SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

There's really only one thing we need to know in order to move forward:

Lab is so bad.

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gathor wrote:

[...]

Wow man, you should stop getting carried away when you miss-understand what I'm saying :


I was not speaking about lab when I said what the majority of the population was doing, that statement was concerning PoE in general.
So yeah, point is : if it's what is happening outside of the lab usually, why is having it inside bad ?

And about streamers, there are streamers that do run the lab .... it means that there are probably people that like watching them doing so .....
I guess you see where this is going.

I honestly don't think that streamers hate the lab, like not as a facade I mean.

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Turtledove wrote:

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Fruz wrote:

hundreds ?
I do not check reddit, but I have definitely not seen "hundreds" of posters complaining about the lab on the forums ( I'm not checking all the posts of course ).

Yes hundreds that have posted on Feedback and Suggestions. In the 220 + threads there's over 173 individual thread authors probably multiple times that number where posters have made just one or two posts without starting a new thread.

So we are reaching something in between 200 and 300 maybe, well technically that does make hundreds I have to say, you are just over the threshold to try to make it looks like much more than it actually is, good for you.
And most of those authors have jumped into other threads to inflate it ( and probably 80%+ of the post are from the same small group of people ).

It would be funny also to count how many people have been complaining about Malachai on the forum, like really, we probably would reach "hundreds" too.
You would then noticed

Was there ever a Malachi sucks thread this big? If so link the necro thread to prove it.

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Zalhan2 wrote:

Was there ever a Malachi sucks thread this big? If so link the necro thread to prove it.

It's the first time that I see a thread being fed again and again by mostly the same ~5 people throwing the same things over and over.

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Turtledove wrote:

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Fruz wrote:

hundreds ?
I do not check reddit, but I have definitely not seen "hundreds" of posters complaining about the lab on the forums ( I'm not checking all the posts of course ).

Yes hundreds that have posted on Feedback and Suggestions. In the 220 + threads there's over 173 individual thread authors probably multiple times that number where posters have made just one or two posts without starting a new thread.

Yes it should be pretty clear by now that the backlash for the lab is significant.

"Prophecy worked well as a league, with high player engagement. Players enjoyed having new things to do during the levelling process, as well as some of the new rewards, such as the very popular fated uniques."

This seems to indicate that the lab is not effecting much.

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Xtorma wrote:

"Prophecy worked well as a league, with high player engagement. Players enjoyed having new things to do during the levelling process, as well as some of the new rewards, such as the very popular fated uniques."

This seems to indicate that the lab is not effecting much.

Steam numbers and streamers indifference to it beg to differ.

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Zalhan2 wrote:

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Xtorma wrote:

"Prophecy worked well as a league, with high player engagement. Players enjoyed having new things to do during the levelling process, as well as some of the new rewards, such as the very popular fated uniques."

This seems to indicate that the lab is not effecting much.

Steam numbers and streamers indifference to it beg to differ.

Keep on begging, but there is the truth , written by those with the access to the numbers.

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Xtorma wrote:

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Zalhan2 wrote:

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Xtorma wrote:

"Prophecy worked well as a league, with high player engagement. Players enjoyed having new things to do during the levelling process, as well as some of the new rewards, such as the very popular fated uniques."

This seems to indicate that the lab is not effecting much.

Steam numbers and streamers indifference to it beg to differ.

Keep on begging, but there is the truth , written by those with the access to the numbers.

You mean to tell by quoting this that the lead designer would have absolutely no reason to just say "all things good" to just make his company seem more attractive/viable/active to the playerbase?

Ask yourself this then my friend. The ascendancy expansion is the only one that did not include a development process post, a successsful deployment post, statistics about the lab retention, an official answer to all the question and complaints , and even in 2 q&a ALL questions lab related were ignored. Tell me now, why a developer would do such a thing? (or not do in that case).

I get it you like the game and you dont approve of it being draged to shit because a single aspect of it is rather anoying to some, but a better judgement and less fanboism never hurt anyone. Now tell me again what truth are you talking about? Cause the only one i see is a development designer talking sweet words about his game, is there something between the lines i missed?

To save you the trouble, no there isnt. If numbers were good GGG would have kept their promise and showed more about lab statistics besides those shared for the two weeks of perandus that is on the opening thread.

