[2.6] IMMORTAL MF GOLEMS - Shaper / Uber / ALL Guardians *WHILE DEAD*

Sure but if movement speed is the concern then two nicely rolled Experimenter's Quicksilver flasks are better. ;)

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tomay wrote:

Sure but if movement speed is the concern then two nicely rolled Experimenter's Quicksilver flasks are better. ;)

Cant use them both at the same time.

True again ... all depends whether you want to compete in a 100m sprint or a Marathon. :D

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tomay wrote:

True again ... all depends whether you want to compete in a 100m sprint or a Marathon. :D

Oh i am a sprinter myself. Maybe thats why ^^

For those of you using empower in your 6-link, can you tell us what you're not using?

Elemental Focus?
Minion Damage?
Controlled Destruction?
GMP?
Spell Echo?

I'm wondering why the debate is between empower and fire penetration. Fire penetration should not be in the 6-link.

Any of the above gems (all of which I'm using in my setup) are far better than empower. Empower should only be used in links where there is no meaningful gem left to use. For example I use it in my gloves:

Empower
Enlighten
Haste
Discipline

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VGLance wrote:

For those of you using empower in your 6-link, can you tell us what you're not using?

Elemental Focus?
Minion Damage?
Controlled Destruction?
GMP?
Spell Echo?

I'm wondering why the debate is between empower and fire penetration. Fire penetration should not be in the 6-link.

Any of the above gems (all of which I'm using in my setup) are far better than empower. Empower should only be used in links where there is no meaningful gem left to use. For example I use it in my gloves:

Empower
Enlighten
Haste
Discipline

Fire pen is usually removed while switching to empower.
Fire pen is way better than empower.
Also we dont use elemental focus because we want some juicy burning damage.
U are the only one who suggests fire pen should not be used... I dk why u said that.
The more resist monster has the more penetration lets u increase the damage.

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VGLance wrote:

Fire penetration should not be in the 6-link.

Huh??? Where else should one place Fire Penetration if not in the 6-link Summon Flame Golem setup?

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VGLance wrote:

For example I use it in my gloves:

Empower
Enlighten
Haste
Discipline

Empowering your Haste and Discipline is fine but has nothing to do with the discussion whether Empower is better than Fire Penetration with regard to the Flame Golem performance.

Sure, you can add Empower instead of GMP if you want raw maximum damage against single targets but this would require to re-colour your chest and your clear speed will suffer.

As for your golem setup setup with EF and CD, again simple maths prove the superiority of Empower:

lvl 21 Flame Golem avg base damage = 1197 + 93% (more damage from lvl 20 EF + CD) = 2310

lvl 24 Flame Golem avg base damage = 1612 + 49% (more damage from lvl 20 EF) = 2410

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MrsDeath_ wrote:

Fire pen is usually removed while switching to empower.
Fire pen is way better than empower.
Also we dont use elemental focus because we want some juicy burning damage.
U are the only one who suggests fire pen should not be used... I dk why u said that.

#1. Go back and read, I said fire pen is better between the two. Mostly because while it's useless on trash mobs, trash mobs are one-shot under either scenario anyway.

#2. That juicy burning damage is not juicy. It doesn't stack. The mere fact that you can choose application of one burning damage dot over 5 flame golems doing so much more damage every single time they hit, especially with spell echo is yet just further proof you are doing the readers of this thread a disservice.

Don't feel bad, most threads in this game are rife with inaccuracies because even after many years, an overwhelming number of players are still confused about game mechanics. The difference is whether or not you have the character to do the right thing and stop.

Just an FYI to everyone. Whenever you have an opportunity to increase "more" damage, take it. The way damage calculation works in this game, it's all about maximizing "more" damage because increased is additive and more is multiplicative.

At level 51, an Elemental Focus gem gives you 50% MORE elemental damage, and at 20% quality, you get an additional 10% INCREASED elemental damage.

Who in their right mind would give up all that damage for a single DoT that is outpaced by miles from continued raw direct damage from 5 golems rapid firing?

Don't believe me, try it for yourselves. Not many things are noticeable due to the sheer numbers of hitpoints bosses have where a little increased damage isn't going to be discernible, but this is actually something you can visibly see.

Still don't believe me? Watch the video below:

I don't care for the Ignites (Burning Damage), using EF myself but in regard to your gem setuo (EF and CD) Empower still trumps Controlled Destruction on the damage front not to mention the greatly increased golem life.

Fire Penetration really shines if we die while fighting The Shaper/Guardians and it can easily be swapped for Empower where needed.

Edit: I stand corrected, the damage with CD + EF is actually slightly higher than with Empower + EF. However, vs Shaper/Guardians, the primary targets with this build (I don't use this build to kill joke bosses), EF + Fire Penetration is much more effective compared to CD + EF, especially if one dies during the fight which can happen quite regularly when in "full MF mode". I dare you running a Guardian map with 40% elemental resistances mod without Fire Penetration, that boss fight will be utterly painful. ;)

And let's not forget the option to swap in Empower without having to re-colour the chest if one wants to push the golem life "through the roof".