I'm sick of zoom meta. (Speed creep created bad combat and game balance)

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AintCare wrote:

streamer=popular opinion. popular opinion=sales. Sad to see but I don't think the change in this direction is just correlation with GGGs acquisition by a corporate entity

Similar to alhazred, I question how popular of an opinion this really is. In the PoE bubble you hear it a lot (but even here it's divisive, as shown by how often threads like these pop up).

Any time PoE comes up in a more mainstream context, it always gets criticized for a) content bloat b) one-button gameplay c) speed. The first one makes the game inaccessible for new players. The latter mean there's no 'carrot' (ie. engaging gameplay) as an incentive. I haven't played D4, but from what I hear it largely manages to avoid these pitfalls, and it seems to be working out well for them.

as someone who has been playing for 2 years. i wouldn't be playing poe if i started in the early days, the campaign can take like 12 hours sometimes already i couldn't imagine how long it would take if they do ops route

i dont see how poe is mindless, maybe you have just gotten to good at it lmfao, ive played for 2 years and it takes me so much concentration lmfao

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Delv wrote:

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AintCare wrote:

streamer=popular opinion. popular opinion=sales. Sad to see but I don't think the change in this direction is just correlation with GGGs acquisition by a corporate entity

Similar to alhazred, I question how popular of an opinion this really is. In the PoE bubble you hear it a lot (but even here it's divisive, as shown by how often threads like these pop up).

Any time PoE comes up in a more mainstream context, it always gets criticized for a) content bloat b) one-button gameplay c) speed. The first one makes the game inaccessible for new players. The latter mean there's no 'carrot' (ie. engaging gameplay) as an incentive. I haven't played D4, but from what I hear it largely manages to avoid these pitfalls, and it seems to be working out well for them.

It definitely seems like they tried to take notes from failures of other ARPGs (including d2!)

Again, combat doesnt have to be slow or bullet spongey to feel fun and impactful. People seem to be ignoring that point. Leagues have to end shorter and shorter because the floor of our power is so high. (There have been some good ssf leagues though. like OG harvest)

would be nice to have some alternative to zoom zoom builds without feeling we are shooting our self on the foot for nothing.

may be a new currency that greatly enhance an item explicit modifiers but also comes with strong negative mods like 20% less attack, cast and movement speed.

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caboom wrote:

would be nice to have some alternative to zoom zoom builds without feeling we are shooting our self on the foot for nothing.

may be a new currency that greatly enhance an item explicit modifiers but also comes with strong negative mods like 20% less attack, cast and movement speed.

and every single player would use that on their bossing builds.

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dudeimadolphin wrote:

as someone who has been playing for 2 years. i wouldn't be playing poe if i started in the early days, the campaign can take like 12 hours sometimes already i couldn't imagine how long it would take if they do ops route

Not opposed to this. Contrary to what most people say, I like the campaign.

I love the d2 campaign and don't bother rushing even though I've had a solid two weeks where I played it every night last month.

PoE there are some parts of the campaign I think could do with a touch up, but I'd argue 80% of it I enjoy playing through. I think the option for an endless ledge if you've already beaten it in a league should be allowed for players who are honestly sick of the campaign, but it's been almost 10 years for me and I still enjoy it.

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auspexa wrote:

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caboom wrote:

would be nice to have some alternative to zoom zoom builds without feeling we are shooting our self on the foot for nothing.

may be a new currency that greatly enhance an item explicit modifiers but also comes with strong negative mods like 20% less attack, cast and movement speed.

and every single player would use that on their bossing builds.

yeah, instagibbing bosses pretty much immediately removes a lot of mechanic checks.
should only really do it if youre gonna do hundreds, or are going for a glorious grand goal chall or something.

i like speed meta, even if i'm not the zoomiest guy (a bit mediocre if i can tell). To me, its 100000 times better than the slugfest option to kill an ordinary rare in like 5min. even worse with the state of drops in this game.

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Daerdarus wrote:

i like speed meta, even if i'm not the zoomiest guy (a bit mediocre if i can tell). To me, its 100000 times better than the slugfest option to kill an ordinary rare in like 5min. even worse with the state of drops in this game.

again, to reiterate the points I've made:

1. you can rein in the speed creep without turning enemies into bullet sponges.
2. The shitty state of loot balance is a direct result of speed creep.