC.

I don't really even care about the exp loss, it's more the way people argue for keeping it. I see them as a bit precious. While losing exp is annoying, there are omens to prevent 75% of it. My solution was either give us the option to pay currency instead (omens) or an opt-in setting. That way, the people that want to compete to get to max level (lol) can do so. Maybe they can have a special forum badge if they opted in for exp loss on death and got to 100. Could be, idk, a snowflake or something. A shiny trophy next to their name that lets everyone know how super badass and totally not a zoomer they are. A real pro gamer. Don't you dare take away my cool kids pro gamer cred!!

Kids these days!

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suutamulumi#5617 wrote:

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people just want everything handed to them

very immature and backs up my theory. These people seem to need this artificial competition and that to me looks like a young man's game. It makes zero sense to me to gatekeep other players from hitting 100.

I don't care about others. I play this game mostly SSF.

This is one of the misconceptions many have. Level 100 is not expected to be reached by everybody. It is not needed for your progression. It is something you set as a goal for yourself and then work towards achieving this goal.

PoE has many different things to do. Not everybody is expected to do everything. But you can if you want to. You just have to adept and play accordingly.

It has nothing to do with competition. But there needs to be an obstacle in the game the player has to overcome in order for the player to feel some form a satisfaction/accomplishment. That is where the fun comes from. If you remove these things it becomes a boring slob like D4.

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Avaricta#4758 wrote:

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suutamulumi#5617 wrote:

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people just want everything handed to them

very immature and backs up my theory. These people seem to need this artificial competition and that to me looks like a young man's game. It makes zero sense to me to gatekeep other players from hitting 100.

I don't care about others. I play this game mostly SSF.

This is one of the misconceptions many have. Level 100 is not expected to be reached by everybody. It is not needed for your progression. It is something you set as a goal for yourself and then work towards achieving this goal.

PoE has many different things to do. Not everybody is expected to do everything. But you can if you want to. You just have to adept and play accordingly.

It has nothing to do with competition. But there needs to be an obstacle in the game the player has to overcome in order for the player to feel some form a satisfaction/accomplishment. That is where the fun comes from. If you remove these things it becomes a boring slob like D4.

You contradict yourself here. You claim it's only for yourself and that you don't care about others, but then you go on to talk about others when you say things like "not everybody should have x". You're competing with others when you say this.

If it was honestly just a self thing like you claim, you could just make your own goal of reaching 100 without dying. Heck, the sky is the limit, you can set yourself any goal you want and continue "not caring about others", couldn't you.

You're dishonest when you say it's not about others.

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suutamulumi#5617 wrote:

You contradict yourself here. You claim it's only for yourself and that you don't care about others, but then you go on to talk about others when you say things like "not everybody should have x". You're competing with others when you say this.

If it was honestly just a self thing you did, you could just make your own goal of reaching 100 without dying. Heck, the sky is the limit, you can set yourself any goal you want and continue "not caring about others", couldn't you.

You're dishonest when you say it's not about others.

You misunderstood. Maybe I explained poorly. Or maybe you try to misconstrue what I typed an purpose.

When I say not everybody is expected to reach level 100. I mean the game is not designed for everybody to achieve everything in the game.

There are very different types of players playing the game. Some have only 1 hour a week to play, others play 16 hours a day, 7 days a week.

The game offers something to do for everybody. Someone with 1 hour a week is not expected to achieve the same things as someone who plays all the time. Someone with less time may have to choose one or two things and work towards them. Whereas other with more time do everything. Just look at the PoE 1 Challenges. How many people get 40/40? That is what I meant.

If you want to reach level 100, you simply have to play accordingly. It is that simple.

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kamiknx#1162 wrote:

If you're a boomer that played games, there's a high chance your played some MMO or some other game where you had to grind for real to get to the end game.

I remember playing Priston Tale and being extremely happy when my exp went up 0.5% in an entire day.

Maybe the difference was that the game was better to play with friends? So I didn't mind the grind because I was chatting with people and stuff?

But I've also played another game that was solo, and it was the same, maybe you'll get 1% a day.

There's a very niche game that one of my friends play, he says it's worse than Priston Tale, you'll hit a point that you'll not get 0.5% not even in a week.

Have you had experiences in games like this? And what's your opinion on exp loss and portals?

Defo not a kid and I've been playing games my whole life.

The death penalties in this game are too harsh and rarely deserved. They need to be toned down.

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Doomhammer5#4010 wrote:

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kamiknx#1162 wrote:

If you're a boomer that played games, there's a high chance your played some MMO or some other game where you had to grind for real to get to the end game.

I remember playing Priston Tale and being extremely happy when my exp went up 0.5% in an entire day.

Maybe the difference was that the game was better to play with friends? So I didn't mind the grind because I was chatting with people and stuff?

But I've also played another game that was solo, and it was the same, maybe you'll get 1% a day.

There's a very niche game that one of my friends play, he says it's worse than Priston Tale, you'll hit a point that you'll not get 0.5% not even in a week.

Have you had experiences in games like this? And what's your opinion on exp loss and portals?

Defo not a kid and I've been playing games my whole life.

The death penalties in this game are too harsh and rarely deserved. They need to be toned down.

What other game did you play in the past?

Have you ever played a game that gave you 0.5% exp in a whole day?