Self-Found (League) [Thread outdated!]

"

Qarak wrote:

I will start changing my plans if lots of players are demanding something with this perseverance

See our problems? Want feedback? We already gave you tons of feedback. Now it's up to the devs decide if it's worth a new league or just some tweaks that will make many players leave

Why would anyone quit the game just because of a new league? Do people really like controlling how others play the game that much? Nobody is forcing anyone to play self found league.

If there would be a huge player divide by making a self found league, then that just proves its justified if it really becomes that popular. Self found would definitely not be a walk in the park. Nobody would be able to RMT their way through the game's difficulty, or start out and trade low tier orbs for great leveling gear they can rush early game with. The haves would be the players who truly earned it, and didn't get their items by playing a barter economy or RMT. They FOUND THEM.

You figure GGG would be looking for a way to stick it to the RMTers, and making a self-found league would be the perfect way to do it. The economy is already broken because of RMT, and I'd rather have no economy than a broken RMT economy with no expedited method of trading.

"

MrSmiley21 wrote:

Why would anyone quit the game just because of a new league? Do people really like controlling how others play the game that much? Nobody is forcing anyone to play self found league.

English is not my first language. I meant the opposite: many players will quit if they won't see this damn league or at least some tweaks heading to the guys playing alone, sorry ;(

"

Qarak wrote:

"

MrSmiley21 wrote:

Why would anyone quit the game just because of a new league? Do people really like controlling how others play the game that much? Nobody is forcing anyone to play self found league.

English is not my first language. I meant the opposite: many players will quit if they won't see this damn league or at least some tweaks heading to the guys playing alone, sorry ;(

I'm personally getting bored, and a bit frustrated at the same time with this economy. The only items worth selling are big ticket items. Or at best the occasional currency swap, exalt for fusings or chaos, etc.

In the past week I've given over 50 unique items away for free in global. Why? Can't sell them. Gave away uniques ranging from redbeaks to auseize, goldwyrm, Infernal mantles, or anything of similar value. Part of the reason I did it was to display my utter frustration with this economy, and to help some new players out. If someone asked why I was giving away all that stuff for free, I'd tell them this economy sucks, and those items have zero barter value without a massive amount of legwork tracking down a buyer.

I helped a player out yesterday with a ton of gear, enough for him to make it to merciless actually. And that gear to me was all junk that I couldn't sell. Its amazing how much someone would value the said gear, but just aren't willing to pay anything for it. If its not worth at least 10 chaos orbs in a quick sell, its junk to me.

Just to put into perspective, I had an armor with +82 life & 30% in 2 resists. Put a price in trade for 12 chaos, no takers. Sat on it for over 2 weeks while occasionally trying to sell it. No takers. Eventually I gave the freaking thing away for free to that same noob in the above paragraph. If a 5L with life + dual resists isn't a quick sell for 12 chaos, then I honestly dunno what the point of an economy even is?

I got anger management issues, and I got a punching bag near my desk, and more than one time, I've beat the fucking shit out of this punching bag over being angry over the economy in this game. It makes me want to throw kittens off a roof top.

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

Trading barely provides an advantage at all.

Gonna have to call you out on that, Scrotie (as others have already done).

As I mentioned in the suggestion thread, buying your gear is a path to a guaranteed upgrade. You know exactly what you're getting each and every time you trade (barring stupid people who don't bother to look).

100 IIQ and 300 IIR may get you a healthy supply of drops, but they offer no guarantee that you're going to be able to find an item to improve your character. Trade, on the other hand, does precisely this. You trade for direct upgrades when you need to improve your own gear, and you sell the drops your MF gets you and stockpile orbs for further direct purchases of known quantities.

If you don't think certainty is an enormous advantage that trade has over self found, then I say you're blind, sir.

If a duelist dual wield cleaver finds a shavs in a self found league, does he make a sound?

"

highbriguy wrote:

If a duelist dual wield cleaver finds a shavs in a self found league, does he make a sound?

Yes, but I'd imagine it's a very personal sound that most people wouldn't want to hear... (Kreygasm)

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

"

FarmerTed wrote:

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

Trading barely provides an advantage at all.

This is patently false. I can buy gear for a few chaos here and there that is far superior to the stuff I find or could possibly craft. For average players, trading is a huge advantage. For people at or near the top, the benefits of trading are marginal. If I cleared my whole stash, I would be hard pressed to buy a 6L anything.

That you could possibly craft? I believe that. However, you could easily farm something just as good with the same effort that it would take for you to farm 1 Chaos (assuming at least 300 IIR). One quirk with the crafting system is that Chaos use is pretty much discouraged until you get to around level 70 maps, when they become the single most important map crafting ingredient; trading your Chaos Orbs away in Cruel or Merciless provides a nice short-term benefit, but you'll be missing them later when they reach their crafting potential. Jewelers, Fusings and Chromatics, on the other hand, have extreme utility early on and the idea of trading them away for short-term gain in Cruel or Merciless is silly.

Unfortunately, things fall apart because of assumtions you make. I have a real life with real responsibilities that limit my game time in general and make uninterrupted game playing very limited. Wasting time with an MF dual sporker build I detest to find gear so I can play the character I want to play, reminds me of a South Park episode and seems just as ludicrous. I don't even have gear to add to 300IIR much less the IIQ to make it worthwhile.
Speaking of which, the chances of me getting to level 70 maps is so minuscule that there is basically no opportunity cost to me trading them away at any time, which does not matter since I don't trade anyways. I have bought two items, and felt like a loser while I was doing it.

