Please Remove 10% Exp Loss on Death
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To me, it's all about expectations...
Let it be clear, this game is nothing but a grind&tweak fest.Sure it has some interesting mechanics, solid gameplay, some outdated graphics but it still works. Cause every one just wants to start a map, put the build/gear to the test, obliterate everything as fast as possible and farm some currency. Losing xp over death is nothing new. Several games tease you with that to make the players evolve, get skilled, grind or farm something first. You suffer, then u are rewarded. But then again, most games today are party based and MMOre action oriented. Rewards are plenty or relatively easy to achieve. Poe is not, nor ever will be its keypoint. This game is alive simply because of its massive tree and build customization, the leagues offer new tests drives to the tweaking, most players play alone and simply trade (social milestone of the game, imo) to get the endgear. Personally, i really don't care about the league's theme or storytelling. I'm more curious on how the community exploits the builds and give them some fresh ideas and mechanics. That, of course, we know will be nerfed in few months, but it rocks while it lasts. Getting to lvl 100 gives a sense of completion to most players, i get that. And yes, ~10 points on that passive tree could make the difference. If we consider you're lvl 90 you will be paying chaos and exalts for +40% damage on any gear that might be achieved simply by reaching the max cap lvl. That may be an overstatement, but it rings true on endgear. The first 20% life on early lvls are cheap as f*ck, you don't even notice. Getting +15% life on an endgear/build costs your left arm. On the other hand, if your build is failing hard by this time, you might want to reconsider tweaking or make a new build entirely. I don't mind losing XP when i die. I assume by the end of the league i'll save what currency and gear i farmed and probably delete the character. But i do understand it drags players off the game. And the game will only be alive while the community $upports it. The fact that this issue is as old and the game itself, could be a sign that something should change, maybe nerf the % penalty a bit. But i think GGG thought about the model pretty well. It's simply not expected to end all content, the thing is to keep you wanting to finish something, either it's the lvl cap, that weapon, that armor, a mirror drop, etc. Last edited by Gallatus#7540 on Aug 25, 2020, 8:12:25 PM
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" I think you are wrong. I think more people would quit the game if they removed the xp penalty than having it in. That lingering feeling of having a long term goal is keeping way more players in than out. They would hit 100 and go "now what?" and move on. Last edited by arknath#4740 on Aug 25, 2020, 8:37:31 PM
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Quite the contrary.
I don't think people would leave just by reaching lvl 100. How many are leaving with lvl 70-90 today, cause they can't afford 10 ex for that build? Heck, if you're starting this game, getting 2ex seems impossible. I remember that feeling. It would simply reward players who put in hundreds of hours. Perhaps, even preserving the characters and migrate to harder game modes. It would be a very small reward but a contribution to that sense of completion. Gameplay itself, as we all know, is fulfilled only with gear & tweak. And that has its own variables to complete and could take forever, as every league can change the passive tree and introduce new features. I would say the majority of players either follow a build posted somewhere and try to complete it (thus are introduced to the game's economy/farm system/buy add-ons), or themselves are somewhat curious to customize and explore the passive tree with hit & miss feelings. Those are the main reasons this game grabs new players and maked them stay, imo. As of today, characters are just disposable. It's grinding for the gear that matters. |
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" I just guess that no one will quit if the penality goes poof. Why should anyone? "Oh I dont loose exp anymore when I die...shit game!" "muh 100 is too eASy" apart from the fact that it would still require immense amounts of farming exp to hit 100, the penality just makes everyone targeting this goal playing like chickens. |
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I will quit once I have a lvl100 in all 24 character slots as I never play a character once it reaches lvl100 since it feels like I'm wasting xp.
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The level 100 goal doesn't justify the exp loss. In fact that goal sucks the fun out of the game: you are either forced to play safe all the time, avoiding dangerous mods wich lead to less pack size wich leads to less exp wich leads to more grind. Also you avoid all the end game: conquerors, Shaper, Syndicate, Simulacrum, you name it. You are stick to a boring grind with very little rewards.
Or you can turn to log-out macros like all the hardcore PoE players do. Or even better: you can just pay your way to lvl 100 doing rotas. Again, wich leassons are learned when you do rotas to get to lvl 100? I saw plenty of lvl 100 people with full DPS builds having like 4k HP and just caped resists as defense zerging end game content. Also, all people who hit lvl 100 don't zerg end game? They just learn that they need to improve something on their build through deaths just like all others do? Or do they just don't care and zerg all the way? "There's no thing like random one-shots in this game. You only die because you take 353,456,237 hits in 0.2 seconds."
