Self-Found (League) [Thread outdated!]

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MierenEronaile wrote:

I like equality in the people im playing with personally.

You won't get that in SFL. People who roll MF builds, and people who grinded for weeks and reached end-game maps with MF gear will still be way more time efficient than you. It won't even let you use exalted orbs without feeling bad about it either, since top players will still use them way more efficiently. And god forbid you ever get a mirror on SFL.

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Novalisk wrote:

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MierenEronaile wrote:

I like equality in the people im playing with personally.

You won't get that in SFL. People who roll MF builds, and people who grinded for weeks and reached end-game maps with MF gear will still be way more time efficient than you. It won't even let you use exalted orbs without feeling bad about it either, since top players will still use them way more efficiently. And god forbid you ever get a mirror on SFL.

No they wont. I am one of those people.

Also, I see some pretty obvious uses if I happened to get a mirror, mostly for a 6l chest once I have one, especially if I want to use it for multiple characters as well as my main. Mirror the mains colors(especially if it required weird colors for the item type) and then you are all good to mess around with the original.

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Wraeclastian wrote:

You don't really want a self-found league, you want an ez-mode league. .

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Wraeclastian wrote:

It might be slightly more difficult to progress to endgame maps and such but other than that it would just take a little extra time farming.

So, which is it, easier or more difficult? Do you even know, have you ever played sefl-found to end-game or for any part of the game?

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Novalisk wrote:

It wouldn't address them at all for people who want a better self-found experience on standard, hardcore, new softcore ladder, and new hardcore ladder.

Fixing the main game and creating SFL are totally separate issues. As GGG seem to want a trading game, I don't see them ever accommodating those of us who wish for SFL, in the main leagues, with anything other than lip service.

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Novalisk wrote:

You won't get that in SFL. People who roll MF builds, and people who grinded for weeks and reached end-game maps with MF gear will still be way more time efficient than you. It won't even let you use exalted orbs without feeling bad about it either, since top players will still use them way more efficiently. And god forbid you ever get a mirror on SFL

I can't speak for everyone who wants SFL but you only have to read through the main SFL threads to see the majority don't give a damn about others abilities or achievements. Most also don't care about ladders either. As far as exalts and mirrors, what do you think people will do with those - or any other 'crafting' item - in a league where trading is disabled, just sit on them and worry! Stop applying the trading game play style to SFL, they require completely different mind-sets.

a mirror in a sfl could still have use... mirroring a one handed weapon or a ring. or you could mirror a 6L and use it on different characters... i could think of plenty of uses..

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Kellog wrote:

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Novalisk wrote:

It wouldn't address them at all for people who want a better self-found experience on standard, hardcore, new softcore ladder, and new hardcore ladder.

Fixing the main game and creating SFL are totally separate issues. As GGG seem to want a trading game, I don't see them ever accommodating those of us who wish for SFL, in the main leagues, with anything other than lip service.

A trading game doesn't necessarily mean trading will be more profitable than playing, nor does it mean hours of trading in order to sell your items. It can mean you simply put items you don't need up on sale effortlessly, and someone who does need them may offer you crafting materials for it. Trading isn't very good now, but don't take it as an indication of what trading is, especially considering GGG has been talking about a trade revamp for a while.

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Kellog wrote:

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Novalisk wrote:

You won't get that in SFL. People who roll MF builds, and people who grinded for weeks and reached end-game maps with MF gear will still be way more time efficient than you. It won't even let you use exalted orbs without feeling bad about it either, since top players will still use them way more efficiently. And god forbid you ever get a mirror on SFL

I can't speak for everyone who wants SFL but you only have to read through the main SFL threads to see the majority don't give a damn about others abilities or achievements. Most also don't care about ladders either.

How else would people experience "slow progress" without comparing themselves to others?

If the game is built in a way that forces you to farm docks and lunaris instead of progressing into maps, with the only alternative being spamming tradechat and maintaining forum threads, then that's a problem with the game that should be addressed by an actual solution (and according to GGG's recent words about changing MF and revamping trading they are working on it).

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Kellog wrote:

As far as exalts and mirrors, what do you think people will do with those - or any other 'crafting' item - in a league where trading is disabled, just sit on them and worry! Stop applying the trading game play style to SFL, they require completely different mind-sets.

