Snapshotting

"

Fruz wrote:

What the hell ....

Bonuses are not split between zombie .... all the zombies ( or spectres ) get the equal bonus = 100% of it.

It's the same thing that if you have a 40 sec summon skeletons, summoning 6 skeleton instead of 2 will still last 40 sec, and not 40/(6/2) => 13.3 seconds.

Those are basic maths, that one learns in junior high school or before, it's just logic, if you still think that this is "wrong" ( strong argument you got there ) ... I can't help you there, and I don't think that there's even a point continuing this.

lolwut?

do i need to circle the text in the toolip? "CAN RAISE UP TO 5 SPECTRES AT A TIME"

i didn't merely SAY you're wrong - i proved it.

"

HarukaTeno wrote:

1) What if i tell you that when you're using Raise Spectre skill, 1 Spectre already IS 100%
And 5 Spectres are just 500%.

im sry but 5spectres are 500% - i cant agree on that at all! and im pretty sure its absurd to think about it like that!

if it would be like that! summoner would be the "masterclass" for the game! because then 8 zombies would also equal 800% - from your logic... and thats just absurd!

where a single skill from any other gem would not have those immense numbers and never could!

why does not everybody then play a summoner when its that easy and that op! compare just the survivability / clearspeed / easy playstyle from some other classes that wreck everything in the game, already at low lvl map ongoing to wreck uber atziri!

the thing is snapshotting will get removed - im fine with it! 7 or 8 link minions... wtf!

there have always been many other "classes" that were easier to play, cheaper, faster - then summoners! and i think in 1.2 its not going to change!

im not on his side, but neither on yours! the changes will happen, and im mostly thankfull to every change they make! it keeps it fresh and some crazy theorycrafter have something new to do! im excitet about it!

but the changes have to be made good - and thats the biggest fear! dissapearing summoners, nearly everywhere - so only a few other classes remain, and i dont like that at all!

"

robmafia wrote:

[...]

There is either something wrong with your relation to the words and their meaning, or to basic logic, or something else that I don't know about .... but there definitely is something wrong here from your recent posts imho.

The last thing to do here is /popcorn I guess
Too bad that an instructive thread where people were having a sane, good conversation with Mark is ending like this.


EDIT : saying that 5 spectre = 500% doesn't mean anything, but saying that each spectre is = 20% is even worse.
5 Spectre means that each of them are benefiting from all the support gem linked at the moment of the summoning, those having been swapped or not.

R.S. is a skill gem like all the others are. Just ONE skill. So 1 out of 5 spectres is not 20% of the skill: 5 spectres are 100%, 1 spectre is 100%, 2 spectres are 100% of the skill...
Swapping gems or equipment is snapshotting, it doesn't matter how much you complain about it. If a skill/item/support is not active, it doens't have to be counted as if it was
Got to this point, why don't you, instead of whining and complaining about everything, suggest something further than keeping this game-breaking mechanic called snapshot.
If you want diversity of spectres (which i think is fair enough) suggest something, that's it.

Ok ok ok, this is getting rather annoying folks.
Snapshotting is getting fixed (thank god), at the same time they are going to rework all the skills they posted in the OP.

So as written in the nest of comments on this thread, the devs are reading this thread and wants suggestions/ideas/thoughts on how to solve this in a good way as summoners will take the biggest hit in this fix.

So stop fighting and start helping.

"

GoatEatingToilet wrote:

"

robmafia wrote:

"

GoatEatingToilet wrote:

I listed Bones of Ullr because it has the least impactful negative for a huge positive.

and since you evaded my rebuttal that blew this out of the water, please explain which builds find losing 250 base ES (or 600 armor, etc), tri res, and movement speed to be "minimal."

because as far as i can tell, that's a MASSIVE drop for any build.

There is no use in replying to you because you do not see any reason other than your own. You want to have your cake and eat it, too. There is no point in arguing with someone who refuses to acknowledge there is another side (Yep, you totally blew my example out of the water considering how many summoner builds actually use Bones of Ullr. It is quite obviously an acceptable loss for some, just as the lack of spectre diversity will have to be).

I never stated that the loss of stats would be minimal, just the effort to gain addition spectres would be. If you want 250 base ES (or 600 armor, etc), tri res, and movement speed then that is fine, go grab a pair of boots that have those stats... but you will not be getting those extra minions. Is it really that hard to understand the concept of a trade off?

well thats a good point @goat! btw... nice nick! ^^

it would be wrong way to get a perfect item everywhere for any summoner! with superhigh stats! but there are only those boots and the defensive stats... they are meh - everybody has to agree on it!

i also cant see many nice ES pieces for a summoner! - sometimes the drawback is rly high - or lets not forget the amu! - yes its nice - it buffs your minions! but not ridicoulusly huge - and still provides no other stats for the summoner himself!

"

Fruz wrote:

"

robmafia wrote:

[...]

There is either something wrong with your relation to the words and their meaning, or to basic logic, or something else that I don't know about .... but there definitely is something wrong here from your recent posts imho.

The last thing to do here is /popcorn I guess
Too bad that an instructive thread where people were having a sane, good conversation with Mark is ending like this.


EDIT : saying that 5 spectre = 500% doesn't mean anything, but saying that each spectre is = 20% is even worst.
5 Spectre means that each of them are benefiting from all the support gem linked at the moment of the summoning, those having been swapped or not.

5/5 = 1. 5/5 = 100%

you keep speaking of basic math and logic. you probably shouldn't, as you don't even realize that 5/5 = 1.00

5/5 =/= 500%

"

iuxtaignem wrote:

R.S. is a skill gem like all the others are. Just ONE skill. So 1 out of 5 spectres is not 20% of the skill: 5 spectres are 100%, 1 spectre is 100%, 2 spectres are 100%

umm... your figures literally can not be correct, regardless of your mindset.

1/5 ("1 out of 5") can not equal 2/5 or 5/5.

"

iuxtaignem wrote:

If you want diversity of spectres (which i think is fair enough) suggest something, that's it

...i did. like 20 pages ago!

Hopefully not to late to the thread. A long time ago the Build of the Week S02E10 idea was brought up and after some testing it seemed to not work that way for minions. (The removing trap/remote mine) I can't seem to find where (it was probably reddit) but I remember someone from GGG saying that it checks what's linked to a skill again when the trap/mine detonates. So you would lose the bonus. Also the testing I myself, and other people in the thread http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/778411 seem to prove this as well.
Edit: I found the reddit post it seems no ggg comment, but a bunch of testing was done. http://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/1wlds4/snapshotting_is_broken_8link_spectres_broken/
and after retesting myself again I can again prove this to be true. So while the other snapshotting mechanics are definitely a thing, the 7-8 linking is 100% not an option. All the guy was doing was removing the damage multiplier.

With 5 zombies instead of one, you have 500% of the dps you had when you had only one .... ( from those zombies of course ), but the benefit from the support gems ... is always 100%, whatever the number of zombies.
The only thing that can really be multiplied, is the global effective life, dps and mobility of the pets.

"

robmafia wrote:

"

iuxtaignem wrote:

R.S. is a skill gem like all the others are. Just ONE skill. So 1 out of 5 spectres is not 20% of the skill: 5 spectres are 100%, 1 spectre is 100%, 2 spectres are 100%

umm... your figures literally can not be correct, regardless of your mindset.

1/5 ("1 out of 5") can not equal 2/5 or 5/5.

I suggest that you take math classes ( not even sure that it will help here ) so that you can get logic basics, because it really looks like that it's what you're missing here.

Each post of yours just confirm my previous one lol.