Lightning Thorns

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Duskbane wrote:

As the melee who have commented in this thread post-change have said, they claim that it's fixed for them because LT was reduced in damage when it was changed to affect all hits. The problem is that barring multistrike or cyclone, melee generally doesn't hit more than a couple times with one attack. In addition, melee also has to have the LT'd target in clear sight to be able to hit it. Ranged works differently in those regards. Melee also usually had more HP as a result of having to be directly in the line of fire to attack.

Basically, it's fixed for melee, but now it's broken for ranged.

The thing with LT is it punishes high attack speed for melees too, even if now its a bit easier for these builds, so as you said if you use multistrike and GS/cleave/sweep/LS, well youre gonna have a bad time..

The only way to combat this until or if they nerf it for ranged is to use what i used as a melee, summon skeles, conversion traps, single target the mages then wait for the thorns to die out.. basically you have to rethink a lot of tactics cause now if you GMP/LMP+chain a split arrow/LA youre probably going to 1shot yourself on a mob so you also have to start being very very careful at whats going on, you also need a lot of Seething flasks so if you do accidentaly shoot at LT mobs you can have a chance to survive.... hope that helps

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Drahken wrote:

lol.. people debating the game and you call them knobheads.

listen we have been on this forum for the same amount of time, I have 200 something posts you have 2000. I dont need you crying about other people sharing their opinions on the mechanics of the game.

knobber

And now, you, ex-fucking-cuse me, you started calling everyone in this thread nimwits and throwing around random insults like a angry teenager after they calmly told you that your assumptions were wrong.. and you're telling me im interrupting YOUR debating?

Maybe try to not act like such a smartass, be humble and know when to acknowledge when you are wrong.

"

Dragon585 wrote:

"

As the melee who have commented in this thread post-change have said, they claim that it's fixed for them because LT was reduced in damage when it was changed to affect all hits. The problem is that barring multistrike or cyclone, melee generally doesn't hit more than a couple times with one attack. In addition, melee also has to have the LT'd target in clear sight to be able to hit it. Ranged works differently in those regards. Melee also usually had more HP as a result of having to be directly in the line of fire to attack.

Basically, it's fixed for melee, but now it's broken for ranged.

It is SO not fixed for melee...
Splash anyone?

Whoops, left out splash in that list of things.

Well, at least you can somewhat control splash and not attack a group that is all absolutely covered with LT with a splash-hooked attack. But it would hurt all the same if you did.

Well, with the recent nerf to lightning thorns it became manageable IF you don't use fast-hitting area skills, especially one-that-will-not-be-named which most brokenly (must be a new word) does a gazzilion of hits per second, stacks shocks like mad, and can obliterate entire packs as fast as you can say pew-pew.

As I wrote a couple of pages ago, and it was probably in nobody's interest to notice, my incinerate-using caster mara would kill himself almost instantly on even one shielded enemy. However, he has other skills at his disposal and after switching his main to fireball I kept levelled as backup there were no more problems whatsoever, be like water, my pupil and you shall pass.

And, there is an easy fix for all your lightning arrow troubles, remove offscreen damage and make LA activate its aoe only on last hit in chain. It's that simple. And it would be true skill balancing, not ridiculous 10% less damage they implemented.

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VictorDoom wrote:

And now, you, ex-fucking-cuse me, you started calling everyone in this thread nimwits and throwing around random insults like a angry teenager after they calmly told you that your assumptions were wrong.. and you're telling me im interrupting YOUR debating?

Maybe try to not act like such a smartass, be humble and know when to acknowledge when you are wrong.

actually.. go re-read the chain of posts goofy. I was insulted first by anyone I insulted.

owned.

cute how you call me wrong and assuming too lol. I have an LA and everything I said was spot on and zero of my points were even attempted to be refuted, let alone refuted.

I would be very interested to know how many of these tactics ppl are posting would be effective vs promenade boss. I changed my tactics around drastically for that boss, and it is still 50/50 death. Rare/elite packs with LT are, in fact, manageable with changes but that effing boss is just silly.

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raics wrote:

Well, with the recent nerf to lightning thorns it became manageable IF you don't use fast-hitting area skills, especially one-that-will-not-be-named which most brokenly (must be a new word) does a gazzilion of hits per second, stacks shocks like mad, and can obliterate entire packs as fast as you can say pew-pew.

As I wrote a couple of pages ago, and it was probably in nobody's interest to notice, my incinerate-using caster mara would kill himself almost instantly on even one shielded enemy. However, he has other skills at his disposal and after switching his main to fireball I kept levelled as backup there were no more problems whatsoever, be like water, my pupil and you shall pass.

And, there is an easy fix for all your lightning arrow troubles, remove offscreen damage and make LA activate its aoe only on last hit in chain. It's that simple. And it would be true skill balancing, not ridiculous 10% less damage they implemented.

I read the incinerate post you made, and yea, that is quite ridiculous, the only suggestion i can think of for you is to have a Flame totem somehwere for when those mobs pop up, cause 1 LT mob+incinerate=your death.. as well as use conversion traps etc. but yeah try to see if flame totem helps, summon some skeles so you have something to tank for you

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Drahken wrote:

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VictorDoom wrote:

And now, you, ex-fucking-cuse me, you started calling everyone in this thread nimwits and throwing around random insults like a angry teenager after they calmly told you that your assumptions were wrong.. and you're telling me im interrupting YOUR debating?

