SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

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miljan wrote:

So no changes in this expansion 9as expected). But maybe in future. So the highest chance for a change is the next expansion in september, when they move their focus away from the labyrinth. So people keep up the fighting so there is a higher chance of it happening.

If you guys keep fighting the way you have it will keep having the opposite effect. It's not a coincidence that Chris basically devoted as little as time as possible to this topic after the most vocal anti-lab peoples have been making the personification of dialectics weep softly in the corner.

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dickhole_mcghee wrote:

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miljan wrote:

So no changes in this expansion 9as expected). But maybe in future. So the highest chance for a change is the next expansion in september, when they move their focus away from the labyrinth. So people keep up the fighting so there is a higher chance of it happening.

If you guys keep fighting the way you have it will keep having the opposite effect. It's not a coincidence that Chris basically devoted as little as time as possible to this topic after the most vocal anti-lab peoples have been making the personification of dialectics weep softly in the corner.

How exactly are we fighting it that is wrong? Do you even know what you are posting here, or your just trolling? We fight by making threads and polls, and comments on videos, emailing devs and similar? That is bad way of fighting, why? If we didnt do anything, he would not even say one word about it (and that they are not closed to the idea of getting the points other ways in the future) and think that everyone likes that crap.

Did someone threaten the lives of devs or some crap like that, that I missed?

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miljan wrote:

How exactly are we fighting it that is wrong? Do you even know what you are posting here, or your just trolling? We fight by making threads and polls, and comments on videos, emailing devs and similar? That is bad way of fighting, why? If we didnt do anything, he would not even say one word about it (and that they are not closed to the idea of getting the points other ways in the future) and think that everyone likes that crap.

Did someone threaten the lives of devs or some crap like that, that I missed?

Basically I mean the 'quality over quantity' approach along with not being so antagonistic towards anybody that slightly disagrees. Taking the time to develop a clear and internally consistent argument that holds up to scrutiny. Learning how a formal/semiformal debate/discussion works on a fundamental level.

The lab sucks .

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sidtherat wrote:

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gathor wrote:

Also you are suggesting that GGG know what they are doing?

im pretty sure they do. however not in the way you think it means: they know perfectly well what is good for the finances of the company.

So that's why we get panic-nerfs like Bino's and Voltaxic and Crown of Eyes and bladefall and incinerate and Kaom's and IIQ and and and? Then we get panic-buffs like the one to spark this last time round?

Because they know with a capital K what they're doing?

No, they do what they do because the E-Peen Comparison Consortium (the hardcore faction on reddit) demand such actions.

This is why this game's skill structure swings back and forth like a pendulum. There's no-one actually driving the ship, it's all done based on how popular something is, and how many of the EPCC demand a change, crying babies that they are.

and yes, the lab sucks, but the EPCC (pronounced "epic" in case you didn't know) have a hard-on over it because it's a forced hardcore experience. So it's going nowhere, and i'll just buy my carrys because I can't be arsed to learn to play an entirely different way from the rest of the game just to fight one cheap-shotting boss in a crowded space where one false step means I've wasted 20 minutes of my valuable time.

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miljan wrote:

So no changes in this expansion 9as expected). But maybe in future. So the highest chance for a change is the next expansion in september, when they move their focus away from the labyrinth. So people keep up the fighting so there is a higher chance of it happening.

This isn't an expansion, so I don't know why you keep calling it that, either your ignorant or lazy, in either case it doesn't help your cause.


As for the statement Chris made is he said its something that is possible, but at this time isn't something that is planned. If anything he made it clear that you can't just change stuff because some people are upset, otherwise you end up with a bland game or part of the game that neither party likes at all.

The highest chance for a change is really the likelyhood that it isn't going to happen at all. Think about it, even if they remove the first 6 points, there isn't an equivalent option to allow you to get the last 2 points, you are talking about a considerable amount of work, in order to what make some people happy they don't have to do the lab, except they would if they wanted to get the last 2 points, pretty much no matter what. If anything the uber lab really does dictate that GGG isn't (at least at this stage) willing to change the lab to remove ascendancy from it, thats just clear by Chris's statements and the overall direction the game is going with the uber lab as well.

As for the next expansion, there is a slight chance they could make some of it easier to access, but I think after they streamlined the game in 2.0 they wanted this additional power to take some additional time to acquire, I dont think just because it wont be the sole main focus of the next expansion that they will suddenly just give it away for free, like most of the suggestions are trying to do, more importantly I dont think having to do the lab 3-4 times on each character is that much overall time out of a character, that its too intrusive or restrictive for characters to progress and still do all the things they want. A good chance GGG agrees with me and they see that if people dont or aren't good at running the lab, they can "pay for" rushes or have a friend help them out, negating most of the time and issues people can have. People say its like frogger and they really isn't true, frogger you get hit once and your dead, it takes a pretty significant error on the players part to die from traps, seeing as they do a % of life over time.


