SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

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AceNightfire wrote:

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Fruz wrote:

I don't think that traps ignore immortal call.

There are not really "platforms" here, and you have
- potions ( life, mana and basalt, they all can matter )
- your ES recharge matters, as well as the recovery rate
- your move speed matters and life regeneration too of course, but it's not significant unless you stack it like crazy
- your movement skills matter of course ( too much for some )
- your evasion, block and armor matters in some cases ( darts, floor spikes for armour apparently )
- with uber your dps matters
- with uber, in some cases your resistances matter
- if you are Berserker your warcry can matter
- if you are occultist one of your passive will matter a lot
- if you are pathfinder, your potions matter even more
- Some specific uniques matter
- some vaal skills can matter ( vaal discipline )

Most of those stats won't help you against the most annoying type of traps:

- Sawblades
- Spinning Blades
- Blade Sentries

I listed 12 elements.
On those 12 elements, 8 do matter.
I did not include Energy shield in the 8, but it actually matters, if you ES regen can kick in before the sawblade comes back, it matters.
That makes 8~9 elements from 12 ....
Most of it do actually matter.
And darts can hurt, some do, and in situation where they are even more dangerous because of other traps, evasion is a thing.

And I even forgot to put immortal call in there, that's +1

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AceNightFire wrote:

That's not true. A trap itself may have the same pattern, but the combination of certain factors change everything:

- Multiple trap types in one layout (example: blade sentries + poison darts)
- Room layout (certain walls can't be passed with mobility skills and some rooms dont offer much safe spaces)
- Complexity of trap movement (Sometimes traps are close together and the movement pattern of all traps is harder to predict)
- Enemies in the trap layouts (example: skeletons that stop you from walking in a straight line)
- Sentinal Traps in ubber lab (slow, damage, no mobility skills etc.)

It is completely true, they always have the same exact pattern, and if there are more than on type of traps, that makes the pattern last longer, but ultimately, it's a static pattern than you can figure out.
Uber traps accounted for.
The room layout is also fixed once you reached it.

About 2 screens wide traps ... it's more difficult yeah, but there is always a place where you can switch between 2 easy spots indefinitely making it somewhat safe ( if there isn't a safe spot already ).

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AceNightfire wrote:

1. There are not many bosses that can one-shot you
2. You can avoid maps that have bosses that can one-shot you

So you have the choice and can avoid the dangerous content. Not possible with Lab/Izaro.

Oversoul
Dominus
Voll
Malachai

Unless you completely overlevel it, and even tho, Merc Dominos ToG, Oversoul's smash, Piety's beam and Malachai's smash can easily either one shot or instant kill you.
And for some challenges, those maps bosses are not optional btw.

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AceNightFire wrote:

Degen Clouds are unproblematic, since the aoe is quite small and the field moves slowly. Also, it takes some time until a cloud kills you.

That is purely subjective.
Those degen clouds are pretty freaking big considering the size of the arena.
It takes some time until a trap can kill you too, it is faster, but you don't have one shots next to it.


TLDR:
Traps are not exactly like what people seem to do most in PoE ( brainlessely bashing mobs ), but it is very far from being as different as couple of people in this forum would like to make it look like.

on a side note Atlas of worlds looks somewhat cool so game will see a bump when its out for a bit for sure

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Prebornfetus wrote:

on a side note Atlas of worlds looks somewhat cool so game will see a bump when its out for a bit for sure

Until people realize they are still stuck with Lab as it is and quit again. It completely destroys any incentive to play more than one character, and even drastically reduces the kinds of characters you might want to run as your first for that season. It's the opposite of what PoE should be about in nearly every meaningful way. [Removed by Support]

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Albinosaurus wrote:

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Prebornfetus wrote:

on a side note Atlas of worlds looks somewhat cool so game will see a bump when its out for a bit for sure

Until people realize they are still stuck with Lab as it is and quit again. It completely destroys any incentive to play more than one character, and even drastically reduces the kinds of characters you might want to run as your first for that season. It's the opposite of what PoE should be about in nearly every meaningful way. [Removed by Support]

true story

We can only hope they fix it on next major update like 3.0 or its lights out at least for me. I havent played since 6/27 and I dont miss it at all. Been playin other games. Hell I even regot might and magic heroies iii over again high def and am replaying on imppossible....dang that game is so hard

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Prebornfetus wrote:

We can only hope they fix it on next major update like 3.0 or its lights out at least for me. I havent played since 6/27 and I dont miss it at all. Been playin other games. Hell I even regot might and magic heroies iii over again high def and am replaying on imppossible....dang that game is so hard

But you still come to QQ on the forums .. even though you obviously don't miss it.
And there is nothing to "fix".

