Petition to un-nerf revenants

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rojomacofe wrote:

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Saltychipmunk wrote:

actually just fixing the ai on most mobs as specters would be a good start.

I think this is a different matter. Ofc everyone has suggestions of how to improve the summoner build, and we could be here suggesting 1000 different things.
The point here, is that people spent some time leveling a character, and in the end the result was crap, not because of the planing, nor the decisions made on items and tree, but rather on a huge nerf on the main "weapon" of the build. And even bigger problem is that this nerf is due to people complaining that they are dying against a mob (what would they expect the mob to do? give them kisses? run away in fear? just die when they look at him?)

Imagine a necromancer that did 75% of your life pool in damage with one volley of attacks while still summoning other units to attack you and causing corpse explosions as well. THAT is why revenants were nerfed. It was a very good reason.

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Say_Ten wrote:

"Where were the revenants before the release, they didnt exist"

Exactly. This shouldn't make or break your build.

For what it's worth the day before this was fixed, I did notice that they were doing way too much damage compared to everything else in the level in merciless difficulty.

and that makes perfect sense considering they were a special mob with a limited spawn rate

there are quite a few examples of a so called *big* monster that has a lower mob density but better stats.

the revenant were just one of them but technically the knitted horrors , pocketed giants , maelstroms, and chaos golems are all like this.


the thing that people are forgetting here is
1 specter based summoner builds were not that popular prior to 2.0. a very nice chunk were just srs and still are srs. so i can ask something similar Where were the specter summoners?

2 2.0 has huge power creep. i can name tons of builds that got massive boosts in clear speed so what was satisfactory in 1.3 will not have the same impact here.

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Timewar9 wrote:

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rojomacofe wrote:

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Saltychipmunk wrote:

actually just fixing the ai on most mobs as specters would be a good start.

I think this is a different matter. Ofc everyone has suggestions of how to improve the summoner build, and we could be here suggesting 1000 different things.
The point here, is that people spent some time leveling a character, and in the end the result was crap, not because of the planing, nor the decisions made on items and tree, but rather on a huge nerf on the main "weapon" of the build. And even bigger problem is that this nerf is due to people complaining that they are dying against a mob (what would they expect the mob to do? give them kisses? run away in fear? just die when they look at him?)

Imagine a necromancer that did 75% of your life pool in damage with one volley of attacks while still summoning other units to attack you and causing corpse explosions as well. THAT is why revenants were nerfed. It was a very good reason.

guess what specter revs dont get to do

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Saltychipmunk wrote:

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Say_Ten wrote:

"Where were the revenants before the release, they didnt exist"

Exactly. This shouldn't make or break your build.

For what it's worth the day before this was fixed, I did notice that they were doing way too much damage compared to everything else in the level in merciless difficulty.

and that makes perfect sense considering they were a special mob with a limited spawn rate

there are quite a few examples of a so called *big* monster that has a lower mob density but better stats.

the revenant were just one of them but technically the knitted horrors , pocketed giants , maelstroms, and chaos golems are all like this.


the thing that people are forgetting here is
1 specter based summoner builds were not that popular prior to 2.0. a very nice chunk were just srs and still are srs. so i can ask something similar Where were the specter summoners?

2 2.0 has huge power creep. i can name tons of builds that got massive boosts in clear speed so what was satisfactory in 1.3 will not have the same impact here.

2.0 has had a huge amount of power creep for summoners as a whole as well, don't make it seem like summoners didn't have significant changes either.

minion damage is a MORE multiplier now
minion speed also applies cast\attackspeed, not just movement speed now
Jewels can roll minion damage, as well as other useful stats for summoners.

Generosity no longer increases the % aura re-severed.

Sure there are many other changes that increased the power level of summoners, were revenants as op as burning miscreations once were, no but damn if they weren't super freaking close to it.

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Timewar9 wrote:

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rojomacofe wrote:

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Saltychipmunk wrote:

actually just fixing the ai on most mobs as specters would be a good start.

I think this is a different matter. Ofc everyone has suggestions of how to improve the summoner build, and we could be here suggesting 1000 different things.
The point here, is that people spent some time leveling a character, and in the end the result was crap, not because of the planing, nor the decisions made on items and tree, but rather on a huge nerf on the main "weapon" of the build. And even bigger problem is that this nerf is due to people complaining that they are dying against a mob (what would they expect the mob to do? give them kisses? run away in fear? just die when they look at him?)

Imagine a necromancer that did 75% of your life pool in damage with one volley of attacks while still summoning other units to attack you and causing corpse explosions as well. THAT is why revenants were nerfed. It was a very good reason.

