Mechanics thread

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raic000 wrote:
That's the way it is.

Say you have 10-20 physical damage weapon and passives that increase your weapon damage by total of 100%, you'll do
20-40 physical damage

Now, if you start using infernal blow that converts 50% damage to fire that will be
10-20 physical
10-20 fire

If you have fire damage and/or fire damage on weapons bonus of, say a grand total of 50% you'll do
10-20 physical
15-30 fire

So fire portion of the damage got increased twice, and not additively but multiplicatively, which would mean that half of your weapon damage first got increased by 100% and then that total was again increased by 50% which would sum it up as not a 150% increase, but 200% (probably the main reason why those weapon elemental damage nodes were nerfed).
This is false. Additive increases are never made multiplicative by conversion.

In the above example, you have 10-20 base physical damage, half of which is converted to fire.
Thus you have 5-10 base physical damage, affected by a total 100% increase, give 10-20 total physical damage.
You also have 5-10 base fire damage converted from physical, affected by the 100% increase and the 50% increase, so a total increase of 150%. This gives a total of 13 - 25 fire damage.

Additive increases are never applied multiplicatively. That would make them broken.
Last edited by Mark_GGG#0000 on Jul 29, 2012, 6:42:34 PM
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KrX wrote:
After little playing I understand how shield, armor end evasion works (not so hard) but I have serious problems to compare them.

If I have item with energy shield 20 and other one with armor 50, I really don't know how to compare them. Yes, I can compare them trough my experience but is there some place where I can see those mechanics so I could compare them way better?

And I also would like to know what are those "spheres" around enemies? I have seen green ones (maybe others too). Where could I look what those mean?

http://en.pathofexilewiki.com/wiki/Energy_Shield
http://en.pathofexilewiki.com/wiki/Armour
http://en.pathofexilewiki.com/wiki/Evasion
Other than that, I'm afraid you'll have to ask more specific questions on defense types since you said you generally understand how they work.

The spheres are Frenzy, Endurance, and Power Charges. Each lasts a short time and increases certain stats. They can be obtained by using certain skill gems. Check http://en.pathofexilewiki.com/wiki/Charges for more info. I'll be updating the page shortly...
Urist McDwarfy has been happy lately. He admired an exceptional ARPG recently. He took joy in slaughter lately. He has been attacked by the dead recently.
Check out the Path of Exile wiki: http://en.pathofexilewiki.com
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KrX wrote:
After little playing I understand how shield, armor end evasion works (not so hard) but I have serious problems to compare them.

If I have item with energy shield 20 and other one with armor 50, I really don't know how to compare them. Yes, I can compare them trough my experience but is there some place where I can see those mechanics so I could compare them way better?

And I also would like to know what are those "spheres" around enemies? I have seen green ones (maybe others too). Where could I look what those mean?


The mechanisms of different defences are in the firsts posts of this thread.
The spheres around enemies are charges. The green are Frenzy charges, blues Power charges and red Endurance charges.
Green = Frenzy charge (increases attack speed)
Blue = Power charge (increases critical strike chance)
Orange = Endurance charge (reduces damage taken)
The numbers on these charges are different from the numbers players get, I'm still trying to find out what they are.
Oh, the spheres are charges. I have not yet have my own so that why it was kinda mystery to me what those were. Thanks.

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UristMcDwarfy wrote:

http://en.pathofexilewiki.com/wiki/Energy_Shield
http://en.pathofexilewiki.com/wiki/Armour
http://en.pathofexilewiki.com/wiki/Evasion
Other than that, I'm afraid you'll have to ask more specific questions on defense types since you said you generally understand how they work.

I may have chosen my words badly. I understand that eva/armor/shield is hard to compare since they are affected damage and accuracy. Maybe I should have ask more info about energy shield. As how it works on reducing damage? Is 1 ES worth like 50 hp, or does one hit reduce ES by 10?

I have read that wiki thing before I started to play and I thought it was not that informative but now it starts to bother me a bit since I don't know in depth how it works. :/

And thanks for all answers. I like how this game is complicated and you really have to "go in things" and find out what works.
The Black Cat Clan - The Black Cat WILL affect your drops
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KrX wrote:
After little playing I understand how shield, armor end evasion works (not so hard) but I have serious problems to compare them.

If I have item with energy shield 20 and other one with armor 50, I really don't know how to compare them. Yes, I can compare them trough my experience but is there some place where I can see those mechanics so I could compare them way better?


