Bow skills damage conversion

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Avaricta#4758 wrote:

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Ashyev#5110 wrote:

Wrong & Wrong .

List the names of the support gems you are talking about.

And how does added damage increase the conversion from 60% to more than 60%?

Edit:
If you have 100 physical damage, 60% physical converted to lightning, 40 added lightning damage. You still only have 60% conversion, ergo 40 physical damage left. The % of each part of the resulting damage may differ, but the conversion stays the same.

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Ashyev#5110 wrote:

You are arguing on semantics about the formula steps and that's just a dead end . Sure only certain Uniques or Passive Nodes can alter the exact Conversion step that Skills are initially using , but if a Support Gem increase the portion of a Damage Type while minimizing the portion of another Damage Type before % increase to X damage type is taking place : this is exactly what Conversion is supposed to be about .

So beyond semantics , everything that was said is indeed possible and you can definitely end up with a 60% Phys converted to Elem skill doing close to 100% Elem if you use the correct combination of Support Gem / Gear / Passive . Or you can go a different route if you choose to . That's all that matters .

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Avaricta#4758 wrote:

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Ashyev#5110 wrote:

You are arguing on semantics about the formula steps and that's just a dead end . Sure only certain Uniques or Passive Nodes can alter the exact Conversion step that Skills are initially using , but if a Support Gem increase the portion of a Damage Type while minimizing the portion of another Damage Type before % increase to X damage type is taking place : this is exactly what Conversion is supposed to be about .

So beyond semantics , everything that was said is indeed possible and you can definitely end up with a 60% Phys converted to Elem skill doing close to 100% Elem if you use the correct combination of Support Gem / Gear / Passive . Or you can go a different route if you choose to . That's all that matters .

This is just factually wrong.

Conversion is conversion and added damage is added damage. This thread is about conversion.

You claim there are support gems that convert damage when there is not. You are spreading false information. New players may read this false information, follow it and then wonder why their damage is bricked.

Don't do this.

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Ashyev#5110 wrote:

As i said : semantics . Given you just want to feel right about terminology while ignoring the big picture the discussion is as i already said a dead end .

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Avaricta#4758 wrote:

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Ashyev#5110 wrote:

As i said : semantics . Given you just want to feel right about terminology while ignoring the big picture the discussion is as i already said a dead end .

No it is not semantics. Let me try to explain clearer.

Lets say you have a base damage of 500 physical. You convert 60% to lightning from the skill you use. You have combined increased lightning and elemental damage of 500%. You use Lightning Infusion for 25% added Lightning damage.

So before increases you have 200 physical damage, 300 lightning + another 125 lightning from the support.
So: 200 phys + 425 lightning * ( 1 + 5 ) = 2750 damage

If you had 100% conversion instead of the 25% add damage you would have 500 lightning damage * 6 = 3000 damage. So 250 damage more.

Because the conversion is not 100% you have a portion of the base damage that is not effected by the increased lightning/elemental damage.

If we add Exposure of 25% on a target with lets say 0% lightning resistance it would yield 3387.5 damage vs 3750. So 362,5 damage more.

With Conductivity the gap would be even greater. This is not semantics. We are talking about real damage.

Also keep in mind. If you had 100% you could still use the 25% added damage. So a better comparison would be without the 25% for partial conversion.
So: 200 phys + 300 lightning * ( 1 + 5 ) = 2000 damage. So 1000 damage, or 33% less.

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Ashyev#5110 wrote:

It's definitely semantics about on paper stuff lmao

On paper Ice Strike does 80% Cold Damage but in practice :

8299 - 17148 Total Dmg = 100%
601 - 1241 Phys Dmg = 7.2 %
7698 - 15907 Cold Dmg = 92.8 %

It's already possible to get close to a mono-type of Damage Source as i said . Your point here is "we should get that right off the bat because i'm missing out on milking phys dmg into my +300% Elem build" which is the big picture and it's consequences you are ignoring : if GGG would set every skill at 100% Conversion for you to milk every flat Phys to snowball into the next steps which are X% Increased Elem Damage , X% Increased Cold Dmg , and so on ... that would make the final DPS of mono-elemental builds so high GGG would end up nerfing damage globally .

So congratulations : you are asking for GGG to buff mono-dmg build even further ( they are already strong enough ) , while nerfing the other build possibilities being around but that will end up getting everyone nerfed all together .
I reject both the premise & the conclusion of all that .

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Avaricta#4758 wrote:

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Ashyev#5110 wrote:

It's definitely semantics about on paper stuff lmao

On paper Ice Strike does 80% Cold Damage but in practice :

8299 - 17148 Total Dmg = 100%
601 - 1241 Phys Dmg = 7.2 %
7698 - 15907 Cold Dmg = 92.8 %

It's already possible to get close to a mono-type of Damage Source as i said . Your point here is "we should get that right off the bat because i'm missing out on milking phys dmg into my +300% Elem build" which is the big picture and it's consequences you are ignoring : if GGG would set every skill at 100% Conversion for you to milk every flat Phys to snowball into the next steps which are X% Increased Elem Damage , X% Increased Cold Dmg , and so on ... that would make the final DPS of mono-elemental builds so high GGG would end up nerfing damage globally .

So congratulations : you are asking for GGG to buff mono-dmg build even further ( they are already strong enough ) , while nerfing the other build possibilities being around but that will end up getting everyone nerfed all together .
I reject both the premise & the conclusion of all that .

You understand nothing. I personally do not care about if we use hybrid damage or single elemental damage. I am fine with both. As stated before. I am not asking for anything.

The reason I am still writing in this thread is because you a writing factually wrong posts. You try to misinform players. Not in this post. Here you stated that full conversion yields more damage then partial. But when you said we have full conversion, that is simply, factually false!

You simply can't say a moldy, stinky piece of raw chicken that has been lying outside in the dirt for 5 days is as healthy as an apple, just because when you are on the toilet they come out the same. There is still a difference.

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Ashyev#5110 wrote:

I refuse to acknowledge that my wah wah would fix absolutely nothing given there was no issue in the first place and it would create huge balance problems so let's turn to 11 my arguing about semantics to save face

If you don't care about the final balance of this game and just care about being right about made up non-issues you can backtrack all the way out of this thread then

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Ashyev#5110 wrote:

I never stated that , buh bye .

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Avaricta#4758 wrote:

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Ashyev#5110 wrote:

I refuse to acknowledge that my wah wah would fix absolutely nothing given there was no issue in the first place and it would create huge balance problems so let's turn to 11 my arguing about semantics to save face

If you don't care about the final balance of this game and just care about being right about made up non-issues you can backtrack all the way out of this thread then

There is no sense in arguing with you.

You stated that there is 100% conversion when there is not.

If you want to treat added damage as conversion ... be my guest. Just please, don't misinform newer players with such BS.