The Self Found League

I'd jump ship for this league instantly.

39 (and counting) pages of posts in this thread and other threads may not have fallen on deaf ears. Just found an Interview Chris had with Games.on.net on May 21st. In it Chris says:

"We have quite an interesting plan for the future of Path of Exile which involves both continuing forward with the core game, new acts and so on, but also taking advantage of the league system where we can run — think of it as new servers of the game that have a fresh economy and new rulesets."

You can read the whole interview here:
http://games.on.net/2013/05/path-of-exile-launches-an-au-gateway-we-talk-to-grinding-gear-about-bandwidth-costs-lag-and-more/

So maybe the voices of millions of players crying for new leagues to broaden the play styles and thus the player base has not been ignored.

That coupled with the Default league being renamed to Standard league means "hope springs eternal" and GGG will have 1 upped... no make that 101 upped D3.

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Arrowneous wrote:

39 (and counting) pages of posts in this thread and other threads may not have fallen on deaf ears. Just found an Interview Chris had with Games.on.net on May 21st. In it Chris says:

"We have quite an interesting plan for the future of Path of Exile which involves both continuing forward with the core game, new acts and so on, but also taking advantage of the league system where we can run — think of it as new servers of the game that have a fresh economy and new rulesets."

You can read the whole interview here:
http://games.on.net/2013/05/path-of-exile-launches-an-au-gateway-we-talk-to-grinding-gear-about-bandwidth-costs-lag-and-more/

So maybe the voices of millions of players crying for new leagues to broaden the play styles and thus the player base has not been ignored.

That coupled with the Default league being renamed to Standard league means "hope springs eternal" and GGG will have 1 upped... no make that 101 upped D3.

While I would love this league to happen, I have expressed a few times doubt that GGG will allow any league with increased drops etc needed to cater for a fun self found/no trading league.

Reading further down the interview Chris gave another comment about different rules in custom league.

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Chris: Right. One of the things we are planning on selling is the ability for people to customise the parameters of one of these league events, but in a way that can only make it harder. That way you get bragging rights for completing a very difficult event, rather than the ability to just set it to be too easy and make a lot of progress.

This fits with an old post of Chris's saying that no new leagues would be allowed to have easier rules.

Yes I'm generally pessimistic about anything like this self found league happening. I would love to be proved wrong as it would get me back playing again.

posted this on the wrong thread. Was meant for something else but I'll put it here:

I used to support a SFL in full. Now, though I am really starting to doubt these increased loot solutions in general. I think the issue is more about monster spike damage making very particular builds and affixes op and others unreliable. without the damage spikes we may be able to make non epic gear good enough for late game areas. From there we can leave things be. If a person wants to make it easy to get end game gear with trade then why care. I don't want it easier to get a 6l. I just want to be strong enough to hunt one myself.

And honestly, if the goal isn't to make SF easier then there isn't a point to these big ideas. Even the currency increases I proposed earlier doesn't make sense when the REAL issues are matters that hurt everyone such as, IMO, the destructive nature of failed craftings. Note that anything that involves comparing yourself to others (I have to struggle while they can just buy their gear) is silly. The top of the ladder is already well out of reach of anyone not already in it. In fact, anyone who has dreams of being 'among the best' really should be more interested in races or resetable 'ladders' than a permanent league.

Also I'm not so concerned about 'wrecking the economy' like I was before because, honestly, the economy will always adapt. Perhaps in ways that will mess up people but then that's the risks of playing Beta.


I mean just look at Jaknet's comment. Why should Chris' statement about "No leagues easier than Default" have any bearing on Self Found UNLESS the point of the league is to make the game easier in some way. If the league was actually harder than playing regularly then it wouldn't be at risk of breaking that philosophy. How many people are supporting this league only because it's a chance at 'Permanent IIQ BUFFS!'?

Even those that aren't just after easy 6Ls and uniques, are the walls that you hit at certain levels really best solved with "more IIQ/IIR?" or are they better solved by fixing the damage imbalances and formulas?

As for one of my biggest ideas-Giving an ability to go down the currency chain (i.e. sell a town portal and get 7 wisdoms)-couldn't the economy adapt to that sort of change? Does Trading REALLY need this kept out of the game without self imploding with no rescue? I'd argue that the economy will shift but can live without being forced to trade just because you found 20 Alchs and 0 Fusings.


So unless I see something unique and different than just drop boosts, I'm retracting my support for SF and just propose getting the game fixed up for everyone.

I'd love that too.

Trading is no fun at all. Let's make a notrade league with a bonus rarity for everyone (to compensate). It would be perfect.

I still think that increased IIQ/IIR is focusing in the wrong area, personally. That's why I suggested before, and stand by, the notion that simply increasing currency drop rates to allow for crafting attempts is the way to go in SFL. I don't even think the RNG element needs to be changed as long as currency drops at a rate that makes crafting gear a realistic alternative to trading for it.