"The best items in the game should not be crafted, they should be TRADED." - Cent, GGG |
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" Pretty sure you'd be suprised. There are lots of people who already think the game is too easy, you can accomplish all the goals this game sets for you far too quickly. And level 100 is one of them, arguably one of the hardest to reach if you exclude cheating your way there via rotas. Remove that and those people lose one big incentive to play that game. Personally for me there are 3 goals left. Aul, 100% Delirium Tier 16 maps and level 100. And the latter will most likely be the last goal to be achieved as i am not going to do rotas to get there, that would beat the point of it. If the penalty gets removed and all my chars are 100 by default then this game loses a hell of a lot of longterm playability for me and i would end up quitting much sooner than i will with penalty. Most of the "remove death penalty" faction also forget one major fact. You want the penalty removed because it prevents you from progessing your char further at a certain point. Say level 90. If you got your will and the penalty got removed then all your chars would be 100 and you would be at the exact same point where you can't progress anymore, just with 10 passive points extra which typically hardly even matter. So what's even the big benefit of removing it? I mean D3 did exactly what you are asking here, adopted the "everyone gets max level upon reaching endgame by default" that most MMOs have and it was one of the games biggest design errors. They tried to somewhat patch it with paragon levels so you can keep progessing forever but imo that's just a bandaid. The D2 and POE way is better in providing longterm motivation. Last edited by Baharoth15#0429 on Aug 26, 2020, 2:56:05 PM
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This game is about grinding gear & testing builds. Has very little demanding skills or reflexes for the players. It's not an action oriented game, and you play alone most of the time. That time should get rewarded.
Ironically, rotas is the only common multiplayer "hack" the community found it works. Even that ends quickly. Cause the drive of rotas is not XP, it's economy player based. We're there for the scarabs and maps, not the players reaching lvl 100. lol. Consider a typical mmo game: usually when you finish the story, you can join a simple guild with 5 people, you're introduce to the social aspect of the game and reach lvl cap while doing that. U know what's the most common introduction to the multiplayer aspect of PoE? Buying a freaking tabula rasa... Again, economy. Like i said, this game is grind and all its associative themes. And its economy is what keeps you craving for more. The community inflatuates and decides it's value. That i support in a game. Getting all the endgame gear and finishing a solid build is grinding & disapointing enough, to a newcomer. |
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It's a false argument that reaching max level makes people leave or not play. Some games are vry successfull because you reach the max level early and you progressively need to grind for better gear to do harder/fun content. A great example I have is DCUO. You reach max level (30) upon completing the main campaign and rescuing your mentor. From that you start with gear you can buy with gold, but it's a low combat rating gear. So you are limited to low combat rating (CR) content, like some solo missions or low/easier raids. That content reward with better CR gear and some tokens you can exchange for even better CR gear. So you have some caps you have to achieve in order to join harder, rewarding and fun content: 10 CR, 50 CR, 90 CR, so on.
Also in DCUO you have a system that more achievements you get more weapon points. Those points can be used to improve your build, but they are tied to harder content and not level, wich imho is one of the best things, because you are forced to improve w/o any negative aspect. How DCUO handles death? Well, you have infinite tries, but every time you die or your group die the bosses reset. You really can't be carried. Even the paragon system from D3 is not the main reason to keep grinding GRs. You need to level gems to improve your gear, until you reach a soft cap and need to upgrade again. If memory doesn't fail past paragon 1000 you gain one point in main attribute wich is something like +10 on main attribute. Every gem level gives that level * 5 main attribute, so yeah leveling gems to improve gear to reach higher GRs is the goal. I never measured my progress in D3 by paragons, but by GR level and that's only achievable through more Gr grind. If paragon was removed it would make little difference. It was introduced because once you hit max level you couldn't improve w/o auction house, way before GRs even existed. A poor bandaid that makes no sense nowadays. "There's no thing like random one-shots in this game. You only die because you take 353,456,237 hits in 0.2 seconds."
"The best items in the game should not be crafted, they should be TRADED." - Cent, GGG |
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" I think you are failing to see the complaint of players that dislike the penalty. We don't complain the idea that we can't get to level 100. If you locked the last levels behind completing hard content, we probably wouldn't complain (at least, I wouldn't). What we complain about is the fact that it sets us back. The feeling of simply having multiple hours of grinding just wasted is terrible, and this is what we want to get changed. Find a way to keep the penalty's objectives without that feeling of being set ages back for a random death, and a lot of us will stop complaining about it. Last edited by Angry_Casual#1628 on Aug 26, 2020, 6:16:30 PM
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