SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

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Phrazz wrote:

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Fruz wrote:

Spoiler

I don't think that anybody said anything about "not being allowed to just dislike something" at all.
However, all those players crying rivers and insulting devs and players alike, about something that they clearly lack knowledge of, spending that much time here, just because they "dislike" it ? About a video game ?

There are people that just say that they dislike it, give their reason, and then either discuss a bit and/or leave after having given their feedback.
There are people raging, throwing tantrums, in obnoxious ways, that is different, likely for different reasons.



And no, the circle jerking here has been there from the start, with or without people pointing out all the flaws and silliness that has been thrown by the whiners.

And what is your purpose here ?
Haven't you said what you came here to say ? Or are you going to say that actual discussions (still) happen in this thread ? Because that's not what has been happening, for a very long time.
And it's not what you're doing now either.

Insulting the devs? While some might have done that, again, I think they are very capable of handling it, speaking for themselves or - ignoring it.

The thing is, some people debate out of emotions. They actually feel that this content has destroyed their favorite game. They are sad. Mad, even. A game, a hobby that they have dedicated so many hours (and maybe money on) ruined by something. And when these emotional creatures are being met with "LIAR" and "VIDEO PROOF"? Of course they will go into a defensive mode - and we all know how that can turn out.

When you like something as much as some people like their favorite video game, they just don't quit and give up. They will "defend" their game. And in some eyes, ridding the lab from the face of the earth IS "defending" PoE.

But I am making my peace now. I've said what I came here to say. I just find it hard to stay away when I see the same BS arguments and "I am better than you in everything, you suck, that's why you don't like the lab"-arguments. They are a very CLEAR sign of people not understanding something. Human nature 101.

No one is bashing the devs. We are bashing one teribad piece of content that unlike most is forced to be run again and again and again and again. With pre trial that need to be run again and .....

And this is once per character every season.

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Zalhan2 wrote:

No one is bashing the devs.[...]

/ROFL

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The_Reporter wrote:

Labyrinth/Trials: Easily trivialized, poorly designed and realized, non-challenging, abhorrent garbage.

Essentially a waste of donation resources

I really like cookies. :D

I wonder if console version of PoE will have friendly fire in party play, D1 on playstation had it after all.

Having not read this thread for a day and coming back to read the last few pages, I just want to write a support ticket requesting this thread to be permanently closed.

Phrazz is right. People are absolutely allowed to dislike or even hate something and voice their opinion. To view these opinions as salty, toxic, obnoxious or whatever else and assuming these people aren't capable of running the content they dislike, is narrowminded at best.

On the flipside, those who dislike this content should also realize that their opinion is not law. People are free to disagree with you and like the content. The sheer amount of stupidly bad comparisons I've seen, D2, D3, Grim Dawn, Frogger (??) to name a few, are just not describing the issues and don't contribute at all to a possible solution.

The fact of the matter is, you're a minority by default, aren't you? People who enjoy the content won't all gather here to discuss it, and those that don't enjoy it may not even agree with the possible solutions you thought up here and still be divided amongst each other. For example, some want the ascendancy points to be free and the Lab to be for enchants only. Others don't and just want traps to be removed. Then there are those who don't want the Lab in game at all. Again, just naming a few.

If you read this from a developer point of view, put yourself in their shoes, what do you do?
It's a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation for a development team. A reaction from them here is pointless and you only have yourselves to blame for that. This thread has strayed so far from "Feedback and Suggestions" that it started out as, that if it wasn't for the OP, it would be impossible to tell it apart from a rant thread. An MMO rant thread, that is. It's better PvP than PoE has, but I digress.

Everyone participating in this thread: Let's set aside our differences, stop bashing and taunting and insulting each other at every opportunity and come together to find a real solution, one that works for everyone preferably, because the game is for all of us. It's an unrealistic goal, because you can't make everyone happy, but we can get as close as possible. If we do this and come forward with something we can all get behind, I'm sure GGG would be willing to take it into consideration. We have some great thinkers here, put those minds to work constructively in unity.

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raics wrote:

I wonder if console version of PoE will have friendly fire in party play, D1 on playstation had it after all.

Mario didn't though, so probably not...

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Xavathos wrote:

If you read this from a developer point of view, put yourself in their shoes, what do you do?
It's a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation for a development team.

Agree that the situation is not pretty. As it seems, small tweaks don't have the power to turn hate into love or at least acceptance, and massive reworks wouldn't be worth the cost involved. So, the optimal course they could take is just say take it or leave it and do a few tweaks now and then when they can spare someone, I suppose that's as much as we can hope for.

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raics wrote:

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Xavathos wrote:

If you read this from a developer point of view, put yourself in their shoes, what do you do?
It's a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation for a development team.

Agree that the situation is not pretty. As it seems, small tweaks don't have the power to turn hate into love or at least acceptance, and massive reworks wouldn't be worth the cost involved. So, the optimal course they could take is just say take it or leave it and do a few tweaks now and then when they can spare someone, I suppose that's as much as we can hope for.

Of course, it's a possible outcome that we'll all just agree to disagree and that the Lab will stay the same and those that dislike it will have to either take the bad with the good, or quit all together. But those options are perpetually open. We can do better than that, can't we?

I mean, haters for the sake of hating aside, there are those like Phrazz who come in here to really make a change for the better. He's open to both sides and has had some good input so far. I'm of the opinion that there isn't anything specifically wrong with the Lab as a whole, despite it being repetitive, but that's the nature of the beast. I am however open to changes, as PoE being an ongoing development, you'd better be. Change is inevitable moving forward.

What I'm looking for are real solutions and I'm sure I'm not alone. Like I said, I'm convinced if we come forward with a real idea we can all get behind, we'd have a much higher chance at convincing the team at GGG to consider it in a future update than counting rants and throwing at number at them. It's a challenge and I'm sure OP knew that when the thread was made, but I'm ready, are you?

Let this go into the PoE forum history books as the end of the "500 Page War", haha.

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Xavathos wrote:

Let this go into the PoE forum history books as the end of the "500 Page War", haha.

Almost 600 !

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raics wrote:

Agree that the situation is not pretty. As it seems, small tweaks don't have the power to turn hate into love or at least acceptance, and massive reworks wouldn't be worth the cost involved. So, the optimal course they could take is just say take it or leave it and do a few tweaks now and then when they can spare someone, I suppose that's as much as we can hope for.

I agree with that, it's pretty much what has been hapenning from the start.
But some are still hoping for much more, and are spamming here, being .... let's say not really civil towards others ( this is what I dislike, and probably one of the reason that I am still here actually, I'm getting baited to easily I guess ).

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Xavathos wrote:

It's a challenge and I'm sure OP knew that when the thread was made, but I'm ready, are you?

Certainly not today, it's way too hot.

You know, I'm open to compromise myself, but I wonder if it's possible to rally behind one solution as long as we got people that won't take even a 't' from 'trap'.