I don't presume to speak for everyone here, but I'm absolutely not asking for uniques and great rares to be raining down on me, which is what I think would happen with buffing IIQ/IIR for SFL. I do think, though, that crafting, even with the insane RNG element, should be something you can turn to even as early as mid game if you're not having much luck with drops. Currency drop rates now, though, are insufficient to support that.

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This fits with an old post of Chris's saying that no new leagues would be allowed to have easier rules.

Well, it's subject to interpretation. SFL is not requesting "easier" game play, it's requesting game play that is neutral to the current trade based play in Default.

Trading is has a powerful impact on item availability to players in this game. The removal of said trading fully justifies a recompense, in order to balance the game back to its base difficulty level. It's rather hard to say what that balance would be, but it's my guess that any reasonable-seeming number we pick for base Q and base R is actually nevertheless more difficult than Default, if you subtract trading.

I'm okay with that, at least partially because while such buffs will make the low-mid game harder, they will also make the end game easier (I think). If you're interested in my reasoning on that, say so, but for now I'll tie this up.

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That's why I suggested before, and stand by, the notion that simply increasing currency drop rates to allow for crafting attempts is the way to go in SFL.

I'd say you are right about Q and R base rates not being the 'best,' however they are simple to implement. As for your recommendation for currency only and therefore crafting, have you considered that not everyone really likes crafting? The name of the league is not "Self Found Crafting League" after all...

Anyway, here's an alternative proposal to Q and R:

All drops and crafts are Lucky: Each time a drop is dropped or a craft is crafted, the outcome is rolled twice, and the better of the two alternatives is selected.

Does not impact the choice of modifiers on new items, only the magnitude of mods. Does not apply to all situations, like chromatics. If the impact on fuses is too strong, then it would need to be changed to a "chance" of being Lucky on each link.

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Courageous wrote:

I'd say you are right about Q and R base rates not being the 'best,' however they are simple to implement. As for your recommendation for currency only and therefore crafting, have you considered that not everyone really likes crafting? The name of the league is not "Self Found Crafting League" after all...

Anyway, here's an alternative proposal to Q and R:

All drops and crafts are Lucky: Each time a drop is dropped or a craft is crafted, the outcome is rolled twice, and the better of the two alternatives is selected.

Does not impact the choice of modifiers on new items, only the magnitude of mods. Does not apply to all situations, like chromatics. If the impact on fuses is too strong, then it would need to be changed to a "chance" of being Lucky on each link.

I have, in fact, considered that not everyone is interested in crafting. My position is based around preserving the RNG and luck that the developers seem to clearly want in the game. While I'm in no way suggesting that quantity and rarity bonuses eliminate these factors, I personally think that the existing ability to enhance these modifiers with gear is sufficient for SFL. The only thing I see lacking in a trade free environment is crafting due to a lack of orbs.

That said, the luck mechanic does in fact offer interesting possibilities as an alternative to trade. I do fear, however, that luck alone would be insufficient without more crafting opportunities along side it. While luck would be fine for elements of gear that are objectively better or worse than one another (pretty much only socket number and links, really), it is incapable of handling the results of transmutation, alteration, regal, alchemy, or exalted orbs as the value of these outcomes are entirely subjective. It is also impossible for luck to valuate the subjective value of natural RNG mods assigned at item drop. What, if any, other tweaks do you think would be in order to address those subjective elements of item valuation?

-EDIT- I apologize for it, but I somehow managed to miss a key element of your proposal. I missed

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Does not impact the choice of modifiers on new items, only the magnitude of mods

. I think I got a little fixated.

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Thaelyn wrote:

I still think that increased IIQ/IIR is focusing in the wrong area, personally. That's why I suggested before, and stand by, the notion that simply increasing currency drop rates to allow for crafting attempts is the way to go in SFL. I don't even think the RNG element needs to be changed as long as currency drops at a rate that makes crafting gear a realistic alternative to trading for it.

I don't presume to speak for everyone here, but I'm absolutely not asking for uniques and great rares to be raining down on me, which is what I think would happen with buffing IIQ/IIR for SFL. I do think, though, that crafting, even with the insane RNG element, should be something you can turn to even as early as mid game if you're not having much luck with drops. Currency drop rates now, though, are insufficient to support that.

I think people that doesn't want to spend time trading are also people that doesn't want to spend time crafting so I don't really agree with you.

I prefer the simple idea of increased Q and R.

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. I do fear, however, that luck alone would be insufficient without more crafting opportunities along side it.

Well, additional currency plus Luck would be fine. I agree with you fully that +Q will be in and of itself something of a negative, if only on the grounds that until they fix the labeling problem, it would just be obnoxious. They have already stated they are working on that, but who knows what will pop out?

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Does not impact the choice of modifiers on new items, only the magnitude of mod

Speaking of this, I said this because there is no obvious measure of merit for which mods to pick. That's why the Schematic proposal exists (in my sig).