The Self Found League

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

So yes, it's a difficult nut to crack, but it's not a true tautology. I believe that drastic action — such as making all orbs account-bound and forcing players to rely on pseudo-currency rather than true currencies — would be a step in the right direction. After all, players could still trade their orbs indirectly, by using them on items and then trading the improved items.

Regarding some of your words in the deleted part, I was actually referring to economic participation mostly from the sole perspective of a buyer. For example, if you never sell, and only buy your gear, your itemization will always be much, much faster than self found. While faster and slower are meaningless in themselves, the devs have to pick a sustainment rate for item drops, and that means they need to pay keen attention to the modes that players are most likely to use, and make sure that that level of item acquisition is not so fast so that the players outrun everything the game has to offer too quickly.

Just go play Torchlight 2 or Grim Dawn or other SP games and watch the drops and compare them to a purely self found play style on POE. They are not the same. In POE, you need to trade to get items at the rate of the SP games. And that's the thing SFL proponents want: item acquisition at a rate that they would get without an economy and no trading. I personally just find trading ANNOYING. BTW, I am not presently a self found player. I trade (buy). That's because the game is too slow otherwise.

All that blabber out of the way, your method would be fine insofar as crafting and drops were adjusted to create a TL2/GrimDawn/SP ARPG itemization experience. Thing is, we are pushing for a league, because some people like economies, and what you are saying would be hugely disruptive to what we already have. If they did something that made the self found play style much, much more viable within the Standard league, I'd be just fine with that. I don't have high hopes, though.

Make Self-Found League happen already.

And no, I don't care if you improve the drop rates or not. Self-Found is not about drop rates, it's about being a G-D hardworking man instead of a fat lazy video game merchant king. It's about knowing that the people you are playing with have earned their stripes too. I want to play self-found, and I want to group with people that play self-found. I can do the former in normal leagues, but I can't do the latter.

Bump for the cause.

Will try to bump daily till it happens.

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Courageous wrote:

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

So yes, it's a difficult nut to crack, but it's not a true tautology. I believe that drastic action — such as making all orbs account-bound and forcing players to rely on pseudo-currency rather than true currencies — would be a step in the right direction. After all, players could still trade their orbs indirectly, by using them on items and then trading the improved items.

Regarding some of your words in the deleted part, I was actually referring to economic participation mostly from the sole perspective of a buyer. For example, if you never sell, and only buy your gear, your itemization will always be much, much faster than self found.

The idea behind trading is that both parties profit; the buyer gets an upgrade for less then it would cost to craft and/or gets increased kill-speed immediately instead of waiting for it to drop, while the seller gets better than the vendor would give them. So the inequality holds true from both a buyer and a seller perspective.

I like the idea of these leagues, but Poe is a game that doesn't drop the best things for your char all the time.
So even if you play alone you will get a lot of good items but they will have no use for you.

How about implementing a exclusive orb. Orb of trading or something like that, it would allow you to trade items, but without people becoming a mobile vendor.

Have it able to work on instances and Maps so that when you group with friends if something decent drops it doesn't get stuck with you.

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Darkarmedreaper wrote:

How about implementing a exclusive orb. Orb of trading or something like that, it would allow you to trade items, but without people becoming a mobile vendor.

Have it able to work on instances and Maps so that when you group with friends if something decent drops it doesn't get stuck with you.

Wouldn't this be better solved by being able to drop the items shortly after picking them up?
Of course they could only be picked up by players who were in the instance when the item dropped.

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Bura wrote:

Wouldn't this be better solved by being able to drop the items shortly after picking them up?

^^^^^

It doesn't need any special restrictions, either. You're not going to be able to magically turn the ability to drop an item into a sale; it's ridiculously impractical. Keep in mind that even currency is BOA.

The main purpose of the drop within NN seconds of picking up rule is to allow people to un-pickup stuff they didn't mean to pickup in the first place. Previous conversations in this thread call this a nice to have, but it's hardly necessary to get SFL going. It would just be a nice optimization.

Anyway, regarding the orb that let's you trade: "no" to any kind of trading exemptions in SFL. No trading

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Darkarmedreaper wrote:

I like the idea of these leagues, but Poe is a game that doesn't drop the best things for your char all the time.
So even if you play alone you will get a lot of good items but they will have no use for you.

How about implementing a exclusive orb. Orb of trading or something like that, it would allow you to trade items, but without people becoming a mobile vendor.

Have it able to work on instances and Maps so that when you group with friends if something decent drops it doesn't get stuck with you.

I don't know why people get hung up on this part.
It's simple, really. Self found = no trading but items are not character bound.

I always play self found in any game, but I don't RP :)
Self is me, the player, not my individual characters.

I found a Kaom's on my wander, no use to him, I now have an 87 pulser.
I found Lioneye's on my pulser, no use to him, 6L'd it and I now have an 88 ranger.
I found a perfect 50/40 Searing Touch on my ranger, no use to her, 6L'd it, I now have an 87 discharger.

Self found has so much going for it, rather than seeing a drop and immediately seeing wealth value, you see strength value and utilise it. More classes, more builds, more play time, more game longevity, more fun, more stash tabs required (you know that item might come in useful on a character some time, don't ya?), more $ to GGG.

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tr4nznrg wrote:

If you really want "self found"... ain't it easier to just not trade to anyone? Or is it about E-peen factor to showoff your "self found" items?

That works except for the fact that it doesn't do anything to help with Drop Rates of useable upgrades.

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