This is pure quality for life! Trading as it should be! (ingame Screenshots inside!)

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AceNightfire wrote:

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Brigs wrote:

"Trade Channel 27 for coral rings"

This would be a plain stupid trade system. This way, you can ONLY see coral rings and nothing else. With my system, you can only see stuff you're really interested in. 99% of all items get filtered out and as soon as something is posted on the tradechat, you know that you want to take a look at it. That results in NO spam for ya. So EVERY post you see, is something you WANT to see (with the right adjustments).

And btw.: Even with a timer, it can happen that 5 people directly post after your post in trade chat. Then your post would be gone for good, no one would have seen it and you have to wait a complete minute to do the next post... And as soon as you change the map, all your item-links are ruined. So you have to wait the minute in the city. Pretty boring standing around and doing nothing...

So scroll up if you really want to.

And maybe my idea isn't stupid. Perhaps your idea which you spent hours compiling is stupid. Allowing players to easily filter through previous messages may be quality of life, but it is also this very quality that makes auction houses so effective.

There is a lot to be said about the benefits of forcing players to read through trade chat to find the items they seek.

I believe your approach to making trade chat less cumbersome is too extreme. And please refrain from calling the ideas of others stupid if you don't wish the same for yours. Open your mind and expand on the ideas of others instead of labeling them as stupid and thinking no further.

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Brigs wrote:

but it is also this very quality that makes auction houses so effective.

You and some others may cry as much as you want about auction houses... It won't ever happen. GGG said it and that's it. Why keep going on with that topic? It's not that GGG just don't want an auction house, they have also good reasons to do so. Auction houses ruined many economies already if you look at MMORPGs. Guild Wars 2 for example: I played it 2 weeks since beginning and people underpriced each other. In the end, the items were NOTHING worth anymore.

So the community has 3 options:

- Keep complaing about the tradechat and cry for an auction house (which will not happen)
- Keep complaing about the tradechat and try to search for something else besides auction house (GGG might consider those ideas at least)
- Try to get used with the current tradechat system

Well, option 1 is wasted time, option 3 doesn't solve the problem that the current trade-chat system is aweful. So only option 2 stays and that's what I'm trying to do here. If you have a better idea then mine (besides an auction house), then post it. I support it as long as you put some thoughts in it.

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AceNightfire wrote:

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Brigs wrote:

but it is also this very quality that makes auction houses so effective.

You and some others may cry as much as you want about auction houses... It won't ever happen. GGG said it and that's it. Why keep going on with that topic? It's not that GGG just don't want an auction house, they have also good reasons to do so. Auction houses ruined many economies already if you look at MMORPGs. Guild Wars 2 for example: I played it 2 weeks since beginning and people underpriced each other. In the end, the items were NOTHING worth anymore.

So the community has 3 options:

- Keep complaing about the tradechat and cry for an auction house (which will not happen)
- Keep complaing about the tradechat and try to search for something else besides auction house (GGG might consider those ideas at least)
- Try to get used with the current tradechat system

Well, option 1 is wasted time, option 3 doesn't solve the problem that the current trade-chat system is aweful. So only option 2 stays and that's what I'm trying to do here. If you have a better idea then mine (besides an auction house), then post it. I support it as long as you put some thoughts in it.

You should consider a career in politics. Not only did you misquote me, but you ignore the fact that I brought up an alternative solution than the one you propose: Players can post in trade chat once per minute.

I'm trying to open up discussion on how to best stop spammers from ruling trade WITHOUT using an Auction House. Auction Houses only increase spam, and so too will your filters. As soon as people have the ability to search for exactly what they want, every item under the sun will be on trade chat because why wouldn't you.

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Brigs wrote:

You should consider a career in politics. Not only did you misquote me, but you ignore the fact that I brought up an alternative solution than the one you propose: Players can post in trade chat once per minute.

Rofl... Learn reading posts... I already answered to you about that suggestion. Here, I quote it for you:

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AceNightfire wrote:

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Brigs wrote:

I'm content with one simple change: you may only type in trade chat once per minute.

This does several things:

• Players only post selective items instead of every yellow that drops
• No more triple posts
• Players are incentivized to post once and then get back to actually playing the game

All those fancy filters are nice and well done, but I would rather keep the personal touches to trade chat rather than try to standardize what people type to fit into the filter system.

You won't sell anything if you can only post once per minute. If you post something and directly after your 3-4 people post something too, then your post will be out of the sight from everyone and no ones going to read what you have posted. This is rather frustrating, because it takes enough time to link all the items you want to sell with prices and then you can only post it once...

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Brigs wrote:

I'm trying to open up discussion on how to best stop spammers from ruling trade WITHOUT using an Auction House. Auction Houses only increase spam, and so too will your filters. As soon as people have the ability to search for exactly what they want, every item under the sun will be on trade chat because why wouldn't you.

My system WON't increase spam. Why? If anyone spams his stuff 10 times in a row and someone filters out your stuff, he won't see the 10 posts of your. So even if people spam, you won't see it. Therefore, the tradechat is not cluttered anymore (if you make the right filter adjustments).

With the 1 minute limitation it's frustrating, because once you posted something and 4 people directly post after you, your post is gone for good... And now you have to wait ONE MINUTE to post again... This just sucks, because you have to stand around in the city because if you teleport out, all your item links are broken...

i applaud you for the idea but i think its one step too close to an auction house dynamic...integrating a poe.xyz function into poe isnt the way to go


i think a lot of trade suggestions overlook the fact that inefficiency is just as enjoyable as getting what you want, when you want it.

the reason why diablo 3's trade system failed so hard is because it was TOO efficient and took the joy away from farming...


path of exiles trade system is a chat system and VERY inefficient...but there are many overlooked mechanics...the ability to create arbitrage, there is the hunt, and more socializing (if needed)

....

sure 3rd party websites have sprung up to accommodate trades but they work because its just an option rather than a must.


