1.0 Passive Tree

Stop complaining because you have to move through the center of the tree, its not that expensive to move along the outside, and in many cases is better.
Examples:
-A typical CI character has the evasion and energy shield nodes next to ghost reaver and a connection through the center between the two sides of the witch tree. For her its cheaper to pick up US+IR by moving along the dex side of the tree.
-A typical murauder would have to invest just ONE more point to get to eldritch battery via the outside of the tree from elemental adaptation instead of throught he center, and he walks by a lot better life nodes (like devine toughness, 16%), and if your goal was Static blows its actually much cheaper.
-Static blows from a bloodmagic duelist: Same price
-Life based evasion ranger who wants ranged attack totems for whatever reason: you are one of the few examples of builds who suffer, but you are a wierd build, think about grabbing iron reflexes and unwavering, from that point its cheaper

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Kirielis wrote:

But this is the problem I have with it: Scion is STRICTLY BETTER than any other class for a build which passes through the "normal" class's starting area and goes toward the centre. There should not be STRICTLY BETTER for builds that hit multiple classes' starting areas.

Every other class is already strictly better for builds that exclusively use nodes from its own part of the tree. How is the Scion any different?

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DolphinCannon wrote:

Stop complaining because you have to move through the center of the tree, its not that expensive to move along the outside (...)

Yeah, stop complaining. Just start over as a Scion. Problem solved !

/sarcasm

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Velkor wrote:

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DolphinCannon wrote:

Stop complaining because you have to move through the center of the tree, its not that expensive to move along the outside (...)

Yeah, stop complaining. Just start over as a Scion. Problem solved !

/sarcasm

Or learn to count (apparently most people don't really realize how many nodes they're spending travelling along the inner circle of the current skill tree).

Why are people complaining about this? It just changes the paradigm of the game slightly. I'd like to be able to move through the centre on the way to other characters.

On one hand this limits the build diversity a little bit, but reinforces each character's uniqueness. Time to change slightly. I like these changes.

Listen, for those of this community that don't like this, you're welcome to go elsewhere and form misbegotten opinions of other games. Time to make an effort. Plenty of theory crafting to do, and who knows, probably it will spawn new ideas.

Time to complain about something new, I guess, eh?

One other thing, Scion is adept at all things, master of none. It's a good class, but not great.

Chris has said on reddit that the passive tree will change and that what we are seeing is an old snapshot.

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Rogomatic wrote:

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Idioticus wrote:

you didn't see the part where the witch had to use over 50 points to get over the tree. that's MUCH MUCH more than previously.

I've got no idea what you're talking about -- so I guess I haven't seen the part, and to my knowledge no-one has actually seen the final version of the passive tree anyhow.

But tinkered a bit with the present version: it currently takes 23 points for the Witch to go to Berseking through the middle, and 31 to do it on the perimeter. Doesn't sound as a terribly large difference to me. People underestimate how terribly node-inefficient the center of the three is.

well youve just shown its vastly more efficient than going around the outside. 8 points when the total to reach is 23? So another 1/3 of the points? thats a lot. Now get that node, and get vaal pact, and get mind and matter, how many points you out now taking the outside of the tree?

Basically it will force people to stay in their area and their neighbours areas more, we all know those builds, the majority of the good, fun, exciting, inspired builds went all across the tree and now to do that you have to be es to cross the top of the middle and not waste those points, and when you get to the other side theres no way to go down and get vaal pact and anything else in that direction you might have wanted, and uve spent more points.

Or just roll Scion for all your characters, ek marauder? dont work now better roll scion. Dagger witch? nah, fucked, roll scion. Wander shadow? gfto, roll scion. Point blank life Ranger? Yep, back in your box kd lang, bimbo wins for templar access. Bow marauder? fuck off, roll scion. ci claw duelist? get your coat, then roll scion. Discharge templar? Roll scion. Oh btw scion isnt actually as good for these builds as your old classes used to be, sry bout that. But good news is we dont have silly matchups now like a freeze pulse marauder. Oh wait sry we do, that one still works.

Yes the middle was a point killer, for sure, but not as much as the outside for a lot of builds. People dont underestimate it, they calculated the expense and decided while a heavy cost it was the way to go and they use it, an awful lot of builds use it. The heavy cost was the balance to its power, to take it out just shuts down vast areas of builds, builds who were already sacrificing to go that way, its not like all these builds were op and this was a problem, theyre being fucked purely to make room for the new class, which at best adds nothing by itself and just adopts some of the builds that were destroyed by adding her in.

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Vraarz wrote:

I dont get why would they even make tree like that for testing?

To test what? How to limit builds and make everyone go scion?

Chris specifically stated the 1.0 build was for media week and the showing of the game. It's obvious from the video.

Just look at the Scion he was on...6L, all 20% gems etc along with the /warp commands. Yea obviously those are dev tools but the same could be said of the tree. They put it in so he could show it off.

Now I too am concerned if they do not connect the sides in a similar fashion as they were. However if they don't do something then whats the point of the new "jack of all trades" class. As of right now all classes are hybrids or at least the ones that follow the cookie cutter builds.

This certainly would make the grouping dynamic a bit different. You would be getting back to the trinity of MMO's...tank, healer, dps.

So yeah I'd like to know how it will look. We all are getting free respecs so we'll see I guess.

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Rogomatic wrote:

Or learn to count (apparently most people don't really realize how many nodes they're spending travelling along the inner circle of the current skill tree).

Sigh.

Its not as simple as "counting". Some of the things that are now possible with some classes, will simply be impossible or only possible with the Scion.

For example, I have this very fun hybrid witch that use both firestorm and minions. On the other side of the Passive Tree Inner Circle, there's 3 passive points extremely valuable for a Firestorm caster, they increase spell duration by 45%, effectively increasing damage done with Firestorm by 45%.



There's no way I could pick up those extremely valuable passives points by taking any other route.

Same could said for any of the outside classes using Iron Grip (no, the support gem is not an "ok" replacement since it takes up a valuable support gem slot), Vaal Pack, Necromantic Aegis, Conduit, Leadership, etc.

And to those that say that those classes shouldn't be able to pick up those keystones to begin with... That this passive tree will simply force you to pick up the right class for the passives you want. Then, be prepared by a massive influx of Scions in the game. Possibly more Scions than every other classes combined. Is that what you really want ?

Let's just hope they add some sort of alternative route to templar/mara(and witch) - not just completely cut it off. It'll be so inefficient for my build, I don't think I could build around it.. so my build/character will be useless, and that's a real shit-go..as it's perfectly optimized for hardcore.


I mean, if I can't get to templar/mara anymore, how am I going to sustain my very important regen nodes? Goodbye weapon ele nodes! goodbye my precious life nodes! and last but not least..Goodbye amplify which my build heavily relies on (RoA)...

Reroll scion?