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

"

FarmerTed wrote:

So we prefer to play a slightly different game where crafting is achievable for us.

Crafting becomes achievable when you reach a relative plateau in development. As long as you are continually upgrading through non-crafting means, crafting doesn't make sense; why invest in an item which could be gone tomorrow, when you could save your orbs to craft on something which comes later (or trade for the thing which comes later, but lose some of your ability to improve it)?

Getting rid of trading wouldn't magically solve that problem. Remove trading and increase drop rates... ... and players would still hoard their orbs, and only use them when they need to in order to progress, and even then only the minimum necessary to get by.

It's only when players reach milestones that they actually begin crafting voluntarily. If they have reached the stage where max links on gloves is possible, and their gloves are a stronger item than their helm or boots, they'll 4L their gloves, but no one burns Jeweler's or Fusings trying to 3L their gloves. If they've found a decent chest and can 5L their chest, they'll start trying to do so, but no one tries this before they find a really strong chest late in Cruel at the earliest. If they've found The Chest They'll Wear For the Entire Forseeable Future (preferably unique) in Act 3 Merci or low maps, they'll start trying to 6L it.

If you want to increase actual crafting, the solution isn't removing the ability to trade; it's making the game harder. Force players to use those orbs before they hit milestones, and they will; don't force them, and they won't. It's that simple.

"

snapple99 wrote:

If you mean "selling" then I wouldn't know because I have no intention of ever dirtying myself in the whole trading mess.

Yet, despite your lack of experience, you feel compelled to assert your opinion. Chances are you haven't played to maps, and thus don't appreciate the value of a Chaos. Most of my reply to FarmerTed's post applies to yours as well.

Obviously people don't craft just to spend money. However, since I don't trade, I do craft upgrades and try to get 3-4 links ear. Given the poor items I tend to have, good links are absolutely a necessity. Sure I would like to save orbs for the end game, but if I am not going to get there, it is idiotic to hoard orbs. I finally have a level 70 and I have managed to 6S a chest I want. Hopefully I will be able to 5L or 6L it. Then, the best I can hope for is to get a great roll from an alt orb. I don't have enough alchs and chaos to hope for the best and max tier affixes on a blue will beat the yellow I am wearing. Regal or exalts? Pretty sure they are myths. A unique end game chest? You are a funny guy. So yes, I would prefer a self found league with better currency drops.

As for your comments to somebody else about grouping: average player, limited time, blah blah - it doesn't work. Add in morons/jerks (too many IRL already) to my recreation time that I need to sift through? If GGG were willing to give me names and addresses so I could deal with them IRL after they ruined my virtual time and I might consider PUG's. Otherwise, I play this game precisely because there is no need to interact.

"

highbriguy wrote:

If a duelist dual wield cleaver finds a shavs in a self found league, does he make a sound?

that might be a good occasion to try out a low life duelist :)

"

Thaelyn wrote:

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

Trading barely provides an advantage at all.

Gonna have to call you out on that, Scrotie (as others have already done).

As I mentioned in the suggestion thread, buying your gear is a path to a guaranteed upgrade. You know exactly what you're getting each and every time you trade (barring stupid people who don't bother to look).

100 IIQ and 300 IIR may get you a healthy supply of drops, but they offer no guarantee that you're going to be able to find an item to improve your character. Trade, on the other hand, does precisely this. You trade for direct upgrades when you need to improve your own gear, and you sell the drops your MF gets you and stockpile orbs for further direct purchases of known quantities.

If you don't think certainty is an enormous advantage that trade has over self found, then I say you're blind, sir.

Exactly...

Trading = every item you could wish for is available, just grind currency
Self Found = If what you want doesn't drop you will never get it.

Trading = easier than self found.

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

Trading barely provides an advantage at all.

Grouping in maps to split map cost? Pretty huge advantage.

Grouping with a dedicated Culling MF, when you have zero IIQ/IIR yourself? Also pretty huge advantage.

Trading? People are not that stupid; items worth a Chaos to you tend to be traded for... around 1 Chaos. In a way it's an intrinsically PvP system, if you're buying then the seller keeps you from benefiting too much, if you're selling then the buyer keeps you from benefiting too much. This isn't Diablo 3 where trading means a better alternative to vendoring; if you try that you'll be frustrated spending hours in trade chat with no one willing to buy your crap, because only good items are worth trading. It's value for value in PoE.

I have no doubt that many of you are frustrated solo players. I understand, because there are some extreme disadvantages to solo play in this game. But scapegoating trading for huge advantages it doesn't provide is just wrong.

Furthermore, even if you were right, even if the main leagues had all these problems... the answer is not to run away like cowards. Stand and fight; if you think something is wrong with the game, suggest that it be fixed for all leagues. The Self-Found League isn't about fixing the game — it's about playing a different game on the same servers. Fuck that shit. We're all in the same boat here, so if you want something fixed, fix it for everyone.

I cannot believe this post exists...mind=blown.

I would like to direct you to this thread where a guy who flips is musing over how to spend his 3000 Exalts. THREE THOUSAND. Here is his trade thread.

Now tell me "Trading barely provides an advantage at all." ...wow