Looting -- The official thread for discussing the loot system. Updated 18th March, 2013.

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Xaxyx wrote:

I've been a developer for years. I wouldn't trust these guys with a copy of Notepad.exe. Next thing I know, I'd end up with a "cut-throat" environment where the first guy to run Notepad gets to use it, and everybody else has to just watch in awe.

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Xaxyx wrote:

There are plenty of games of this genre that do not encourage colossal jackassery.

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Xaxyx wrote:

I just emailed Chris, offering him ten thousand US dollars for an option to disable FFA in games, or a separate league in which FFA is disabled.

Please stop. I can't breathe.

Lol @ equating someone picking up an item to "bullying". We better get some adult supervision in here quick!

Love these people who seem to think the devs' vision for their game is completely irrelevant. This game has only gotten worse and worse, after all. Oh wait...

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Aixius wrote:

Lol @ equating someone picking up an item to "bullying". We better get some adult supervision in here quick!

I would give my left kidney to walk into the room at the precise moment that some public scumbag scoops up a Mirror that had your name on it, while you're careening toward it between monsters, only to reach it juuuuust after the timer expires. Then we'd see how you felt about bullying.

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Love these people who seem to think the devs' vision for their game is completely irrelevant. This game has only gotten worse and worse, after all. Oh wait...

Love those people who don't bother to read the thread before posting. We've been quoting the devs directly, expressly analyzing their vision therein, for pages now.

Here's what I would say should I ever lose a mirror.

Bastard lol.

And then we would keep playing. All fun and games.

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SL4Y3R wrote:

Here's what I would say should I ever lose a mirror.

Bastard lol.

And then we would keep playing. All fun and games.

Tee hee! Such giggling delight! And what about the other times, Slayer? What about when you scoop up someone else's prize? What about when you're the "bastard"? That's REALLY fun, right? Gives you that electric thrill down your spine? Makes your naughty bits tingle? Boy, you sure pulled a fast one on that pathetic noob! What a sucker! What a loser! *high-5*

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Xaxyx wrote:

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SL4Y3R wrote:

Here's what I would say should I ever lose a mirror.

Bastard lol.

And then we would keep playing. All fun and games.

Tee hee! Such giggling delight! And what about the other times, Slayer? What about when you scoop up someone else's prize? What about when you're the "bastard"? That's REALLY fun, right? Gives you that electric thrill down your spine? Makes your naughty bits tingle? Boy, you sure pulled a fast one on that pathetic noob! What a sucker! What a loser! *high-5*

high five mang! that will teach thoes noobs. thats exactly what we think.

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Xaxyx wrote:

But when I read about this game -- its features, its design intent, its sales model -- a spark of excitement was rekindled. When I logged in for the first time, I dared once again taste hope. And when I played, for most of the weekend, I felt vindication, fulfillment. At last; I've come home. A fun experience throughout. A rich and vibrant skill system -- two systems in fact, interwoven. And best of all, developers who GET IT. They interact with their own player base. They take pride in their creation. They care.

(from a thank-you thread posted several months ago)

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Xaxyx wrote:

Then, at the last, it struck me, like ice water to the face. The devs don't need to make any such assumption at all. The *devs themselves* want that system. The devs prefer that system. The devs possess the driving need to play in their own game in a fashion that allows them to be colossal jackasses to their own player base. That's been their goal all along: to entice new players to their game, just so that the devs, and their like-minded, loyal player base, have somebody to pick on, to inflict pain upon, to abuse.

Consider for a moment, that you just might be wrong. Most of the top ladder player, so many of these gold and diamond supporters are they all just bullies endorsing this FFA loot system? They and their ilk must be sadistic freaks like Chris and the rest of the GGG gang!

Does that even make sense?

CJS

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EgypZee wrote:

(from a thank-you thread posted several months ago)

Hey, you found my year-old, fanboy, thank-you thread! I was going to repost that today and tear my own clueless newbie former self a new one. Thanks for the time saver!

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Consider for a moment, that you just might be wrong. Most of the top ladder player, so many of these gold and diamond supporters are they all just bullies endorsing this FFA loot system? They and their ilk must be sadistic freaks like Chris and the rest of the GGG gang!

