for GOD SAKE stop this discrimination PLS!

"

ArtCrusade wrote:

"

ArtCrusade wrote:

I wished it was. It's a slap in the face of people who are actually being discriminated against

In the actual, real world that has grassy hills to touch.

This is a forum to discuss a video-game and the term discrimination is not exclusively tied to real-life.


Again, The OP has been constructively posting here for many years, Did you have anything to contribute to the topic or want to discuss any elements of what Tree has had to say?

I personally do not engage with t17's because i don't take them seriously, but that is an entirely different topic to explain my view on them properly.

No reason to say the same thing someone else already said. I voiced my support in favor of a previous poster and took part in the discussion as you say.

There are two uses of the word discrimination that I am aware of. One is understanding the differences between two things, and the other is how OP used the word. It's hyperbolic and abrasive.

My stance should be pretty clear from my first post but since you're asking:

1) Trickster isn't the only viable option. Maybe not even the best. Many, many builds are able to run T17s. I did T17s on a crappy league starter on week 1 gear in a private league lmao.

2) OP claims T17s are EXCLUSIVE for CI & Trickster builds which is just flat out wrong again. Many, many life-based abd hybrid builds run T17s.

3) T17s were only made easier this league compared to last and last league we didn't have a Trickster meta either. If T17s were harder, wouldn't more people have been running Trickster? Duh.

4) Mods you personally dislike or that are especially bad for your build can be rerolled. I run mods like volatile cores, drowning spheres and no damage 3 out of 10 seconds all the time because you can play around them by paying attention. They're free extra IIQ. We're already being showered in chaos orbs so it really is no problem rolling over them if they pose such a threat to your character.

Edit: Also I don't see the logic behind "but he posted in a constructive manner in the past." Do past 'good' deeds absolve of actions worthy of criticism?

^to add to that, this claim that Tricksters can roll the maps "less" than other builds is ridiculous.

A build that is created for t17s will be able to run a good 75-80% of the mods at LEAST. Trickster has no inherently unique "one-up" over a good t17-capable build.

Plus....a poorly made trickster is going to struggle just as much as any other poorly made build.

It's great that people who play ssf hc and so on can "do" these maps on week 1 leaguestarters with bad gear. But this thread is talking about the experience in sc trade, where most of the playerbase is. I don't know how the economy is in hc, I don't know how t17s are in that mode, nor does it matter. The point is that these maps are still cringe to run for so many sc trade players, including myself. The impact of having to waste chaos orbs to roll these maps is much bigger in sc than it is in ssf or hc lol, ofc people will complain about the mods and how insanely overtuned they are.

These kinds of "you don't get to play the game" mods like deal no damage every x seconds or petrification statues, or awakener's desolation, or maven interferes, or drowning orbs aren't fun. I ain't ever running a map with those. Also mods that completely brick builds still exist like "players take % of damage taken by their totems" so that's hilarious. And if you dare roll attack speed on a t17 then the boss will just instantly slap you and oneshot you before you knew what even happened. Very fun game design. Just because a small % of people can ignore how badly designed these maps are, doesn't mean these maps are "fine". They still need a major rework. Letting us use all currency on them would be a start lol, limiting it to chaos orbs is so pointless and makes no sense.

Dont play ssf hc and can do them week 1 as well.

"

Toforto wrote:

It's great that people who play ssf hc and so on can "do" these maps on week 1 leaguestarters with bad gear. But this thread is talking about the experience in sc trade, where most of the playerbase is. I don't know how the economy is in hc, I don't know how t17s are in that mode, nor does it matter. The point is that these maps are still cringe to run for so many sc trade players, including myself. The impact of having to waste chaos orbs to roll these maps is much bigger in sc than it is in ssf or hc lol, ofc people will complain about the mods and how insanely overtuned they are.

hehe.....this comment is just....wildly out of touch with reality.

the maps are MORE cringe to run in SC trade than HC anything? What?

Impact of chaos orbs is MORE in the mode that showers you with more chaos orbs than any other? What?

Not a chance this is a "serious" comment right here. But based on chat history, maybe it is and that is just plain sad....

Disinformation in every single post across every single conversation.

"

Toforto wrote:

Trickster is probably one of the most broken ascendancies right now though, not only does it get immunity to all slows but it also starts in such a good place on the skill tree so you can basically get 96% suppression for free just from your ascendancy+suppress nodes and chance to suppress is lucky mastery, then the last 4% on gloves as an eldritch implicit. That's insanely busted and just lets you use any gear you want, which means they can just go CI and wear full ES gear and make stupidly overpowered builds.
[...]

Forgive my Shadow-inexperience, but as someone who recently got 100% suppress on a Warden, how is Trickster different ?

Also, not sure how relevant that league is (many differences), but the top Gauntlet
(sigh, yet another website that abuses JavaScript, can't seem to link directly to the relevant list ?)
currently seems split roughly 1/3 Slayer (on top !), 1/3 Trickster, 1/3 others...

Finally, at some point you can either design for balanced (and therefore boring for some), or for weird/cool (but then also boring for some others, once they've found a way to exploit it — puzzles are rarely interesting once solved).
Am I mistaken in thinking GGG is going for the first for T16 and the second for T17 ?

To partially answer myself :

I guess HC does matter in making non-viable the builds that rely first and foremost on randomly applying defenses (that you cannot push to 100%) like evasion and especially blocking chance : your luck is going to run out at some point..?

Only a single Ranger Ascendancy in the top 50 !

I suppose that those Slayers and Tricksters have some... tricks that make them not count on evasion much, which aren't as readily available to the other Duelist and Shadow Asces ?

"

Lyutsifer665 wrote:

OP is not wrong. i made a Ci trickster because i was sick of all the random one shots and now i am pretty much immortal in maps. i can still die to a t17 boss if i dont roll the map properly but its pretty rare. deathless simulacrum also. its a shame the gold is not that good in simu otherwise i would farm the hell out of it with this build

CI Trickster might be better right now, but I can do deathless simulacrums on my HR build fairly easily.

I DO think that there are WAY too many one shot mechanics now. It's even worse this league even will the buffs to quality and armor.

I think CI should have more downsides as right now it really doesn't.

POE needs more ways to mitigate one shot mechanics especially physical and chaos.

The way I see it, T17 maps are not really much more difficult than T16s now. They are just vastly more annoying, not only to roll but also to play. Like, the mobs at large barely feel tankier or deadlier than in T16s, even the "special" ones, but there are so many additional annoying mechanics and the boss fights are basically tiny arenas with spam, spam, spam, area coverage with little space, multi-phased and reused bosses. Despite them being super profitable, I did not enjoy them, at all.

The map layout is antagonistic design and so is the mod pool. Wasn't fun bricking my first 3 boss fights with mods that were absolutely terrible for them since I didn't know their mechanics yet. Completed the 4th and said fuck this after the 5th was the Catarina/Kurgal fight for my first time. This is vastly different from a Minotaur with boosted AoE or a Hydra with extra projectiles. This is bullet hell design, and I do not find that fun to engage with. Notice that I say "not fun to engage with" and not "too difficult". Considering that they are comparatively rather scarce, practice is greatly limited.

Feeling pigeonholed into certain setups is also not fun, so I get the OP there, but at the same time these are allowed to co-exist to match certain content. Just means I'm not gonna run them because I tend to play experimental off-meta builds rather than stay in my comfort zone at all times. And since I mostly play SC, I can take risks that you'd never take in HC, like, taking a fresh lvl 70 character and dropping it straight into red maps to see if it can manage yet.