Maybe try to not act like such a smartass, be humble and know when to acknowledge when you are wrong.

actually.. go re-read the chain of posts goofy. I was insulted first by anyone I insulted.

owned.

cute how you call me wrong and assuming too lol. I have an LA and everything I said was spot on and zero of my points were even attempted to be refuted, let alone refuted.

maybe people wouldnt have insulted you if you acted a bit less like a smartass, ever thought that it might be because of your attitude? If you dont have anything useful to provide to teh discussion just fuck off. Saves everyone quite a lot of bother.

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Dragon585 wrote:

I would be very interested to know how many of these tactics ppl are posting would be effective vs promenade boss. I changed my tactics around drastically for that boss, and it is still 50/50 death. Rare/elite packs with LT are, in fact, manageable with changes but that effing boss is just silly.

Get 2 conversion trap gems, convert everything around it, smash the bosses with your army of converted monsters, summon some skeles too maybe a zombie.. any char can use any skill, these ones help me a lot against LT

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VictorDoom wrote:

maybe people wouldnt have insulted you if you acted a bit less like a smartass, ever thought that it might be because of your attitude? If you dont have anything useful to provide to teh discussion just fuck off. Saves everyone quite a lot of bother.

actually I was debating the mechanics, you stepped in like you were billy badass and threw yourself into the conversation and proved to be wrong, and knobberish.

you were wrong about me insulting people first.. so you changed it to my attitude.. apparently me disagreeing with you or anyone else is attitude. its rather funny that you mention attitude tho.. read any of your posts.

infact you threw yourself into the conversation with a "owned".

I understand you have about 200 posters worth of posts on here.. and you get butt hurt if a conversation is going on without you.. but you must be extremely ignorant because your "advice" and "insults" describe you to a T.


As far as countering LT with a ranged character whos main skill is LA.. its already been said a dozen times.. use Poison Arrow.

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VictorDoom wrote:

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raics wrote:

As I wrote a couple of pages ago, and it was probably in nobody's interest to notice, my incinerate-using caster mara would kill himself almost instantly on even one shielded enemy. However, he has other skills at his disposal and after switching his main to fireball I kept levelled as backup there were no more problems whatsoever, be like water, my pupil and you shall pass.

And, there is an easy fix for all your lightning arrow troubles, remove offscreen damage and make LA activate its aoe only on last hit in chain. It's that simple. And it would be true skill balancing, not ridiculous 10% less damage they implemented.

I read the incinerate post you made, and yea, that is quite ridiculous, the only suggestion i can think of for you is to have a Flame totem somehwere for when those mobs pop up, cause 1 LT mob+incinerate=your death.. as well as use conversion traps etc. but yeah try to see if flame totem helps, summon some skeles so you have something to tank for you

Well, the whole point of the post was that thorns ended up as a non-issue because of large skill selection, fire trap and molten shield (not 100% certain about that one) don't trigger LT, flame totem kills itself and fireball doesn't do enough hits to off you even with LMP on.

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raics wrote:

"

VictorDoom wrote:

"

raics wrote:

As I wrote a couple of pages ago, and it was probably in nobody's interest to notice, my incinerate-using caster mara would kill himself almost instantly on even one shielded enemy. However, he has other skills at his disposal and after switching his main to fireball I kept levelled as backup there were no more problems whatsoever, be like water, my pupil and you shall pass.

And, there is an easy fix for all your lightning arrow troubles, remove offscreen damage and make LA activate its aoe only on last hit in chain. It's that simple. And it would be true skill balancing, not ridiculous 10% less damage they implemented.

I read the incinerate post you made, and yea, that is quite ridiculous, the only suggestion i can think of for you is to have a Flame totem somehwere for when those mobs pop up, cause 1 LT mob+incinerate=your death.. as well as use conversion traps etc. but yeah try to see if flame totem helps, summon some skeles so you have something to tank for you

Well, the whole point of the post was that thorns ended up as a non-issue because of large skill selection, fire trap and molten shield (not 100% certain about that one) don't trigger LT, flame totem kills itself and fireball doesn't do enough hits to off you even with LMP on.

Well traps should pretty much help you there then with a flame totem(assuming it doesnt commit suicide in 0.5seconds) critting with traps like fire trap provides a pretty sweet AoE damage, maybe try to frostwall the enemies etc.

It basically looks like LT will make every char need a counter for that specific type of mobs.. quite annoying, but there is the possibility that its their intention

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victordoom wrote:

Get 2 conversion trap gems, convert everything around it, smash the bosses with your army of converted monsters, summon some skeles too maybe a zombie.. any char can use any skill, these ones help me a lot against LT

In this extreme case it would actually just be 100% easier to skip the boss entirely. I already have 6 MUCH needed gems on weapon swap, I cannot add more. And none of them are the ones you mentioned. I should also point out that my build is very str focused and most of those skills req alot of int to be of use, unless you link skellies to a totem in which case SKELLY BROTEM FTW!

While your advice is very usable, its just not practical for my build. For now, I choose to stay away from that boss entirely. And I think that is exactly the type of mechanic GGG should try to stay away from.