SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

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Turtledove wrote:

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sidtherat wrote:

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The only good thing about map is the boss, I forget his name. The rest of the monsters are boring white trash monsters that only serve to refresh flasks.

isnt this EXACTLY what POE had become?

mobs that do no serve any purpose other than to refill ones flasks? boss that is so trivial that it can die 'in meanwhile' and at the end of it - overtuned pimple with 20x the HP pool and 10k auto-attacks..

the lab is EXACLTY what POE is atm. regardless of all the other arguments - this one always makes me laugh. guys, POE is exactly this - throngs of XP bubbles that refresh flasks and drop loot with a big pimple at the end..

the same exact thing

No, it is not the exact same thing from my point of view. In a regular map there is the excitement that frequently blue and yellow monsters are mixed in. Plus in a regular map you do not have the extra boring poorly executed platformer-jump-here-run-there game play.

NOT the same exact thing

Plus that content FEELS like the next evolution of d2 and has the feel the game we love has. Cruse along hit some hard blues or yellows and maybe even die or have the game crash.

But that's cool because I have having fun even when going backwards. LAB I win I am angry, I lose I am more angry. I get fat loot I am madder because I am rewarded for not having fun.

The ra ra ra guys are the ones saying play the crappy and like it because it's part of being a good computer gamer.

At the end of the day some of us do play the game to have fun by being challanged by non shity content we like live or die.

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torturo wrote:

What I really don't understand is why there weren't any deep, significant reworks, while it's obvious there's a problem. Arrogance? Pride? Ignorance? Would be good to know.

You mean, you haven't considered that what you said right before was wrong ( not saying that everybody likes it at all, of course ) ?
Plus they don't need to have a majority loving the lab.

Is there a majority of players liking the Malachai fight ?
I surely don't think so.

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Zalhan2 wrote:

How more casual can it be than pay 2-4C and avoid it. The fact is even if you can avoid it by cheating it's still bad ARPG content and should be optional, if in the game at all.

By that logic, the whole ocntent is "bad ARPG content".
What are you doing here ?

PS : being "I am angry[...]I am madder" about a video game is a clear sign of troubles from your end.

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Turtledove wrote:

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sidtherat wrote:

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The only good thing about map is the boss, I forget his name. The rest of the monsters are boring white trash monsters that only serve to refresh flasks.

isnt this EXACTLY what POE had become?

mobs that do no serve any purpose other than to refill ones flasks? boss that is so trivial that it can die 'in meanwhile' and at the end of it - overtuned pimple with 20x the HP pool and 10k auto-attacks..

the lab is EXACLTY what POE is atm. regardless of all the other arguments - this one always makes me laugh. guys, POE is exactly this - throngs of XP bubbles that refresh flasks and drop loot with a big pimple at the end..

the same exact thing

No, it is not the exact same thing from my point of view. In a regular map there is the excitement that frequently blue and yellow monsters are mixed in. Plus in a regular map you do not have the extra boring poorly executed platformer-jump-here-run-there game play.

NOT the same exact thing

???

so now Lab cannot spawn rares and blues? you are desperate right now. moved from insulting and beying annoying to simply lying..

if you comment on something you havent ever experienced (that is even worse than lying btw) then there is a fact: lab CAN spawn rares, blues, exiles, shrines, ghosts, boxes.. the list goes on. and the nice part is that the density is so freaking hight that you can swim in this stuff

hatred obscures wisdom it seems..

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sidtherat wrote:

and the nice part is that the density is so freaking hight that you can swim in this stuff

You had to play some different lab... Density is low as hell, not only compared to maps like Atoll or Strand, but it is crap overall

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Nishrek wrote:

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sidtherat wrote:

and the nice part is that the density is so freaking hight that you can swim in this stuff

You had to play some different lab... Density is low as hell, not only compared to maps like Atoll or Strand, but it is crap overall

No it's clearly not, Lab is one of the most dense area of the whole game, clearly.
It's not apex's level, but it still is pretty high, there are shrines and boxes like everywhere.

You are speaking of something that you really have little knowledge of.
I mean, let's look at your ascended character, and the number of ascendancy points that they have allocated :
- 6
- 4
- 0
- 4
- 4

Which means that you likely have 3 cruel-ascended char, one merc ascended char, 0 uber ascended char and one unknown.

