The Chisel Bubble: Using currency to roll maps, vs buying maps

i initially thought it wasn't worth alch'ing mid tier maps as well. but once i did i noticed a fairly significant gain in loot. i figured as long as it doesn't affect clear speed too much, it's worth it.


ex: 1 alt gets me about 1 to 2 full inventory on a full clear (lets say on average 1.5)
ex: 1 alch gets me about 2 to 3 full inventories on a full clear (lets say on average 2.5)
(with my current loot filter -> i pick up everything it shows)

that's certainly more than the "30%'ish IIQ" rare maps have over magic. 2.5/1.5 = 66.6% more desireable loot. now this is going off of memory, meaning i could be way wrong and just viewing it with rose tinted glass. suppose I'll write down some notes of specific currency found in 10'ish magic maps compared to 10'ish rare maps.


basically what i think this post missed was the "baked in" increased quantity found on rare/magic, extra boss, ect mod's. these hidden baked in IQ's multiply with the shown IIQ of the map.

as in, 30% more rare mobs (and other similar mods) does more than a IIQ of 12%.

hell, Otherworldly - Slaying Enemies close together can attract monsters from Beyond 12% IIQ 6% IIR is just nutty with Slithering - Area is inhabited by Sea Witches and their Spawn IIQ 6% 3% IIR. So many additional packs spawn due to massive mob pack density

(now assuming the above statement is wrong)
2nd point i would like to make is that if enough players do use said strategy, price of buying maps will go up.

with all that said, yes, OP has a point. I'm just saying the best strategy is somewhere between what OP says to be true and what is being done by the average player running mid-tier+ maps.

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Mentoya wrote:

...

Another personal reason I love alching is because running blue maps is boring as fuck, but I find running yellow maps a blast, because the mods are so much more challenging

+1

You failed to consider the opportunity cost of buying maps vs quickly rolling and running them

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LordAdagio wrote:

Personally, I’m not sure to understand what was the initial question.

Let’s take a very simple example. I have a white map, level 8. It’s my last map. I also have an alch, and there is another level 8 map (also white) for sale, for 1 alch.

So is the question: is it better to throw the alch in the map, for augmenting my chances to get my next map, or just run it blue (assuming it’s free) and directly buy a new one with my alch?

If yes, I don’t understand how any conclusion can be drawn without taking into account the map drop rate. Certainly, the answer to the question is different if a map drops on average 10 other maps, or only 1 (without even talking of their level).

Or is the question: is it better to run my single alched map, or run the 2 blue maps, for the same price? In that case indeed the answer is independent of the map drop rate, but unless I’m missing something, with the second map you have the equivalent of +100% quantity, vs +30 or 40% for the single yellow, so the answer is relatively obvious. If you don’t take time into account, I mean. As already pointed out above, certainly the most relevant factor here is how you value your time vs your currency.

If you are down to your last white T8 map and you have to choose between Alch'ing your white T8 or buying someone else's white T8.... you better be buying the T8. At that tier and playing solo, odds are no matter how you roll the map... a T8 or better isn't going to drop.

Yes, you will have lucky streaks, and unlucky streaks, but at that tier and solo, on average... T7+ is unsustainable from map drops.

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Entropic_Fire wrote:

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Galtrovan wrote:

Yes, you will have lucky streaks, and unlucky streaks, but at that tier and solo, on average... T7+ is unsustainable from map drops.

If T7+ was unsustainable you would never be able to buy any. Since you can buy multiple T8 for less than 1c I would say they are clearly sustainable for most people with very little investment.

That isn't the point; I don't think anyone is arguing that t7s are sustainable by running them. My point is that they are more sustainable by trading for them. Meaning you end up with more currency refusing to roll them "properly."

Really, the best deal is to avoid running lower-mid tier maps at all in a developed economy. Just buy a handful of upper-mid Tier maps - whatever Tier at which it makes economic sense to Alch your maps - and if you run out somehow, buy more. There's no need to do the t1-t8 process if others can do it for you, and sell t9s to you cheap.

I look at it differently.

I am all for trading to get gear, jewels, gems, [INSERT tangible good here]. It just rubs me the wrong way having to trade for maps. Especially non-unique or non-T14+ maps.

With trading interwoven in just about EVERYTHING this game offers, I personally feel that having maps tied to trading is too much.

The only way I can put it is this:

Imagine a FPS shooter where you could trade for guns, grenades, different types of ammo, etc...
BUT the only catch is that you also have to trade for maps that you can actually use those guns on.
So I trade for all of this loot...now I have to trade in order to use the loot in an environment? And that environment is a One-time use only which may or may not perpetuate another playable arena?

It just doesn't sit well with me. I think everyone should have access to mid-high tier mapping without trading T10-T13, but that simply is not the case. Even with alch/chaos/vaaling to super high difficulty, more often than not your investment is wasted.

It simply "feels" bad...and no amount of statistics and math massaging will make me feel otherwise.

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Galtrovan wrote:

Yes, you will have lucky streaks, and unlucky streaks, but at that tier and solo, on average... T7+ is unsustainable from map drops.

That is just not true. I do really not like the map drop system, even though I had a few good days lately. But T7+ is sustainable with just alch-and-go on T7+, and chisel-alch on T10+. You might have to invest a bit more into the T12+ maps, and it might take a while. But right now, my T7+ map stash barely contains any T7s or T8s, and I started up-vendoring my T9s.