The same few people, yourself included just repeating the same arguements over and over isn't going to help the battle, if you want your point to succeed then you need fresh blood that adds more then "i dont like traps" you need more people willing to post experiences and how the lab could be changed to be more enjoyable to them, rather then just removing AC from the lab, seeing as its far more likely for GGG to change the lab, even if just a little bit, then it is for them to move AC from the lab.


I don't want people to quit over the lab, but at the same time I don't want GGG just to cave at every single topic that gets a few people bumping the thread constantly to make it look like a massive issue, when its not. If you are posting here and won't return to the game until AC is removed from the lab or they change it, next league isn't going to have that change. If you are playing in standard, good news is you only have to do the trials once (for that league) and if the character was made before the deadline you only have to do the lab once, to get all 6 of your points, which means there is no reason for you to quit, just because of the lab. You could spend 10 min and if necessary like 5 chaos and get each one of your characters thru the lab and be done with it. If you are playing in temp leagues or a temp league only player, its still streamlined, just requires a bit more time.

OP you got your answer, no change is planned and its not going to happen this next patch. Quit or don't but this topic will be irrelevant until we get additional feedback from the streamlined process going forward and perhaps when we can discuss the 4th lab.

Here's the interview https://www.twitch.tv/zenocidegenius/v/68003659

Chris starts talking about ascendancy at about 33:00. He talks specifically about ascendancy points being moved from horrible trap game play at about 39:00.

Listen for yourself, he doesn't really seem to slam the door on the idea as much as Goetzjam's last post implies. For example, he doesn't really say no change is planned. Instead he just doesn't say that it will be done.

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Turtledove wrote:

Here's the interview https://www.twitch.tv/zenocidegenius/v/68003659

Chris starts talking about ascendancy at about 33:00. He talks specifically about ascendancy points being moved from horrible trap game play at about 39:00.

Listen for yourself, he doesn't really seem to slam the door on the idea as much as Goetzjam's last post implies. For example, he doesn't really say no change is planned. Instead he just doesn't say that it will be done.

lol anyone who listened to it would hear him say specifically

"While the people are vocal who dont like it, it is only a small portion of the players, many are happy to run through it". (Ive been saying this everytime the topic is mentioned just how insignificant the amount of players being vocal and complaining are by comparison of everyone else).

"Its okay to have divisive content in the game"

The only thing he says is "maybe it will change but its not happening this expansion" and anyone who has ever understood when GGG says maybe its usally hard pressed to almost never change.

Ascendancy is a large amount of power and that power deserves to be earned by doing something difficult, GGG clearly thinks that and they think thats fine.

With his closing statement on the subject being "we are pretty proud of the labyrinth and the role it has".

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Tin_Foil_Hat wrote:

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Turtledove wrote:

Here's the interview https://www.twitch.tv/zenocidegenius/v/68003659

Chris starts talking about ascendancy at about 33:00. He talks specifically about ascendancy points being moved from horrible trap game play at about 39:00.

Listen for yourself, he doesn't really seem to slam the door on the idea as much as Goetzjam's last post implies. For example, he doesn't really say no change is planned. Instead he just doesn't say that it will be done.

lol anyone who listened to it would hear him say specifically

"While the people are vocal who dont like it, it is only a small portion of the players, many are happy to run through it". (Ive been saying this everytime the topic is mentioned just how insignificant the amount of players being vocal and complaining are by comparison of everyone else).

"Its okay to have divisive content in the game"

The only thing he says is "maybe it will change but its not happening this expansion" and anyone who has ever understood when GGG says maybe its usally hard pressed to almost never change.

Ascendancy is a large amount of power and that power deserves to be earned by doing something difficult, GGG clearly thinks that and they think thats fine.

With his closing statement on the subject being "we are pretty proud of the labyrinth and the role it has".

If you haven't ever been in business then perhaps you're not aware but, it is the job of the head of the company to put the best story forward possible. So even if he thought it turned out to be a big mistake, he's not going to say that. Or at least it wouldn't be smart for him to say that. For example, that could be devastating just considering internal politics. That's a fact. It was true that he did not say no change is planned as Goetzjam mistakenly stated. It is also true that he said he was not against such a change.