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Prebornfetus wrote:

on a side note Atlas of worlds looks somewhat cool so game will see a bump when its out for a bit for sure

You don't know how many traps will be in there yet.
I might just be an extra map mod or something, or a map socket property, who knows ...

For what matters, let me add my two bits here. Have a lvl 84 necromancer, play on and off. Was excited with a few changes (poison damage, Animate Weapon Jewel, etc) that I thought positively affected my damage with a skill that I liked but was otherwise niche.

Saw the ascendancy points, and was quite charged up. Tried the labyrinth. Tried a couple more times. Tried it with someone who was nice enough to take me through. With tips and advice and encouragement for free.
Gave it up as too much for a game.

Saddest part is just a few months back (before the Labyrinth - or before playing it at least),I gave GGG my money because I thought this was a game I would come back to for years. Currently, I just don't have the time to clear the lab, and then "play the proper game".

The Atlas of Worlds expansion looks really nice. I hope they make the AC Points available in some other way so that I can play.

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starlight7 wrote:

For what matters, let me add my two bits here. Have a lvl 84 necromancer, play on and off. Was excited with a few changes (poison damage, Animate Weapon Jewel, etc) that I thought positively affected my damage with a skill that I liked but was otherwise niche.

Saw the ascendancy points, and was quite charged up. Tried the labyrinth. Tried a couple more times. Tried it with someone who was nice enough to take me through. With tips and advice and encouragement for free.
Gave it up as too much for a game.

Saddest part is just a few months back (before the Labyrinth - or before playing it at least),I gave GGG my money because I thought this was a game I would come back to for years. Currently, I just don't have the time to clear the lab, and then "play the proper game".

The Atlas of Worlds expansion looks really nice. I hope they make the AC Points available in some other way so that I can play.

Sorry you can't do some content. That happens in every game. You just have to practice.

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Xtorma wrote:

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starlight7 wrote:

For what matters, let me add my two bits here. Have a lvl 84 necromancer, play on and off. Was excited with a few changes (poison damage, Animate Weapon Jewel, etc) that I thought positively affected my damage with a skill that I liked but was otherwise niche.

Saw the ascendancy points, and was quite charged up. Tried the labyrinth. Tried a couple more times. Tried it with someone who was nice enough to take me through. With tips and advice and encouragement for free.
Gave it up as too much for a game.

Saddest part is just a few months back (before the Labyrinth - or before playing it at least),I gave GGG my money because I thought this was a game I would come back to for years. Currently, I just don't have the time to clear the lab, and then "play the proper game".

The Atlas of Worlds expansion looks really nice. I hope they make the AC Points available in some other way so that I can play.

Sorry you can't do some content. That happens in every game. You just have to practice.

Don't really have the time to "practice" now. I get playtime on weekends. Prefer to actually play, rather than practice.

Plus the lab is not the kind of game I want to play. I never did like the Arcade style of games - stopped playing them long back.

Wow, so much lack of understanding and putting words in other people's mouths to argue against... kinda glad I took such a long break from both the game and forums. (just read 40+ pages to catch up)

For me, I can get past traps just fine, and Izaro was challenging, but killable... not an issue of difficulty. I didn't like playing it at all. It's not a skill check; it's not testing worthyness of anyone. It's an exercise in tedium and battling crashes and disconnects and real life. The biggest issues I have with it is what it reveals about the designers. They do not respect my time invested, nor understand how to create a game feature where they KNOW people WILL have issues that make the content as designed either uncompleteable or super irritating to complete.

So as far as I'm concerned, if they won't respect me, or plan ahead realistically, why should I stick around to be disrespected or disregarded? And why should I expect their future designs to be done with realistic understanding of the game format in mind (online, with many reasons for changing connection qualities, some controllable, some not)

As far as the "it's optional content" arguement goes, I play games to progress my characters. To know there are key defining customizations locked away behind something I will not do, kills progression before I get started. What's the point in progressing my character if I know I can't draw out the potential and use it to have fun? Yeah, no point, just regret that I'd invest any time in the game to begin with.

Obviously I'd never invest any of my time in "hardcore" modes of the game, since I hate losing my progress. Insisting on injecting this feeling into the standard game kills my enjoyment.

Overall, the game's core systems of the skill tree, the complex itemization, the combat system in general, the complex interactions between special stats, the customization of my character... is what drew me into this game.

The Labyrinth cancels out all the good, and makes me feel the game isn't worth my time.

P.S.(I didn't even go into how heavily it favors certain builds, when it's the ONLY way to obtain ascention... why not have multiple ways, and just use the method that fits your style of play, showing that you can ascend in that area? Right now, everyone has to prove their build can surpass one challenge that is not an equally balanced check of skill for all character builds... how does the labyrinth make sense? it doesn't... on so many levels, from thematic to technical... it's infuriating and sickening that they think it's so great)