Im sure you didnt take the time to read it all or even if you did you easily forget, so here it is to remind you :

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Qarl wrote:

Firstly, we are interested in what types of play our players are enjoying Normal 40.3575%, Cruel 20.4968%, Merciless20.4086%, Maps12.6867%, Labyrinth 6.0503%

We'd expect the time spent in Maps to go up as the league goes on, and we imagine the time spent in the Labyrinth will also. We'll keep an eye on that!
If we look at high-end farming areas, we can get a picture of what players at the end game are doing. Again, these refer to the last seven days. The Perandus League has allowed The Solaris Temple Level 1 to make the grade as a farming zone:
Maps 3,935,376, Merciless Dried Lake 1,188,825, Merciless Docks 732,380, Merciless Solaris 1667,079, Merciless Labyrinth 235,415

I hope you've enjoyed looking at this information. We will share more statistics later, such as a breakdown of popular items and skills

Now if you are not completely brainwashed you can easily answer a simple question, why they still have not gave out any stats on the issue? Why not keep their promises?

Have you even bothered to look at labyrinth ladders at all? Have you even checked the HC lab ladders at all? Im sure you havent and probably havent payed any attentioned to the numbers even in the past.

And now the important stuff GGG wants to hide and ignores.

On 7/6/2016 only 4 days into the prophecy league, the total number of eligible players for the lab ladders were 6930 (ACROSS ALL LEAGUES hc/sc/prohc/prosc). Hear this now, the steam numbers for that period (meaning the actual total player number is WAY bigger) was 21k players.

3/7/2016 1 month into the prophecy league. Lab ladders 8.8k players. Steam charts 14.4k players.

Let see what yesterday's numbers where shall we (10/8/2016), 2months and 1 week into the league. 3026 total runners on the ladders. Peak number on steam charts for that day? 6.5k players.


If you dont suck at math and reason here are the next variables you have to take into account. From the ladders there are duplicates from the same account to different difficulties as well as different leagues. From those numbers around 20-25% based on their timing are not even in the slightest there for anything else than taking a subclass. And ofcourse cause im fair ill say that the numbers could be a bit higher cause some people are not eligible for them. So taking that into account we got around 1/3 up to 2/5 of the total population on the steam charts that was interested in running the labyrinth IF the steam numbers were real. But they are not arent they? Cause there are a lot of people also having the standalone client. Lets take the best possible scenario for lab retention and only say that the standalone client has exactly the same numbers with steam players for the days chosen.

So respectively thats : 7/6/16 - 42k active players, 7k of which like running the labyrinth. 16%.

3/7/16 - 28.8 active players, 8.8 lab runners. 30.5%

10/8/16 - 13k active players, 3k on lab ladders. 23%

Again have in mind that those are the best possible estimations for lab retention, without accounting those who do it just for the ascendancies (meaning actual numbers for players who ENJOY the lab are even lower). If that "estimation" bothers and somehow makes all this not believable enough, you instantly accept that the steam numbers depict the whole playerbase or that the steam players are more than the standalone client. (remember this before posting anything that may come out as ....)

Pretty underwhelming if you ask me. Another interesting part is that while the total numbers decline the lab lovers are somewhat more steady, meaning GGG actually lost people due to the lab. But again why do they not talk about it? Hmmm, ah yes, because everything is fine there is no issue whatsever and blah blah.

I still dont know why they act so stubborn, making alternatives or even decoupling ascendancies from the lab would literally hurt noone. Here we are now, 5months into the ascendancy expansion and still no word on anythiing remotely related to lab, the reasoning behind : lab has to much heat and might cause GGG to catch fire, GGG doenst give a fuck, GGG staff are ostriches, all of them in different degrees. No matter what it is, the issue would have been dead by long time if they had the balls to give a clear answer and not the dishonest bullshit they spread around from time to time.

So ill ask again, whats the truth you are talking about? Cause GGG's dishonesty is all over the place.

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Xtorma wrote:

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Zalhan2 wrote:

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Xtorma wrote:

"Prophecy worked well as a league, with high player engagement. Players enjoyed having new things to do during the levelling process, as well as some of the new rewards, such as the very popular fated uniques."

This seems to indicate that the lab is not effecting much.

Steam numbers and streamers indifference to it beg to differ.

Keep on begging, but there is the truth , written by those with the access to the numbers.

how is citing non propaganda sources vs magic numbers you made up begging? and begging for what?
I don't even play anymore.

Spending 10 minutes a day in a thread I posted in like 3 months ago is just kind of still fun especially during breaks while watching TI.