You shouldn't have to compare them, your toon's stats will soon restrict you to wearing one or two types of armor, melee tamplars will typically wear STR or STR/INT type of armor, a little more brainy ones will wear INT or STR/INT armor, typical marauders will use heavy, pure STR armor.

You should decide what type of defense to favor based on your build. First, every character has an inherent evade rank, regardless of armor. For characters that get hit a lot heavy armor is probably the best option as it gives great, consistent protection. Armor for pure DEX characters bolsters natural evade rank and, with smart skill choices can give very high percentage of evasion, the downside is that once you get hit, it will hurt, and on higher difficulties one lucky strike can get you. Energy shield is the only type of armor that protects vs spells too, but once it depletes it's hard to bring it back on before the fight is over, best for ranged or as a support armor type for melee hit&run tactics. Energy shield works as an extension to your health and gives you 50% protection against stun as long as it's on. If you have an armor value besides energy shield it reduces damage dealt to shield too.
Respect your passive skills and they shall respect you in turn.
Last edited by raic000#3996 on Jul 29, 2012, 7:18:16 PM
also I have a question ....
for example I wish to use all these 3 auras :
Determination - Armor
Vitality - life regeneration
Purity - elemental resistance

but each of them will reserve 40% of my mana

will I be able to activate all of them ? what will happen ? basically those 3 auras should reserve 40%x3 = 120% of my mana ? that means all my mana will be gone ?
or it will reserve 40% of my available mana ?
so for example if I have 1000 mana ...
I activate Determination -> 400 mana reserved .. 600 mana left
I activate Vitality -> 240 more mana reserved ... 600-240=360 mana left
I activare Purity -> 144 more mana reserved .. 360-144=216 mana left.

So ... what will happen if I activate all the auras ?

Case 1 : all of my mana will be reserved since the % reserved is cumulative ? 40%+40%+40%= 120% ... that means all my mana....

Case 2 : as I explained above ... if I should had X amount of mana .. in the above case .. 1000 ... I could use all the 3 auras and I will still remain with 216 mana that I could use on skills ?!

LATE EDIT :
Or is Case 3 : it will be cumulative ... but I can't use all 3 auras since those percentages surpass 100% ... so I must use the Reduced Mana Cost Supportive Gem to reduce their reserve cost from 40% somewhere at 33% or lower ... then I could use all 3 auras and having like 99% of my mana reserved ?!

How it will work ?
Long Live the Templars !!!!
Last edited by InfinityAtEnd#7163 on Jul 29, 2012, 7:57:24 PM
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InfinityAtEnd wrote:


Or is Case 3 : it will be cumulative ... but I can't use all 3 auras since those percentages surpass 100% ... so I must use the Reduced Mana Cost Supportive Gem to reduce their reserve cost from 40% somewhere at 33% or lower ... then I could use all 3 auras and having like 99% of my mana reserved ?!

How it will work ?


This.
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KrX wrote:
I may have chosen my words badly. I understand that eva/armor/shield is hard to compare since they are affected damage and accuracy. Maybe I should have ask more info about energy shield. As how it works on reducing damage? Is 1 ES worth like 50 hp, or does one hit reduce ES by 10?

I have read that wiki thing before I started to play and I thought it was not that informative but now it starts to bother me a bit since I don't know in depth how it works. :/

And thanks for all answers. I like how this game is complicated and you really have to "go in things" and find out what works.

ES is basically life that is rechargeable when you don't get hit for six seconds (by default, this duration can be decreased). It absorbs exactly the same amount of damage as life would, and is affected by armor, evasion, and resistances. It has the added benefit of giving you 50% protection against stuns (so, if you would have been stunned by taking damage, you have a 50% chance not to do so) for as long as it is active. It will also be bypassed entirely by chaos damage.
Urist McDwarfy has been happy lately. He admired an exceptional ARPG recently. He took joy in slaughter lately. He has been attacked by the dead recently.
Check out the Path of Exile wiki: http://en.pathofexilewiki.com
found something confusing to me for a change finally while viewing the C key status panel. unless threshold is specific to attacks, i should have 33% threshold reduction (15% passives and 18% from equip) not counting the 26% extra for maces. while i'm not going to spell cast, the status panel isn't displaying the stat for spells.

similarly, i have total of 115% stun duration of which only 50% is unspecific to weapon type (20% passives and 30% belt). that DOES display on the status window for spells, i expected only the 50% to work.

any information as to why there is missing pieces to this puzzle?

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