Self-Found (League) [Thread outdated!]

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Jackel6672 wrote:

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Wittgenstein wrote:

I'd assume a SFL wouldn't allow trading correct? So, increasing drop rates in such a league seems perfectly balanced to me.

It would still make it easier than the parent league. As they can play that way already.

I completely disagree. Having the option to trade would make the parent league substantially easier, even if the drop rates were increased in SFL.

how much of an increased drop rate we talking about.?

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Kellog wrote:

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Jackel6672 wrote:

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Wittgenstein wrote:

I'd assume a SFL wouldn't allow trading correct? So, increasing drop rates in such a league seems perfectly balanced to me.

It would still make it easier than the parent league. As they can play that way already.

I completely disagree. Having the option to trade would make the parent league substantially easier, even if the drop rates were increased in SFL.

Again, the option to trade is not an option, if they already play strictly self found. The game would be made easier if drop rates were hiked up.

This is actually the reasoning Qarl already posted earlier. So please stop bringing up the merits of hiking rates due to losing trade, when SF'ers don't trade in the first place.

Have your argument be based on something substantial, like having it be more of a challenge by actually increasing pack density in a self found 4 month league thus you get more drops and it stays harder than the parent league.

edit:
"Game Modes
Leagues are able to apply a different set of game rules to their players. For example, increased monster difficulty, world PvP, permadeath or various "Ironman" rules.

We have many plans for interesting game modifiers that leagues can apply, but one rule is clear – they must only make the game harder. Because characters transfer back to the parent league when a league ends, it is important that the character’s journey to its current status was equivalent or more difficult than gameplay in the parent league.

Paid Leagues
In addition, we plan to allow guilds or groups of players to pay for the creation of their own league with a choice of game rule modifiers. Only players invited by the people who paid for the league can create characters in these private leagues. This option helps cater towards any groups of players who want to play online together but don’t want their playgroup to have access to items traded from external players."

Follow these rules when advocating another league and you might have a chance of it actually being done.

Hi

Thank You, Qarl: Interesting points I really like seeing more dev thought on this subject Chris' post on the suggestions SFL thread is cryptic. This illumination into the inner workings is great but SFL should/could be considered as players wanting more of a descent-like experience.The idea that this would only be possible as a paid league is quite odd to me.

I agree SFL would definitely exhibit balance issues quicker then any other league but wouldn't that be helpful in properly setting the difficulty curve for solo players and how it scales with the addition of parties? I have never had a issue with 4links before but do note that I haven't ever had a 6link or over 4 exalts yet and been playing since closed beta so the issue of crafting/orb drop rates could use a good inspection, but I am sure that a lot of balancing issues are already well known it is probably more a matter of what is more pertinent.

The Idea of SFL -to me- has always been of a Non-Competitive/no ladder nature, the idea of such a thing never crossed my mind till I read this SFL post. I just want to play the game and think the experience would be more rewarding compared to the present anarchy league that I play in(The league is great but the trading is not). It is true a player could just impose SFL jurisdictions upon themselves but having such restrictions imposed on me--due to the over inflated economy that no matter how much mf any AVERAGE character could equip would be incapable of grinding enough to keep ahead of the continual inflation-- is horribly disconcerting.Also melee characters can never be capable of maintaining enough survivability whilst having enough mf to be viable. Casters and ranged characters still have a superiority over melee when it comes to mf.SFL is the experience not the grind of items/orbs for buying since crafting isn't possible with present drops(no augmentation of mf stat via mf items).

As I write daily on the suggestions SFL thread what I suggest the main points of SFL be:
1) No trades with other players.2)No mf rolls on blue or yellow items(unqiues with mf,iir/iiq support gems are world drops).3) No loot allocation timer(what drops for you, drops for you, parties do not receive better drops).4)Increased orb drop rate NOT items.

Perhaps SFL would be a great 4 month league that when it ends all your stuff is gone as well? Either way why not try such a ''tournament'' out? Not all leagues have to be competitive? I have attempted the races before but quickly found them boring. I am more interested in exploring and feeling rewarded for my exploration not for being first place in a race.

+1 Wittgenstein

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Glad to have a dev response on this topic. To me, the reason I want a self-found league or a league balanced around solo play, is because we currently have a system the incentivizes group play - for no reason at all. This isn't an MMO so why do groups get advantages? Why are there more mobs which allows for more kills/more loot etc? Could have more mobs but less xp and drops in line with solo play right?

I then read people saying that those who DON'T want to team but want incentives of their own are "crying" or "asking for handouts" - as if joining a group while the top dps members slaughter everything for you isn't a handout itself. It just doesn't make sense to me. If PoE is a game designed to be played solo - then make it that way, and if it isn't, don't claim that it is.

I still don't get the idea behind the increased drops for group players as opposed to solo...

There is no competition but what the nature of Wraeclast puts before you be it a wayward exile, a monster that's hungry or a treasure box in need of perusement, that is SFL to me.

+1 SFL

cheers

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Jackel6672 wrote:

Again, the option to trade is not an option, if they already play strictly self found. The game would be made easier if drop rates were hiked up.

The crux of the argument is whether trade make the game easier than self-found and the simple fact is, it does.

i'm just starting out...so i guess i'll be playing self found for a while hehe. interesting idea tho. i could play self-found only if there was a league dedicated to it. would prob make pvping alot more interesting as you would know your opponents are somewhat on the same level.

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Kellog wrote:

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Jackel6672 wrote:

Again, the option to trade is not an option, if they already play strictly self found. The game would be made easier if drop rates were hiked up.

The crux of the argument is whether trade make the game easier than self-found and the simple fact is, it does.

A self found player does not trade. They purposely make their game experience harder. They will not make a league that is easier than its parent league. It really is this simple.

Also, thanks for glossing over the rest of my post. Advocate a proper league where self found is truly harder than its parent, or stop trying. I propose increasing monster density, since it achieves teh same effect but keeps the game harder.

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tobes111 wrote:

how much of an increased drop rate we talking about.?

If it were me answering that question I'd have to ask GGG. I'd think of it something like this.

At what level did you expect 4 links to happen?
Good, now make sure the requisite number of fusings, chromes, jewelers, and any other required orbs are available by that time in a reasonably low-variance way.

At what level did you expect 5 links to happen?
Same thought process.

Honestly I'd just like to know if GGG thinks level 70 is a reasonable place to get a 4 link. It's worth noting here that "getting" implies "getting a usable one for your character" not "getting some random 4 link white/blue/yellow trash off the ground".

Despite what all the L2PNoob folks like to think, I just want the game to run properly (as defined by GGG) for people who don't find random internet personalities all that appealing. Once GGG gave me those definitions I could decide simply and easily if this game fit my play style needs. The only reason I favor a self-found league is that I see no way to balance the two play styles. If GGG can make that balancing act happen then I'm content.

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A self found player does not trade. They purposely make their game experience harder. They will not make a league that is easier than its parent league. It really is this simple.

You got yourself in quite a pickle there, care to elaborate?

Enforcing rules on yourself to make the game experience harder = will indeed make the game experience harder

Using current group/trade/dedicated mf character will indeed make the game easyer compared to the former.