Yes, you will sit on exalts until you get an item that's "worthy" of exalting. you won't suddenly use exalts on mediocre gear just because you can't trade exalts away.
Mirrors would be close to useless, since the whole point of them is to duplicate gear from other players. Unless you're dual wielding (i guess rings work too) there's almost no point in using a mirror in self-found since you can just transfer gear to your alts. It would be incredibly frustrating to get a mirror in SFL.

Are there even that many people still playing PoE at any given time as there are replies in this thread? :-D

@Novalisk

Im not sure if you read it, but I did point out that mirroring a chest to preserve, say, 5 or 6 off colors you farmed for months to get but now want to use the chest for alts would be a viable use of a mirror in SFL.

As well as the two you mentioned, that makes three pretty useful options for a mirror even in SFL.

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MierenEronaile wrote:

@Novalisk

Im not sure if you read it, but I did point out that mirroring a chest to preserve, say, 5 or 6 off colors you farmed for months to get but now want to use the chest for alts would be a viable use of a mirror in SFL.

As well as the two you mentioned, that makes three pretty useful options for a mirror even in SFL.

That's still a very niche use. Those 3 combined don't even begin to compare to the power of Mirror in other leagues.

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Novalisk wrote:

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MierenEronaile wrote:

@Novalisk

Im not sure if you read it, but I did point out that mirroring a chest to preserve, say, 5 or 6 off colors you farmed for months to get but now want to use the chest for alts would be a viable use of a mirror in SFL.

As well as the two you mentioned, that makes three pretty useful options for a mirror even in SFL.

That's still a very niche use. Those 3 combined don't even begin to compare to the power of Mirror in other leagues.

Yea, you are right about that, I was just trying to show it did still have a use.

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Reinhart wrote:

1) Which kind of roadblocks do you speak of when leveling up a character to 70?

2) What are your goals in this game?

In my case, the answer to both questions is really the same. Right now I'm simply looking to be able to complete Merciless.

I'm a shit build crafter, so I use builds found online that are proven. Many of those builds one can find online do use a healthy selection of uniques, but the ones I use only really rely on some of the more common build enabling ones (which I have found). The roadblocks I've been facing are due to the fact that my equipment isn't sufficiently strong to support these proven builds. Items that I get as drops generally fall into 3 categories: 1) no mods useful to my build or socket arrangements that fail to improve my character; 2) incremental improvement to defense at a large cost to offensive capability; or 3) incremental offensive increase for dramatic survivability sacrifice.

Sure, I could use the small number of orbs I gt through drops to try and shape these into something more fitting, and I make every effort to do so. What I wind up with is an item that still fits into one of those three categories and no orbs to work with. What I need is to be able to increase either offense or defense, no matter how incrementally, while being able to maintain the other.

I'm not looking to instantly go to a gear set that will see me through 77 maps. I'm looking to take one step forward without having to simultaneously take 3 steps back so that replacing a piece of gear actually leaves me better off rather than worse.

As I've said before, I know that GGG must exert some control over the rate at which orbs enter the economy so long as orbs are the official currency of the game. This leads to a scenario in which crafting is sensible only when one approaches the pinnacle of itemization for their character. This is because it is far more reliable to use orbs to trade rather than to craft. The problem is that crafting becomes important far earlier in the game, and arguably, is more important earlier in the game.

Around mid to late cruel is where most builds get to the point that they are becoming more defined and the list of mods they need on gear begins to become much more focused. Up to this point, just about any build can survive on what it finds. As the difficulty ramps up in late cruel and into merciless, it becomes increasingly necessary to be able to shape the gear you find into the gear you need. Due to the way crafting is tied to the in game economy, though, this proves inordinately difficult if not outright impossible without trade because dropped orbs are simply too scarce. While there's no guarantee that having a stash tab full of orbs will yield the desired result (nor should there be any such guarantee), with more attempts the chance of "accidentally" landing on something that would serve as an upgrade grows.

Again, despite what some folks seem intent to believe (regardless of the fact that I am more qualified to determine my motives than they are) most of us aren't looking for instant end game gear. We just want to have more of a chance to get what we need to climb over obstacles without having to rely on what drops for you or anyone else.

(I know I"m not the most eloquent poster around here, but I hope I've managed to clearly convey what it is I'm trying to get across)