This whole discussion about "what the lab is" and "what the lab isn't" is starting to get old.

Fact: A LOT (no, I didn't say majority) of players find the lab tremendously boring.

Several trials in normal, several trials in cruel and a couple of trials in merciless - on top of that, you have the labs themselves AND the grind for all uber lab trials. We're not talking about "a small part of the game" anymore. We're talking on one of the biggest parts. At the end, you spend more time in the lab (trials and labs) than any other part of the game, besides end game grinding.

So the question becomes: Why are GGG so hellbent on keeping the lab such a big part of the game, when so many players clearly find it so damn boring?

You find it fun? Good for you, no one is stopping you from running it. No one is suggesting to remove it for you. I don't even think there's many players suggesting to remove the loot or the enchantments either. Yet so many people in here (and GGG) are so hellbent on the idea that everyone NEEDS to force themselves through each freakin' lab and trials. It's almost like they believe that an alternative would ruin the game - or their own enjoyment of the lab. The logic is silly. At best.

you bought the pack - so do you really hate it that much?

and given this logic (why keep it when people hate it) - you can just as well remove everyhitng from the game because it all is (to some minor or major group) a boredom: masters, leveling, lab, enchants, trading, death penalty, bad mod rolls, picking up items etc

it is not YOUR game. GGG made the game this way: like it or leave it. i do not think that you are in position to make demands projecting your likes/dislikes on people who make the game

i HATE when they moved with 'balance' and 'design' - it is quickly becoming a shallow lowest-denominator targeting product - and once it reaches the breaking point, im going to leave. bitching wont change a damn thing


a hint to the 'hate crowd' - you have insulted devs SO MANY TIMES that they might (just might!) keep it in the game just to make you cry inside. im sure that they can afford this sport.

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Phrazz wrote:

Several trials in normal, several trials in cruel and a couple of trials in merciless - on top of that, you have the labs themselves AND the grind for all uber lab trials. We're not talking about "a small part of the game" anymore.

Yes we are, a veeery small part :

Trials are only needed once per league.
Uber trials are named, you can just do only 6 of them if you just want the ascendancy ( and you can buy more offerings if you fail at it, although if you fail you might need more practice that the trials can offer. )
There is no "grind" for Uber trials, you only need to do 6 of them, period.

There are just the labs remaining, basically. the rest is pretty much negligible.


PS : Boring is usually associated with something that takes time.
Good/quick players needing less than 10 mins, and okayish ones less than 20 or 15 if they rush, that can hardly be considered "boring", unless the player isn't actually good at the lab and is spending much more time in it.
In which case, it's basically a difficulty issue.

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Fruz wrote:

You are speaking of something that you really have little knowledge of.
I mean, let's look at your ascended character, and the number of ascendancy points that they have allocated :

Because I have to get AP to see what is density in all levels? Riiight...

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Fruz wrote:

PS : Boring is usually associated with something that takes time.
Good/quick players needing less than 10 mins, and okayish ones less than 20 or 15 if they rush, that can hardly be considered "boring", unless the player isn't actually good at the lab and is spending much more time in it.
In which case, it's basically a difficulty issue.

It's close to the largest "themed" part of the game, counted in minutes from the first trial to the last, including everything.

And boring doesn't equal "something that takes time". I know it would suit your arguments better, but you are wrong. "Boring" has to do with the amount of enjoyment you get from "time spent". I can view a god damn 5 second commercial boring, because those 5 seconds gives me NOTHING in form of enjoyment.

And I can do the lab with my eyes closed on some characters. It... Is... Not... Difficult. Again, I know it would suit your arguments better if I found it difficult, but I don't. I'm sorry.

I know "fun" is subjective, and that some players find "fun" in looking at numbers; numbers on the ladder leader board, 40/40 numbers besides their names in the forums and so on. Everything up to that point is just means to an end for them. Others, like me, we have another views of the word "fun", and that is the enjoyment of the journey itself.

Why not stop focusing on what YOU believe I feel, and start answering some question?

- What do YOU feel the game has to loose on giving players an alternative way to earn ascendancy points?
- What do YOU have to loose?
- What is the lab offering, that is so important to keep?
- Would YOU run the lab for pure enjoyment, if there wasn't any rewards you couldn't get from elsewhere in the game?