new Armour formula doesnt change a thing - it is still something you leave others to use
" High armour mitigates groupings of medium hits that will zerg you down, especially in maps when you got projectiles flying everywhere. Block helps spread it out to make it more manageable. The interactions with mechanisms such as Aegis Aurora and VMS also makes it absurdly strong. I think the devs had armour in mind when they think of block given both of those are on the same mod group on map mod rolls. I don't think shaper slams were made to be tanked, but then again I don't remember the last time I cared and a slam actually killed me. The first video is my character with armour. In the 2nd one I took off my stubborn students and turned off determination - same block chance. It was night and day. https://youtu.be/7K5f6YHbYs0 https://youtu.be/EW9AJyXYhkY Last edited by HamsterTrainer#0573 on Oct 11, 2021, 3:14:29 AM
|
|
" I agree with the most part, but what they actually doing is nerfing defense even more. They s*** on Gladiator big time, and it was one of the good defense you can get, and you still suffer big time damage in exchange. Duel Wield was always super compare to One Hand + Shield, cause the damage was a lot higher, and in terms of defense they were actually very similar. But now there maybe a so-so viable Dual Wield, but One hand and Shield Gladiator going to be ****** for most builds/skills. I don't want to play s****** channeling skills or s**** looking skills i play Gladiator or Marauder for example to be a ****** melee, and the 2 most melee skills in the game is completely dog****** - Double Strike and Heavy Strike. I switched from Double Strike to Frost Blade, and with the same investment my build become like 10x better. But still Rider with even lower investment is way better than the Gladiator. It still have great defense, due to evasion/dodge, and the damage is like 10x higher with the same investment. So why on the blue hell should i even play a melee type of character in this game ? You got pretty much a Cyclone, which is a dog***** looking with that simulator type of speed we had in the game. Armor needed to be buffed a lot more, and maybe even offer defenses, not just vs Physical damage, but to other sources as well. Only then a heavy invesment into it will be worth it. And does someone know if they are still going to use the same old **** formula in 3.16, that are using now?? At least this is from the POE wiki: To prevent 90% of damage, you need armour 90 times the damage (e.g. 9000 armour for 100 damage) Last edited by RoyalMarauder#1361 on Oct 11, 2021, 3:26:51 AM
|
|
|
that is Aegis Aurora build btw. your ARmour determines how much ES you regain on block. you can achieve similar thing with 0 AR and one shaper shield with 5%ES on block
Stubborn Students (+1 AR for 10 free mana) AKA: 'it is best to get AR from non-AR related sources' problem outlined in the manifesto. your build has 25000 resulting Armour. you get ~2100 BASE armour from Armour-related items (before %Armour). your 3 Stubborn Students give you 2700 BASE armour dont you see a problem with that? gaining Armour from mana (not converting! you are not even loosing anything in the process!) was always the best way of obtaining AR. sadly, limited to mana stackers. stacking mana is THE second strongest (after INT stacking) mechanic in the game, just because you get so much other stuff for free - tankiness, spell damage, mana obviously, energy shield, armour etc. and ability to use good/interesting items while stacking something that GGG tried VERY hard to make easily stackable i bet Stubborn Student is going to be changed/removed (Memory Vault got a kick, this one should too) try and replicate your build with AR items and see just how bad getting the same AR value is going to be, how much you are going to sacrifice Brass Dome + Jugg is not an answer, there are 8 other AR-aligned ascendancies, what about them? |
|
|
It ain't going to be all bad. Getting twice value of your armour rating is really good for melee chars, Jugg especially. I expect Jugg to be played this league. Being able to use Molten Shell has great value.
What they need to do is to add +2 Endurances and at least flat 15% more damage node in the Ascendancy and some increases thru End charges at the same time. In that case Jugg will be what it supposed to be, a char focused on stacking defenses while not being utter trash in damage department. That would give a lot room to work with. Last edited by TorsteinTheFallen#1295 on Oct 11, 2021, 4:37:55 AM
|
|
|
we could get the same result (almost) - 'twice the Armour' with 'Imbalanced Guard' keystone
go, check how popular it is. hint: it isnt. a) because AR sucks even WITH it b) endgame is mostly elemental/DoT anyway and AR does nothing against it (excluding Transcedence ofc) c) it is in worst part of the tree where noone wants to go stacking mana can make you immortal stacking ES can make you immortal stacking (spell)block makes you FEEL immortal stacking (spell)dodge makes you FEEL immortal stacking Endurance Charges + max res makes you immortal stacking AR gives you nothing in the end. Harvest pack with cold snakes, 5 auras in a modded map? your AR means jack sh.. and that is a huge problem, not addressed in the manifesto whatsoever |
|
" Thats the problem. you are not playing "armor character". you are gaining armor "for free". You have ~7.2k armor just from 4 stubborn students and "nothing else". Second thing. You showed us how good armor is in 2 different maps for some reason. first map have only crit multi, while second map have poison and extra as lightning. And ofc aegis aurora es on block doesnt work without armor. And as a result it just show how reta... glorious recovery on block is. " 0 times any number is still 0. Theres no reason to stack armor as a Jugg. you allready have 50% FLAT physical damage reduction with 10 endurance charges. Last edited by sckiff#0375 on Oct 11, 2021, 6:22:27 AM
|
|
|
Yeah exactly. Armor has been dog*****, and incredible unrewarding for the whole game existent.
|
|
" You mean armour makes Aegis Aurora godly? |
|
" Did you just say 4 small clusters and 2 medium clusters are free? Remember I can't reserve any mana for stubborn students to work so the medium clusters are required to get determination. The 2nd map is actually less lethal for the character especially for this character. I am basically immortal against poison given my mana regen is 2k, and crit would be more dangerous for a non armoured character rather than extra lightening. Check the dates on the video uploads if you want to know why they are different maps. Here is an 'armour character', more armour (when we both don't have flasks). https://poe.ninja/challenge/builds/char/%EA%B6%AE%EB%9B%9E%EB%B7%81/%EB%B9%88%EC%84%BC%ED%8A%B8%EA%B8%80%EB%9E%98%EB%94%94?i=1&search=item%3DReplica-Advancing-Fortress%26allskill%3DDetermination Also what is an 'armour character'? If you are investing a 50% aura, 4 small clusters, a banner, 2 medium clusters, and tree passives to get armour how is that not an 'armour character' |
|
" I don't even... Stubborn students is not free. You lose the ability to reserve mana which is massive in this game. Go into ninja and see how many people are actually stacking armour using stubborn students. It's literally me and one other mana guardian using spiders. Most good players know investing 2 mediums, 4 small clusters, a 50% aura and a banner is generally not worth the resulting effort. I just had to do it to get Stormbind to work for end game. And yes, 'Armour characters' can get very high levels of armour provided they bother to invest a bit as well into it. Check out some of the guys using replica advancing fortress. |
|
