An alternative for ascendency points.

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Turtledove wrote:

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diablofdb wrote:

well the lab is great I enjoy it and so does most POE player.

Doubtful that is true. Bottom line, you don't know and neither do I.

You doubt it because you dislike it, but do you really think GGG would sit and do nothing if it was a large of an issue as you would make it out to be?

Absolutely not, which indicates its 50\50 at worst, but more then likely the majority of people like it or the rewards enough to not bitch about it daily, unlike some people...

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sidtherat wrote:

only issue with the waypoint system is the logout macro...

That really cannot serve as a reason not to change things. A few people "cheating" should not fuck up the game play for all those others who don't.

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SisterBlister wrote:

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sidtherat wrote:

only issue with the waypoint system is the logout macro...

That really cannot serve as a reason not to change things. A few people "cheating" should not fuck up the game play for all those others who don't.

It won't be a few people, the majority of the disconnects would be from a player input, either disconnecting the cable or using a logout macro. So yes its actually a really good reason to not change something, because it opens up a very big window to cheat the challenge.

How hard do you think it would be for GGG to introduce a snap shot like feature where your life, flask charges, debuffs, everything was saved in that location on a disconnect?

Upon re-entering the game you are asked if you would like to continue your instance of the lab where you were disconnected (with the life\flask charges\ect you had) or if you don't want to continue.

Just adding my 2 cents. I think an alternative for ascendancy points would diminish the Labyrinth (I think its a cool concept). Its a reward for making it through the gauntlet (including enchant). For some reason this situation reminds me of playing God of War and dying hundreds of times to the same boss/zone. You reach a point where you know it well, you take pride in completing it successfully and learning it. There have been times where I got rekt by a bunch of traps in the lab while having depleted flasks but pulled it off by the skin of my teeth and it was a good feeling (although killing Izaro while your health is going off like a yoyo compares).

I think its challenging in a good way but not impossible; in comparison I did a rare corrupted Pit of the Chimera map and got completely destroyed lol.

Some tips for lab:

-Pick the left or right wall and follow it to the next area if its a side zone back out and keep following the wall to the next door (I skip all side areas to save on time in case I die to the boss on new chars or going for enchants)
-Bring staunching flasks for bleeding
-Bring movement skills to bypass certain obstacles
-You might want to consider a lightning coil paired with arctic armour for survivability (this helped me through uber lab).
-Learn the boss mechanics and once you understand his movements and the order of his skills you'll be able to dodge easier while dealing with room hazards.

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diablofdb wrote:

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SisterBlister wrote:

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Xeledon2132 wrote:

I dislike the Lab more now than in the beginning, mainly because I'm a notorious reroller. I had completed the Lab 40-50 times before being fed up to the point of not wanting to do it ever again.

That said, with a few changes to the Lab itself I could be made to swallow that toad again. I'd still prefer a real alternative, but here goes (hopefully without harming that precious lore):

1. Waypoints. Please take the fake hardcore out of my softcore. One before each Izaro fight would be ideal for my taste. Of course when any zone in the Lab is entered via a waypoint that run would not be viable for the leaderboard and Izaro's health would reset - no death zerging.

2. Ascendancy Point redistribution. I really don't want to do Lab runs for two points a pop on every character. I propose to let The Lab in each difficulty give all points that could have been acquired until that difficulty. That is to say: you may still do it for two points a pop in ech difficulty to get those points as soon as possible - but you could also skip 1st Lab and then gain 4 points in 2nd. You could do Über alone to acquire all 8 Points. Once per char would make me feel like my time was less disrespected.

+1, those are exactly my thoughts as well.
Two small changes and the lab would be fine by me. As it is, I consider it a tedious chore. Worth doing, but more work than play.

I think the lab and ascendency points should remain the same. You want that super power creep, need to work for it. You don't get that for free.

Im sorry but there isnt anything hard about Lab, its just annoying having to do it 4 times to complete it because the game crashes or the loading screen freezes. It is no more difficult then the rest of the game before double digit tier maps.

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SisterBlister wrote:

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sidtherat wrote:

only issue with the waypoint system is the logout macro...

That really cannot serve as a reason not to change things. A few people "cheating" should not fuck up the game play for all those others who don't.

its not the 'only issue' - what about the uberlab? Waypoints are (seem to be?) impossible here, 'permanent' portals like in master missions add other issues with abusing potential (while still not prevent from instance losses)

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鬼殺し wrote:

Okay. Assuming Ascendancy MUST be attached to the trials/lab, what's your dream scenario there?

-no longer bleed from the spikes that nail you in place (shredder and poison are obviously 'okay')
-maybe (some) less slow from poison?
-ideally: splitting ascending and enchanting into different pathes
(or, nearly as good, and as said before: respawn(s) that sacrifice the enchanting option (just go for the AP's)

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Mr_Cee wrote:

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鬼殺し wrote:

Okay. Assuming Ascendancy MUST be attached to the trials/lab, what's your dream scenario there?

-no longer bleed from the spikes that nail you in place (shredder and poison are obviously 'okay')
-maybe (some) less slow from poison?
-ideally: splitting ascending and enchanting into different pathes
(or, nearly as good, and as said before: respawn(s) that sacrifice the enchanting option (just go for the AP's)

Bleed is obviously not going to get removed, its one thing you as a player can and should work around. Hell its the only thing keeping ES relatively balanced now that they take less damage. Plus the uber lab's signature item fits very well with the theme of the labs. (deaths door, can't bleed)

Isn't an issue with the slow, the times people die is when they attempt to go thru a middle of an area and get bombarded with stuff and panic. If you stick to a wall you get hit by less things and considering the traps move, as long as you don't move with the trap perfectly you should be fine.

Probably not going to happen, the idea of the lab is to have most if not all of the rewards behind completing the challenge.


The lab is designed as a challenge that can and should be done without death and without disconnects. Its for that reason that waypoints or checkpoints were never implemented, don't like it, then do it fast enough that you won't run into issues.


Come up with some more realistic expectations, because I doubt GGG wants to dumb down the lab just to quite a few people.