Our view on map drop rates

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MrDDT wrote:

I'm not able to farm Fellshrine a lot because I'm unlucky. Not sure what you mean by this. Each time I get unlucky in a race and die, I and put back to the start of the game.

If you are unlucky in maps, its likely because you didnt roll the correct ones, and so what if you are unlucky and take an extra 30mins to get a map. Whats your point? I'm unlucky and not getting exalt drops also.

That point isnt valid and you know it.

There is a big and in my opinion essential difference between item/currency drops and lvl 60 map drops.

It's ok to lock someone out of high lvl maps or items/currency (because its not essential to the whole game experience), but it's not ok to lock someone out of the map system.

Perhaps a better, more extreme example. The Map System feels like the following :
You get an amazing game that you want to continue to play. But every 10 minutes you have throw a dice. In case you get 2-6 you are allowed to continue to play. In case of 1 you have to wait 10 min. Sure that game is ok most of the time, but sometimes you will be unlucky and have to wait really long - which is really annoying and makes you hate the game at that point.

And again the example is not good (my 4. example - deleted all others ^^) - i don't care anymore.

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Thirion wrote:

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MrDDT wrote:

I'm not able to farm Fellshrine a lot because I'm unlucky. Not sure what you mean by this. Each time I get unlucky in a race and die, I and put back to the start of the game.

If you are unlucky in maps, its likely because you didnt roll the correct ones, and so what if you are unlucky and take an extra 30mins to get a map. Whats your point? I'm unlucky and not getting exalt drops also.

That point isnt valid and you know it.

There is a big and in my opinion essential difference between item/currency drops and lvl 60 map drops.

It's ok to lock someone out of high lvl maps or items/currency (because its not essential to the whole game experience), but it's not ok to lock someone out of the map system.

Perhaps a better, more extreme example. The Map System feels like the following :
You get an amazing game that you want to continue to play. But every 10 minutes you have throw a dice. In case you get 2-6 you are allowed to continue to play. In case of 1 you have to wait 10 min. Sure that game is ok most of the time, but sometimes you will be unlucky and have to wait really long - which is really annoying and makes you hate the game at that point.

And again the example is not good (my 4. example - deleted all others ^^) - i don't care anymore.

Only you have the option to never get a 1. Just buy maps off players.

Also you can weight the dice so your odds are even better.

I have never ever run out of maps, not only that I sell them, I had so many I gave about 50 to a friend.

Biggest problem I see with maps is that people are lacking the understanding of what maps to roll, the map rolls are not balanced, maps are not hard enough to give more reward and mostly that people just dont want to spend currency on a map system.

People need to get out of the "But I should have unlimited maps and never pay for it" thought process and drop come currency on maps and be completely fine. If you are worried of running out, then you are not rolling maps with currency.
The only thing I worry about is trying to get the higher level maps faster than others, and staying in them. Worried about not having level 60 maps? You have to be joking.

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Thirion wrote:

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MrDDT wrote:

I'm not able to farm Fellshrine a lot because I'm unlucky. Not sure what you mean by this. Each time I get unlucky in a race and die, I and put back to the start of the game.

If you are unlucky in maps, its likely because you didnt roll the correct ones, and so what if you are unlucky and take an extra 30mins to get a map. Whats your point? I'm unlucky and not getting exalt drops also.

That point isnt valid and you know it.

There is a big and in my opinion essential difference between item/currency drops and lvl 60 map drops.

It's ok to lock someone out of high lvl maps or items/currency (because its not essential to the whole game experience), but it's not ok to lock someone out of the map system.

Perhaps a better, more extreme example. The Map System feels like the following :
You get an amazing game that you want to continue to play. But every 10 minutes you have throw a dice. In case you get 2-6 you are allowed to continue to play. In case of 1 you have to wait 10 min. Sure that game is ok most of the time, but sometimes you will be unlucky and have to wait really long - which is really annoying and makes you hate the game at that point.

And again the example is not good (my 4. example - deleted all others ^^) - i don't care anymore.

This is actually an example of what's slowly killing games today. The need for instant gratification.

Part of the reason maps feel special and fun is because you CAN'T get them all the time. I agree there is a balance, a line between something requiring an effort which makes it more fun when you do get to do it, and just mind numbing grind to do what you want to do.

Haven't played with the maps since 0.9.11, but unless the droprate took a headdive since then, I don't see how it could be a problem. That's not even mentioning that they should be saved for party play, which should give even more chances to get a map.

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MrDDT wrote:

Only you have the option to never get a 1. Just buy maps off players.

