Please Remove 10% Exp Loss on Death

Remove the penalty but make it take 5 times longer to reach lvl100.

Then give a 10% experience boost up to 100% max for each level achieved without any death. Lose all xp boost if you die.

Noobs will still get punished and it will take longer for people to reach lvl100. You need 10 levels in a row without deaths to double xp rate and a death will remove it.

This will probably improve player retention as people don't like to go backwards when they spend a few hours playing. Noobs can still grind away and aim for lvl100, which they will probably never reach as it would take 1000+ hours for them, but at least they won't quit.


This way still rewards players for building defensively and it could enable a new strat for racers. If they die and lose their xp boost, they can try and switch to full glass cannon to kill faster to try and keep up with the other racers who didn't die.



I usually just play one or two characters per league and as soon as I have a death, I just insta-quit and uninstall POE until the next league or the one after. I've been doing this for the last few years and GGG probably could see the logs where I don't come back for months each time after a death.

If I didn't lose experience and go backwards for dying, I'd probably stick around even after a character dies.
Last edited by SaiyanZ#3112 on Nov 15, 2019, 1:07:32 PM
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ArtCrusade wrote:
I am quoting a guy from Reddit who had this conversation with Chris Wilson before. Read carefully, that's GGG's stance on things.

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He said:

"I still remember quite well you Chris saying that "playing a game is about having fun and you see no reason to punish people for playing". Your game has become an excercise in frustration. I don't want to play "correctly" nor I want to play carefully. I play the way I want, the way I'm having fun. Death penalty is and should be present only in hardcore leagues, that means if you die, you die for good. For people that want to have an extra reason to struggle. People that want to have it easy, have no option to do so. Your game has either hardcore or insane levels of difficulty. For regular players that do not care about competition but only killing a few monsters now and then, death penalty reduction only moves the moment when the frustration sets in. That person will still quit your game, because he's still being punished for playing. If he wanted to be punished for playing in the first place, he would have chosen hardcore league."

Chris responded:

"Over the last week, for each mail like this, I've received five mails from people that are angry that we reduced the penalty. It's a pretty tough situation, but when faced with a split community, we have to keep our design true to the original vision. Path of Exile has always had a death penalty and while 15% was too high, we're very happy with how well 10% works in testing. I'm keen to hear your feedback after trying it out."

After trying it out, I wrote:

"15% or 10% is still getting punished for playing. I can't understand Chris why do you have 4 hardcore leagues, 1 semihardcore, and none softcore. Why does the hardcore crowd cannot play all their hardcore leagues and leave softcore people be? I cannot understand that part. Also, how difficult is to introduce ONE softcore league where people don't get punished at all? How does that influence your precious elitist hardcore crowd?

Why is it tough situation really? Hardcore people play hardcore, softcore play regular. One does not influence the other. Or is regular ment to be semihardcore as well for some unknown reason? Staying true to the original vision sounds like a bunch of crap. Sorry Chris for saying it straight, but that's how it is. You've changed your vision many times thanks to the hardcore crowd whining. I'm not hardcore nor I care to be. Either make the game fun for me and people like me, or you can count us out."

Chris responded:

"The game has always had a death penalty since before the date it was announced. It's a system that was present in Diablo 2 and honestly, we've tried playing without it and don't find the game enjoyable. While an experience penalty may not be the best system (there are others in testing), there has to be something so that player death isn't trivialised."


Over the years, people have kept complaining about the Death Penalty. But always there were more people in favour of it than against.

Be happy it's not 15% like it used to.


It's kinda funny how the community comes up with much more/better reasons for the death penalty than the actual developer. His reasoning bascially boils down to "We always had it".
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veixc wrote:
"
ArtCrusade wrote:


Over the years, people have kept complaining about the Death Penalty. But always there were more people in favour of it than against.

Be happy it's not 15% like it used to.


I dont care how much is it 10 or 15, i just dont play the game until it exists in the game. Havent payed single cent over the year, i went back to WOW and pay the 12 euros in month for them.

Remove it from game and i will give this money for GGG.