Does that even make sense?

Not even a little. Of course, that isn't even remotely similar to my argument. But hey, what's a little strawman among friends?

The irony is this: the devs DO care about their game. And they DO interact with their playerbase. The stunningly ignorant assumption I made -- and I now berate myself daily for this grievous error -- was assuming any connection between the two. At the end of the day, they could give exactly zero what their players think. They have a vision for their game, and by all the dark gods, they're going to stick to that plan, come hell or high water.

Even that I could tolerate. Devotion to a cause is of course not necessarily in and upon itself a terrible sin, even considering the implicit blindness of following a course without permitting any outside influence or intervention. But the cause to which the devs have devoted themselves is to purposefully craft an environment where players can abuse and bully each other. Indeed they are REWARDED for this prickish behavior. And I feel bile rise in my throat at the thought of it. Not just for their sadistic, freakish desires -- to quote you -- but that I was stupid enough not to see the pattern.

Rest assured, scarred as I have been, it won't happen again.

Here's another thought for your consideration, would-be defenders of tense, cut-throat douchebaggery. First, I'll arbitrarily invent wholly nonsensical categories, and just as arbitrarily lump large groups of people into these categories:

Let GREENS be players who prefer an environment of fairly distributed loot, wherein the system itself allocates said loot, thus preventing any sort of intra-party drama and struggle over loot allocation.

Let REDS be players who receive a deep, vast, nipple-tingling thrill at the idea of players in a "party" all fawning and clawing over every single piece of gear that hits the ground in a carnivorous fray of greed and drool.

Let's also arbitrarily posit that all GREEN players of this game are disgusted at the idea of ever finding themselves in a party with a RED. Thus, all GREENS can and will simply play solo games to avoid any such circumstance.

However, GREENS would in fact adventure in groups if they could be guaranteed that they would never find themselves in a RED situation -- such as allowing them the option of creating GREEN-ruleset games, or creating and/or joining a GREEN-ruleset league.

Given all of this arbitrariness, I posit a question to you, you fine, upstanding REDS of PoE:

WHAT in the HELL would you CARE?! How would YOUR play experience be detracted in the slightest if we GREENS could all scurry off and hide in our own, GREEN-only games, as opposed to what we do now, which is to scurry off and hide in our own, solo games?

The people that are saying only FFA should be in the game should go and install and play through D2 again on bnet right now.

The exact same problems FFA causes for D2 will be in POE.

The first one being that you are stuck in specific builds/classes if you actually want to get loot. For D2 your first character is pretty much mandatory to be a Sorc (Due to high mobility from teleport) if you actually want to get items in any timely manner. I feel that it will be similar in POE where if you want to play public games and competitively get loot you are required to have a high mobility and durable build.

The second thing is bots, namely pick-it bots. If you really think 18 people http://www.grindinggear.com/?page=staff (Who most only have Bachelors and half of them are artists and other misc positions) can come up with some sophisticated anti-bot code you are delusional. The current loot system encourages using scripts/bots to parse and grab loot from other players. Something as simple as having loot options other then FFA would put a complete halt to pick-it bots in public games. Sure this doesn't stop all botting, but it would stop the ones that are more damaging to the game (the ones in public games).

If you need any proof of these problems, again just log onto D2 bnet and join a public game, 99% of them are going to be bots or people using pick-it.

Ill just add my thoughts here:

Why i almost never join public parties:

Biggest reason:
FFA looting, i dont want *my loot* getting stolen by some bully/jerk Pubparty *team member*.
Last time i checked, *Team member* = helps me.
Interesting concept right?
I mean its not like i wanted that mirror of kalandra... nah clearly the best looting is a mad dash through enemies as a caster/ranger to *try* to reach it before the other *team members*...

I really dont get how instanced looting is bad.
Its even possible to have a FFA leagues and IL (Instanced Loot) Leagues.
Or party "Loot options".

Or make it so that items that are locked to another char upon drop can be seen by other party members but not picked up at all, forever.