Imagine a white monster that could spawn in pac's from underground directly next to you with a very strong melee attack that could effectively 1 shot you, and people would abandon maps that they found them in if they were lucky enough to escape from. Imagine if they stayed in the game even after many complaints, and people just said build tankier or avoide them until it got nerfed after over a year.

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lobex wrote:

Imagine a white monster that could spawn in pac's from underground directly next to you with a very strong melee attack that could effectively 1 shot you, and people would abandon maps that they found them in if they were lucky enough to escape from. Imagine if they stayed in the game even after many complaints, and people just said build tankier or avoide them until it got nerfed after over a year.

Lol, no imagine there being a ranged mob that literally can 1 shot you, not only can they 1 shot you, the can summon adds to keep you occupied while you try to position yourself.

Now imagine they also made said mobs that spawn from underground less deadly because they realized it was a mistake to have it like that.

[Removed by Support]


OP mobs should not be left OP just because 1 class\playstyle benefits from them being OP. How does that not sound stupid to you?

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Timewar9 wrote:

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rojomacofe wrote:

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Saltychipmunk wrote:

actually just fixing the ai on most mobs as specters would be a good start.

I think this is a different matter. Ofc everyone has suggestions of how to improve the summoner build, and we could be here suggesting 1000 different things.
The point here, is that people spent some time leveling a character, and in the end the result was crap, not because of the planing, nor the decisions made on items and tree, but rather on a huge nerf on the main "weapon" of the build. And even bigger problem is that this nerf is due to people complaining that they are dying against a mob (what would they expect the mob to do? give them kisses? run away in fear? just die when they look at him?)

Imagine a necromancer that did 75% of your life pool in damage with one volley of attacks while still summoning other units to attack you and causing corpse explosions as well. THAT is why revenants were nerfed. It was a very good reason.

Yes, they were difficult, and should that be a problem? Why the hell are you leveling your character? Just to say that you are the boss amongst the weak?
I want to beat the game and to level up in a difficult environment. I think the nerfs in Normal and Cruel are acceptable, since they don't really matter (to be honest, don't even understand the concept of cruel), but in merciless I would like to test my character to it's limits. I don't want just to test it against big bosses, but also against common mobs like revenants, devourers, the new tail guy that stuns like hell..... I don't want to do a map just trying to find the boss and kill him, I also want to experience troubles in the common mobs. I think POE was and still is like that, but Iam afraid with so many nerfs we are going from a game that is to beat mobs to a game that is to beat big bosses.

@rojomacofe

Plays in SC, complains about lack of challenge. Now thats a funny one right there...

I know or care nothing about summoners, but this mob has been nerfed too much. Previously was very dangerous, but now barely does anything. It needs to be buffed again, something in the middle, please.

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Patch Notes...
Stygian Revenants now
1. fire three lightning projectiles (down from five), and
2. deal 30% less damage with them.
3. Their revived minions now explode for 20% less damage.

These monsters were extremely efficient at killing players. This purpose of this change is to prevent mass extinction of exiles, rather than to nerf them as spectres.

2 & 3. Makes sense to me. Less damage to players.
1. Doesn't make sense. Shotgunning is gone, this has very little effect on players, except parties and summoner. The former gets no sympathy and the latter doesn't want nerfs.

Conclusions:
1. Keep the 30% and 20% damage nerfs.
2. Return number of projectiles to 5.

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goetzjam wrote:

@rojomacofe

Plays in SC, complains about lack of challenge. Now thats a funny one right there...

I don't complain about the lack of challenge. And in fact I play in HC. For 2.0, since I didn't play the beta nor watch any videos about act4, I decided that I should first see how it goes in SC. Good that I made that decision, I lost 1 time against malachai in Normal, and at that time I didn't even understood what hit me. Half of the season, when I feel I am ready, I will go to HC. Hope to find you there :).

Last time I lost in HC was in the race for the armour (tempest/bloodline). I beat the Dominus in the palace (in a party, honestely I was very useless, my zombies were just meat targets), and I only didn't get the complete armour set because I didn't get the masters quests (2 missing). On that race I lost against a stupid bunch of blue devourers with the totem bloodline. At that time ofc I became upset, but in any moment I thought start writing in reddit asking GGG to nerf those f... bastards.

If you think that the correct aproach to solving your problems is just to go cry to make things easier, then I think we don't have much to talk about, since we have different views of life. I don't know what is the correct one, but I believe you and me want the best for the game, and that is the reason why I am giving my opinion in this forum.