It's very pleasant to see that PoE treats WoW players the same way as Eve Online does

Nothing tastes better than the tears of a dirty WoW casual who want all games to look like their favorite children's sandboxes from Activision
Last edited by Tyralion1488#3021 on Nov 15, 2019, 2:38:01 PM
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Tyralion1488 wrote:
"
veixc wrote:
"
ArtCrusade wrote:


Over the years, people have kept complaining about the Death Penalty. But always there were more people in favour of it than against.

Be happy it's not 15% like it used to.


I dont care how much is it 10 or 15, i just dont play the game until it exists in the game. Havent payed single cent over the year, i went back to WOW and pay the 12 euros in month for them.

Remove it from game and i will give this money for GGG.


It's very pleasant to see that PoE treats WoW players the same way as Eve Online does

Nothing tastes better than the tears of a dirty WoW casual who want all games to look like their favorite children's sandboxes from Activision


I play many different games, not just WOW or POE. POE is good game but only without xp loss on death or they should fix the game performance. As i see the company isnt capable to fix their servers so its very vierd to me that you have death penalty but sometimes game just freezes. The death penalty is so old system that it should be removed, and all those excuses from developer that it has been here since beginning, its typical old school company leader who says " we have done so 15 years, why we should change something". Can you imagine some popular companies do same with their product, liek I phone, like BMW, where they would be id they do all thing like they do when they started. Its happens soon, when some game company comes out something similair like POE but much more smooth and playerfriendly.
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veixc wrote:
The death penalty is so old system that it should be removed

Let's use that nonsensical silly argument with ... let's say WOW.

"WOW is so old game that it should be removed"


see ? I can do it too.
SSF is not and will never be a standard for balance, it is not for people entitled to getting more without trading.
Without xp loss on death (or something else equivalently detrimental to progression) there would be no incentive in softcore to play anything but the most glassy of glass cannons to the total exclusion of all else.

You can make the argument that you want the type of game that is created in that scenario, but that game is not PoE. Saying that the death penalty performs no function is non-sequitur; it performs the function of shaping the scope of builds in a fashion that the developers want for their game.

That is to say, GGG wants you to have to invest in defenses to at least some degree, and death penalty is one of the ways in which they enforce that. You can ignore them and try to "beat the system", but more often than not it will cost you.

This is better than simply enforcing that you must spend x points on defensive nodes, for example, or something more arbitrary. It allows you as the player to exert agency and build a character that suits your own capabilities in the context of the game's difficulty. You can swing the pendulum more defensively or offensively to suit your needs, but every player will at some point tip off the equilibrium where your defenses are too low for your capabilities in the context of the content you are facing, and the game will feed this back to you by halting your progress.
Last edited by Pathological#1188 on Nov 15, 2019, 11:37:37 PM
Don't remove it or everyone will reach 100 eventually, thus making it irrelevant as an achievement.

Every time I die on level 98 or 99 I rage quit for a while but then I'm back at it eventually and once I reach 99 and/or 100 it feels all the better.

“Human decency is not derived from religion. It precedes it.”
― Christopher Hitchens
My QoL List: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/3279646
just change xp loss based on your latency. if you die to some server bullshit you get less loss than if you die to just failing.

i personally don't mind loosing 10% for things i know i could do better, but loosing 10% to "i just did stand still and then teleported back" is kind of bullshit.
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Pathological wrote:
Without xp loss on death (or something else equivalently detrimental to progression) there would be no incentive in softcore to play anything but the most glassy of glass cannons to the total exclusion of all else.


They just need to balance the game so that proper defenses are required to survive higher tier maps and then adjust the XP loss to a more reasonable amount i.e. no longer destroying the work of many hours in higher levels.
I totally agree with removing 10% exp lost upon death.
It's really discouraging to play on if you keep going backwards.
Losing 10% exp at above Lvl 90 is very painful due to the amount of grind needed to recover that 10% exp loss.
Furthermore, it discourage players from trying playing other harder side content such as Syndicate or Legions, etc as there are one shot mechanics from these bosses.
There is already HC mode and also private leagues which add further challenges to the game already.

Can GGG consider having a private league mod which does not incur exp penalty upon death?

Would gladly pay for such a private league.

This is the main reason I don't buy any more support packs unless GGG remove the death penalty.

If GGG does remove the death penalty, I would gladly spend at least 15 bucks a month to support.

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