Why POE2 is dying

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eldheim#2436 wrote:
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TheWroth#7505 wrote:
Ascendancy:

I believe a lot of people like roguelike style mechanics, I find the Sanctum Trial real fun, hard but rewarding (I almost always drop something interesting). The 4th boss is a problem to me though, I can easily defeat it, but the "instakill" mechanic I can't do alone, as i'm not using MS boots and other things like that.

The Trial of Chaos is pure RNG, but it isn't thaaaaat hard, the unfair part of it is that you need to do, if you are lucky, at least 3 times to face the trialmaster and get the last ascendancy point.

Crafting:

Although craft should get some atention right now, I don't think that make something like "exalted to be more common" would be good, exalted is common already.. even alone or with 1 or 2 party members it's possible to drop a lot of it.

Armor:

A lot of friends of mine run warriors build and actually tank a lot of damage, they are not immortal gods but to say that "armor builds are dead" makes no sense.

Melee:

Same thing as before, to say "that melee is dead" is joke. i'm not wasting time in this point.

Passive tree and life nodes:

It would be good to see more life nodes in the passive tree, but the amount of ES nodes is not unfair. I agree that we need a buff by having more life nodes in the tree, but ES is doing fine rn

XP loss:

As frustrating as I know it is to lose 10% of XP every death, meaning a loss of good hours of farming in the endgame when you reach 90+, I really don't understand why people cry so much about it. lvl 100 is supposed to be a challenge and without the xp loss there is no challenge whatsoever. "uhhh but I need those points to finish my build"... I rarelly see a build that need to pass lvl 91 to be finished, those 9 last points should not be relevant for you to be able to "do your thing". the 1 portal is unfair though, I don't want the 6 portal to be usable again after deaths, but we should be able to refry the map at least 1 time, some forgiveness would be nice. We also could get the revive mechanic in maps active. if they do something like "every player can only revive an ally 1 time per map would be good, and if the player is revived before the end of the map he doesn't lose any XP. The game will still be punishing we have some options to work around.

Maps:

All maps with bosses and something like the checkpoints would be great, I agree. I really enjoy most of the boss fights in this game.. but the lack of maps with bosses in the endgame is sad.

And no, i'm not a pro player with meta builds. i'm a casual player that played for quite some time the 1st game. playing PoE 2 as Infernalist using a bunch of different minions and without srs because I dont like it.



Trust me bro, some friends says its fine, but you don't play it yourself?
See what Kripp said. See what the actual leaked numbers on armor says.

Or better: TRY IT.

Then lets discuss it. Because I did.


I don't need to actually play with a class that I don't care or like to "discuss with you". the fact that you struggle with it don't make you more reliable than having casual friends also playing with the class.

I do prefer to trust my friends than a random guy that says "something is dead" because he tried and failed with it. I understand melee and armor needs a lot of improvements, mainly in the armor part as, like Kripp said in its video, a Cloak of Flame itself does pretty much the same job as a fully armored character.. but I can't see anyone taking the "melee and armor is dead" seriously.
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TheWroth#7505 wrote:


I don't need to actually play with a class that I don't care or like to "discuss with you". the fact that you struggle with it don't make you more reliable than having casual friends also playing with the class.

I do prefer to trust my friends than a random guy that says "something is dead" because he tried and failed with it. I understand melee and armor needs a lot of improvements, mainly in the armor part as, like Kripp said in its video, a Cloak of Flame itself does pretty much the same job as a fully armored character.. but I can't see anyone taking the "melee and armor is dead" seriously.


Ofc you can play every class. But it feels bad playing a class that is just inherently so much worse then the average.
I dont play melee myself so cant comment but the power disparity currently between life/armor and es is just laughable.

When es is 3-4 times more effective defense then its obvious something is wrong, which is why every top build is using es. They need to do a big nerf to es, give us more life nodes and either buff armor or give us more mechanics to multiply armor mitigation with, like endurance charges or ways to convert damage
This was a fun read!
Marry xMas!
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Nyon#6673 wrote:
When es is 3-4 times more effective defense then its obvious something is wrong, which is why every top build is using es. They need to do a big nerf to es, give us more life nodes and either buff armor or give us more mechanics to multiply armor mitigation with, like endurance charges or ways to convert damage


You should not nerf a defensive mechanic one-third of the intended classes use just because of the top 1% of builds.

Any casual player would basically have to abandon using energy shield as a defensive mechanic and end up building Life. Which is what PoE 1 was after Energy Shield got nerfed to the ground so that it required massive farming for end game gear to make it competitive.
While i agree with some of what you said....

The game is not dying. It's not even out yet.

You posted this on the 2nd day of xmas for Christ's sake

Don't expect any patches this year and go do something else while they rest, regroup and show us what they have comming.