...

i think a trade system for a game like poe has to be both efficient and inefficient...if that makes any sense.

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eebertay wrote:

i applaud you for the idea but i think its one step too close to an auction house dynamic...integrating a poe.xyz function into poe isnt the way to go

Did you really read the first post...? My suggestion is not even CLOSE to an auction house. In fact, my suggestion keeps the current system, but all it does, is filter things out (or in). Just imagine the current trade-chat and now imagine that you could filter out 99% of the stuff that is posted there. It's not like that 100000 items you want will pop up. It's more likely, that you still have to wait some minutes before the first trade-chat message pops up with an item of your interest. And only a few players will see this item, if they have the same (or close to) filter-adjustments as you. It mkes it much more easier for you to recognize this one item and makes it easier for others to sell stuff. But you still dont know how many of those items are offered in total and still can't look for the cheapest item (like you could with an auction house).

So... Why my system is like an auction house in your opinion? What my suggestion does is make the curent trade-chat-system just way more efficient, without giving up on haggling and socialising with others.

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eebertay wrote:

i applaud you for the idea but i think its one step too close to an auction house dynamic...integrating a poe.xyz function into poe isnt the way to go

Exactly. As soon as people have the ability to search for exactly what they want, every item under the sun will be on trade chat because why wouldn't you. That's when undercutting begins.

I'm not saying the one-minute limitation is the ultimate solution to clearing up spam, but it's a good start.

"

Brigs wrote:

"

eebertay wrote:

i applaud you for the idea but i think its one step too close to an auction house dynamic...integrating a poe.xyz function into poe isnt the way to go

Exactly. As soon as people have the ability to search for exactly what they want, every item under the sun will be on trade chat because why wouldn't you. That's when undercutting begins.

And this is untrue.

What you do here right now is thinking, that once you start filtering, that your trade-chat will only be full of items of your interest. But in fact, most of the time you have to wait many minutes until the first item of interest pops up in the trade-chat when you use the filter-system accuratly. The more detailed your filter is, the less likely an interesting item will pop out.

Furthermore, other people don't know if their item is filtered in or out. Also they don't know if someone else posted a similiar item like they did and so they can't underprice each other. And even IF there is a second item with the same stats, why should those 2 people underprice each other? It's not like 10,000 other sellers are there with a similiar item. So there is no reason to underprice...


What my suggestion does:

- less spam (because all uninteresting items are filtered out)
- you can keep effectively an eye on the trade-chat while fighting (becuse only items of interest can be seen)
- faster rate of selling/buying stuff, because others can see your WTS/WTB posts as well when fighting

What my suggestion does NOT:

- Give you a list of all items ingame available for sale
- It won't make the deals for you (you still have to haggle)
- It won't give you fixed prices (like shops/auction houses would do)
- There won't be more items on sale (like in an auction house or shops). In fact, the amount of available items will be the same as now.

Example of undercutting in a filtration system:

"

Brigs wrote:

Example of undercutting in a filtration system:

Spoiler

Time: 00:00:00(hh:mm:ss)
eebertay is looking to buy a 5-link armor chest with Life and 2 resistances. He decides to leave trade chat open and afk so he can later filter through all the postings to find what he needs.

Time: 00:05:29
Brigs posts a 5L armor with 75 life 26 fire res and 14 cold res.

Time: 00:47:34
AceNightfire posts a 5L armor with 82 life 19 cold res and 16 fire res.

Time: 01:03:14
eebertay returns from being afk and filters through results and finds the above items.

Time: 01:03:37
eebertay whispers AceNightfire, "How much for the 5L?"

Time: 01:03:42
eebertay whispers Brigs, "How much for the 5L?"

Time: 01:04:06
Brigs responds to eebertay, "2 ex"

Time: 01:04:09
AceNightfire whispers eebertay, "3 ex"

Time: 01:04:26
eebertay purchases 5L chest from Brigs.

**AceNightfire goes on attempting to sell his chest for 3 ex and cannot find a buyer because it is much easier for players to find similar items for less.

Time: 22:15:46
AceNightfire lowers his expectations to 2 ex. But now there are several other 5L chests being sold for 2 ex and one being sold for 1.5 ex.

**Repeat this scenario now with 1.5 ex as the bargain price.

There is a failure in your logic: Do you really think, that there will be only ONE interested guy? Because of the filter, many people besides eebertay can see the 2 5L chests. So more people then before will ask for a price. If there are 4 people interested in the 2 5L slots, underpricing will be impossible because if Person A is not willing to pay 3ex, he can go and buy the 2ex 5L chest. But then there are 3 people left and only 1 5L chest. So if Person B doesn't want to pay 3exalts, person C or D may be willing to pay. And if not, you are not forced to sell your item for less then 3exalts. Just try on another day at a different time and you might find a buyer. It's highly unlikely that there will be always many 5L Chests available when you offer yours.

Also, how likely is it that 2 5L chests with nearly the same stats will be posted in just 5 minutes? And you forget, that going afk is very dangerous, because the item might be already sold if you don't try to buy it directly after it was posted. And if I have sold my 5L for 3ex, then only 1 chests is available, so underpricing will not be possible in this situation too...