[3.25] Community-crafted Pure Retal Gladiator | Sous-Vide the Atlas

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wickedcat wrote:

Could you please help me to understand this? I believe if we block more hits, we should have more chance of having at least one usable retal skill. By your calculation, it seems that more block = less chance to use retal skill. Thanks in advance.


Simple math:
if you blocked one hit there is 30% (100%-70%) probability of going on cooldown and 65% (100%-35%) probabability for any other skill to become usable again.
Lets assume you have used one retaliation skill and other four are already on cooldown. Total probability for every your retaliation skill to be on cooldown after one block P=(0.3*0.65^4)*100%=5.3%. 0.3 states for used retaliation skill goes on cooldown. 0.65^4 states for every other skill remains on cooldown.
And this 0.053(5.3%) is just after one blocked hit.
For two blocked hits probability P = 0.053+0.053*(1-0.053)=0.103 (10.3%)
For three blocked P= 0.053+0.053*(1-0.053) + 0.053*(1-0.053)*(1-0.053)=0.15.1 (15.1%)
Here we have geometric sequence which sum = b1*(1-q^n)/(1-q) where b1=0.053, q=(1-0.053)=0.947, n= number of blocked hits
In this case b1=1-q, thus the probability for all skills to be on cooldown after blocking n hits P = 1-0.947^n
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freingard wrote:
"
wickedcat wrote:

Could you please help me to understand this? I believe if we block more hits, we should have more chance of having at least one usable retal skill. By your calculation, it seems that more block = less chance to use retal skill. Thanks in advance.


Simple math:
if you blocked one hit there is 30% (100%-70%) probability of going on cooldown and 65% (100%-35%) probabability for any other skill to become usable again.
Lets assume you have used one retaliation skill and other four are already on cooldown. Total probability for every your retaliation skill to be on cooldown after one block P=(0.3*0.65^4)*100%=5.3%. 0.3 states for used retaliation skill goes on cooldown. 0.65^4 states for every other skill remains on cooldown.
And this 0.053(5.3%) is just after one blocked hit.
For two blocked hits probability P = 0.053+0.053*(1-0.053)=0.103 (10.3%)
For three blocked P= 0.053+0.053*(1-0.053) + 0.053*(1-0.053)*(1-0.053)=0.15.1 (15.1%)
Here we have geometric sequence which sum = b1*(1-q^n)/(1-q) where b1=0.053, q=(1-0.053)=0.947, n= number of blocked hits
In this case b1=1-q, thus the probability for all skills to be on cooldown after blocking n hits P = 1-0.947^n


you know...i could spend days talking about these calculations
but in the end i prefer a Bayesian approach, we have cooldown measured as a variable of time, but when we play the game we have another events other than "holding the attack button" like moving around, not to mention whatever is outside our active control
it is a completely new type of playstyle...i think it is too soon to make an apples-to-apples comparison

remember reckoning/counter builds: they shine on super-dense-mob situations like simulacrum, but it is kinda crappy on pinnacle encounters -> implicit skils like "lvl 20 fiery impact" doing the heavy lifting
i believe GGG is trying to make a bridge between for the now defunct counters (and i obviously am trying to exploit it)

Last edited by Dragoon_Diver on Jul 24, 2024, 11:16:28 AM
Interested in league starting this as well, looking forward to the build!
i updated the 1st post, i ask everyone to read the disclaimer
remember: having fun is the priority

tomorrow i will update pob with some items, still need to wait and see how farmable the crafting will be at kingsmarch
Last edited by Dragoon_Diver on Jul 25, 2024, 9:56:52 AM
Ah... this is the post I was looking for. I wonder why none of the big content creators were jumping at the opportunity to try a completely new style of build with the new retaliate gems and stuff.

I will be following this with great interest... probably leaguestart with a lacerate glad but maybe will respec into this if it looks viable
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Koalk wrote:
Ah... this is the post I was looking for. I wonder why none of the big content creators were jumping at the opportunity to try a completely new style of build with the new retaliate gems and stuff.

I will be following this with great interest... probably leaguestart with a lacerate glad but maybe will respec into this if it looks viable


i don't blame them, GGG is notorious for "trolling" with meme or clunky mechanics, what we saw on videos could also be something out of context, internal testing and so on...

if i was a big time content creator i would never go down this path either :D
Uhulll lets goooo baby, I will blindly follow this path, I want something different and fun, and it seems very functional!!! Thanks!!
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freingard wrote:
"
wickedcat wrote:

Could you please help me to understand this? I believe if we block more hits, we should have more chance of having at least one usable retal skill. By your calculation, it seems that more block = less chance to use retal skill. Thanks in advance.


Simple math:
if you blocked one hit there is 30% (100%-70%) probability of going on cooldown and 65% (100%-35%) probabability for any other skill to become usable again.
Lets assume you have used one retaliation skill and other four are already on cooldown. Total probability for every your retaliation skill to be on cooldown after one block P=(0.3*0.65^4)*100%=5.3%. 0.3 states for used retaliation skill goes on cooldown. 0.65^4 states for every other skill remains on cooldown.
And this 0.053(5.3%) is just after one blocked hit.
For two blocked hits probability P = 0.053+0.053*(1-0.053)=0.103 (10.3%)
For three blocked P= 0.053+0.053*(1-0.053) + 0.053*(1-0.053)*(1-0.053)=0.15.1 (15.1%)
Here we have geometric sequence which sum = b1*(1-q^n)/(1-q) where b1=0.053, q=(1-0.053)=0.947, n= number of blocked hits
In this case b1=1-q, thus the probability for all skills to be on cooldown after blocking n hits P = 1-0.947^n


To make sure I get this. The more you block, the more likely for skills to be on cooldown? Is your math using Measured Retaliation?
for now good news: what i imagined is true, the cooldowns are not shared so we can have different types of retaliation
seems that leveling until 2nd lab Arsenal of vengeance is the way
Following this, started the journey myself but I'm bad at building X).
Ascend with precision!

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