What the actual f.
Armor needs a buff, not energy shield a nerf. It's not like average gamers are roflstomping ssfhc with energy shield.
Anyway games surely not dying it's not even out yet. You can try a demo.
Last edited by Strickl3r#3809 on Dec 26, 2024, 9:26:30 AM
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Nyon#6673 wrote:
When es is 3-4 times more effective defense then its obvious something is wrong, which is why every top build is using es. They need to do a big nerf to es, give us more life nodes and either buff armor or give us more mechanics to multiply armor mitigation with, like endurance charges or ways to convert damage


You should not nerf a defensive mechanic one-third of the intended classes use just because of the top 1% of builds.

Any casual player would basically have to abandon using energy shield as a defensive mechanic and end up building Life. Which is what PoE 1 was after Energy Shield got nerfed to the ground so that it required massive farming for end game gear to make it competitive.


So if they buff life and nerf es until their about equal. That would force every1 to go life.... what logic are you using?

Its irrelevant what the top builds are using. The problem is that you can litterally just get the most mediocre gear, put 6 points into your skill tree and your suddenly at 9k es ontop of ur 2-2.3k base hp.

While even with almost full t1 life rolls on all your gear you can barely reach 4k life. And against big hits your armor will mitigate what? 15-20% if your lucky?

So thats 11.5k effective hp vs 4.8k (if im generous)
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Armor needs a buff, not energy shield a nerf. It's not like average gamers are roflstomping ssfhc with energy shield.
Anyway games surely not dying it's not even out yet. You can try a demo.


When one is 3-4 times stronger then the other then its almost always a case of one needing a buff and the other a nerf. Not just making life/armor overpowered aswell.
ES absolutely needs a nerf and if they insist on not allowing life/melee to have more life scaling opportunity they probably need to giga nerf ES or allow armour to apply to all damage.

Its the same really clear and obvious mistakes that POE1 committed and spent the last 11 years correcting slowly.

Seriously life/ES/defenses were not well designed or balanced until about 3 years ago in POE1 and POE2 just doubled down on the early POE1 balance points and made them worse with things like super long melee attack animations, and super fast casting AKA spell casting while moving (essentially removing spell casting time making spells even more advantageous than early POE1's awful balance points).

Also POE1 had Endo charges, lots of sources of PDR, and Fortify (until they ruined it for many by making it useless of faster hitting builds) on top of having more effective Armour and damage conversion AND tons of life scaling and easy recovery.

There's lots of unseen things as well, some of the only really good melee in POE1 was STR stacking which gave both damage and life. Those are gone, or they are only giving life or they are Quarterstaffs and ES now (Pillar+HOWA).
Pandering to players who don't want consequences for their mistakes is a perfect description of what went fundamentally wrong with D3 and 4.
If they wanted mindless mobile game time waster gameplay they sure did make some perplexing choices and marketing statements for 6 fucking years.
Last edited by alhazred70#2994 on Dec 26, 2024, 9:48:50 AM
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Nyon#6673 wrote:
So if they buff life and nerf es until their about equal. That would force every1 to go life.... what logic are you using?


Because life is far easier to replenish than Energy Shield. You have flasks, you have regeneration, you have gain health on kill, you have LEECH. Energy Shield is INTENDED to have higher values because for anyone that isn't using Youthful Regeneration or Chonks (which is a terrible ascendancy right now) there is basically no way to replenish it while getting hit.

Oh yeah, your stun and ailment thresholds are also based off of your life, not Energy Shield. Unless you want to fork over a bunch more points to try and mitigate those points. I'm running dedicated stun and thawing charms to mitigate these things, while my Warrior gets to run the golden charm because his beefy hit points makes him basically immune to these mechanics 95% of the time.

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Nyon#6673 wrote:
Its irrelevant what the top builds are using. The problem is that you can litterally just get the most mediocre gear, put 6 points into your skill tree and your suddenly at 9k es ontop of ur 2-2.3k base hp.

While even with almost full t1 life rolls on all your gear you can barely reach 4k life. And against big hits your armor will mitigate what? 15-20% if your lucky?

So thats 11.5k effective hp vs 4.8k (if im generous)


...What world do you live in?

My monk has picked up the starting ES nodes, two eva/es nodes, and the ES node to the right of the witch starting tree. He's just NOW managed to crack 2k ES while running t12-t15 maps. Yeah, he's not got the best gear, but I'm pretty certain at that point he's got 'the most mediocre gear' and far more investment in passives than your example. Oh, and his health before CI was 1.5k, not 2-2.3k.

My warrior, meanwhile, in just as mediocre gear is running over 3k life with none of the soul cores that increase it further, or breech rings/other methods to really stack monstrous amounts of Strength. He's far less squishy than the monk, and I haven't even really invested in block on him. Meanwhile I've seen people running around with 5k health.

This is before factoring in that the warrior was far easier to gear for since all I need is +life and resists for his armor, with armor affixes being a secondary. To get a good energy shield value from armor I need to roll two specific prefixes at a decent tier alone, and then on top of it worry about resists. My monk only now got resist capped in high end maps now, and it came at the expense of replacing my 30% MS boots for 10% MS boots.

You are absolutely looking at the luxury high end gear and making false conclusions about the state of play for the entire game. Warrior might have some issues, but its entirely down to the state of how the mace skills play, not their survivability.

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