I already wrote that there are enough situations were thats not possible.

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MrDDT wrote:

Also you can weight the dice so your odds are even better.

I know ;)

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MrDDT wrote:

I have never ever run out of maps, not only that I sell them, I had so many I gave about 50 to a friend.

Usually i get enough maps too. But if you start with 3 Maps and are unlucky it's easy to run out of maps - even with 3 maze maps.

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MrDDT wrote:

Biggest problem I see with maps is that people are lacking the understanding of what maps to roll, the map rolls are not balanced, maps are not hard enough to give more reward and mostly that people just dont want to spend currency on a map system.

I roll until i get maze, pack size, incr area and sometimes more rare/magic (when i have enough Maps - i like the drops ^^). Sometimes i use > 20 alts on a map - don't tell me i have to spend more.

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MrDDT wrote:

People need to get out of the "But I should have unlimited maps and never pay for it" thought process and drop come currency on maps and be completely fine. If you are worried of running out, then you are not rolling maps with currency.

And here you are wrong. Even with 10 maze + 50% pack size maps you can run out of maps. And even if its just 1 person in 10.000 it's still not ok. Btw, i never said i want Maps for free.

The discussion is kind of pointless, as it seems i'm just too stupid to understand the map system and that it can never ever happen to run out of maps (and yeah, im really annoyed - just because it didn't happen to you (yet) doesn't mean there is no problem!)

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Part of the reason maps feel special and fun is because you CAN'T get them all the time. I agree there is a balance, a line between something requiring an effort which makes it more fun when you do get to do it, and just mind numbing grind to do what you want to do.

High lvl maps are special, require effort and are really fun to play because of that.

This wouldnt even be an issue if maps werent the only end game available in PoE.

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Thirion wrote:

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MrDDT wrote:

Only you have the option to never get a 1. Just buy maps off players.

I already wrote that there are enough situations were thats not possible.

Saying that in the first 30 to 40 hours of a week long race you might not have access to maps is absurd. If you are unlucky to not get a map and not able to buy one. That's how the cookie crumbles. You can wait another hour or so while farming for them to buy one.

Its like saying I got a bad random instance of say Lower Prison its not fair to have them random like that to be able to do content. Its holding me up from going to the next area for 5 to 10mins.

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MrDDT wrote:

I have never ever run out of maps, not only that I sell them, I had so many I gave about 50 to a friend.

Usually i get enough maps too. But if you start with 3 Maps and are unlucky it's easy to run out of maps - even with 3 maze maps.

So if you run out of maps after doing 3 maze maps you still wouldn't be high enough level where it would effect you to go back and do pyramids.

I dont see that as a valid reason to change the map system.

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MrDDT wrote:

Biggest problem I see with maps is that people are lacking the understanding of what maps to roll, the map rolls are not balanced, maps are not hard enough to give more reward and mostly that people just dont want to spend currency on a map system.

I roll until i get maze, pack size, incr area and sometimes more rare/magic (when i have enough Maps - i like the drops ^^). Sometimes i use > 20 alts on a map - don't tell me i have to spend more.

I'm pretty sure you said alts right?
They have a few things called, regals, chisels, alchs, chaos, even exalts and divines.

Again also just the list of things you look for tells me you are wrong in what you are looking for. Just FYI.

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MrDDT wrote:

People need to get out of the "But I should have unlimited maps and never pay for it" thought process and drop come currency on maps and be completely fine. If you are worried of running out, then you are not rolling maps with currency.

And here you are wrong. Even with 10 maze + 50% pack size maps you can run out of maps. And even if its just 1 person in 10.000 it's still not ok. Btw, i never said i want Maps for free.

So we are working off the 1 and 10k issue here? Sounds like a damn working system to me.

I agree someone could, but then those 1 in 10k can buy a map off a player, and if they do change it buy one for an alch.

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BRavich wrote:

This wouldnt even be an issue if maps werent the only end game available in PoE.

Its no more an issue than saying you cant afford to craft gear is an issue.

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MrDDT wrote:

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BRavich wrote:

This wouldnt even be an issue if maps werent the only end game available in PoE.

Its no more an issue than saying you cant afford to craft gear is an issue.

You're wrong. Know why? There is no catch 22. Maps suddenly pop into existence at level 60. Gear has no such drop off. ilvl 59 gear serves you nearly just as well as ilvl 60 gear. ilvl 59 maps... well, there is no such thing.

Not being able to afford to craft gear does not entirely prevent you from having access to content.



The 2 problems are very dissimilar.