XP penalty and likely 1 portal is NOT going anywhere

Keep the XP loss but make it 2-3 portals instead of 6. Dying still matters, but you get 1-2 more chances against whatever just one-tapped you.

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joelbrundlefly#3800 wrote:

Keep the XP loss but make it 2-3 portals instead of 6. Dying still matters, but you get 1-2 more chances against whatever just one-tapped you.

yeah a chance to die again to the exact same thing lose twice the xp and come vent here and rage at how bad xp loss is :D

I'm going to chip in with somethin that oddly enough I'm almost never seeing.

Could be wrong but it is my conviction that poe 2 is over punishing because the game has relatively little content at the moment and setting players back harshly is a way to prevent them from punching through all the content and getting bored in less than 3 weeks.
I am convinced that when the game gets more content, it will scale difficulty more linearly and slowly so the basic atlas progression (probably the campain too) will be faster and easier while you'll still have much harder mecanics to interact with at the very late game.

The one thing I hate the most about one death per map is having to (most of the time) redo the map you failed but with zero content on it, especially if it was a bad layout. Makes you want to just grab a tier 1 from Doriyani to get it done faster, feels like a complete waste of time. i wish you could at least skip over to the next map after one is failed.

On the build diversity related to defenses issue, I don't agree with you at all OP. I think making defenses THAT mandatory reduce diversity even more than the alternative (6 portal)
If you want to start grinding T15+ maps you absolutely have to have your defensive set up solid enough that you can confidently NEVER die in maps. Otherwise you're never leveling past 92-93 and you'll consistenty lose out on the juice you worked up on your maps. And that is just not an option.
So everyone will just flock toward the best defenses (clearly ES, or as a second best eva/ES hybrid) everone will use the same buffs and gravitate around the same builds.

I think it would be much healthier for build diversity to hit a middle ground where, yes mistakes and death can be costly but on the other hand you don't get absolutely bashed into the ground repeatedly until you have 40 div worth of gear and now you never ever die.

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Z3RoNightMare#7140 wrote:

So let's [...] agree to disagree.

OH YES, let's agree to disagree... if only you would agree to disagree :

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Z3RoNightMare#7140 wrote:

Arguing these are good game designs is insane and i will not pretend that they're not.

LOL.

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_rt_#4636 wrote:

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PaintMaster#2396 wrote:

<long post>

You wrote all this to prove to me that:

1) Having invested all this in defenses and you still have to avoid some maps because your chances of dying, despite all your investments, are not low in them

2) You just showed me how bad investing in defenses really is

You've probably spent considerable time searching for good gear, having to juggle mods around to max out all your resistances and having invested considerable resources into your character. And you still can't run all the content without worrying of dying. All of this running a tankier character class.

Me? I bought a mid level weapon for 5 exalts and I can run maps faster and more easily than you. I probably clear faster, I have lower chances of dying and I have no mod restrictions on my waystones. I was playing braindead zoom zoom zoom PoE 1 style, by the way, so the game was nowhere near something I'd consider challenging.

Your mistake is thinking my stance on this is because I think PoE is hard, but I don't.
My stance comes from the fact that I am fully aware of how this game feels for casual people that just want to have a good time wanting to play a videogame.

Well, i just wasted time explaining something to a wall.

There's no need for 1 portal. This is a horrible mechanic. It is off-putting and will and is driving away casual players. It's not hardcore. If you want punishing gameplay, go play hardcore. Stop worrying about how other people play.

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Cookie_Puss#5958 wrote:

There's no need for 1 portal. This is a horrible mechanic. It is off-putting and will and is driving away casual players. It's not hardcore. If you want punishing gameplay, go play hardcore. Stop worrying about how other people play.

HC is not about losing one portal on death. HC is complete removal of character from HC league on death. It's not the same ffs. I don't understand why people non-stop compare death penalties with HC.

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PaintMaster#2396 wrote:

Well, i just wasted time explaining something to a wall.

You actually wasted time proving my point right, but you're so far removed from the original post's discussion that you didn't even realize it.

This line proves it:

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PaintMaster#2396 wrote:

On range builds having good aoe clear is also layer of defense since you not letting melee mobs come close.

Read OP's original post. Read bullets 3 to 6 and then re-read what you said yourself.

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PaintMaster#2396 wrote:

Don't you think that if range build can kill everything screenwide, there should be something that can hit you back from range? Or you want range builds to just have screen aoe clear and never die?

And this part proves you're completely detached from how most people have been playing PoE 1 and 2 for the past 8+ years.

What you described is what happens in every league. People put 95% in damage and AoE and they only ever die to damage reflection (also why lots of chaos builds were so strong in PoE 1, since chaos couldn't be reflected and mobs having chaos resist was not common).

OP said removing 1-death-maps would kill build diversity, but 1-death-maps, coupled with cheap deaths, have never pushed players so much into going full-on AoE glass cannon.
And your testimony only proves how much you have to invest in defense to achieve the same result of an extremely cheap investment in DPS that you can do right out of the campaign.

By the way, another thing that forces the players' hands is your skewed idea that "if people can clear their whole screen we should add cheap from-out-of-screen deaths to force them". That's the same stupid GGG mentality of adding cheap band-aids instead of fixing the underlying issues

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Sakanabi#6664 wrote:

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Cookie_Puss#5958 wrote:

There's no need for 1 portal. This is a horrible mechanic. It is off-putting and will and is driving away casual players. It's not hardcore. If you want punishing gameplay, go play hardcore. Stop worrying about how other people play.

HC is not about losing one portal on death. HC is complete removal of character from HC league on death. It's not the same ffs. I don't understand why people non-stop compare death penalties with HC.

yeh it's just so they can say "go play HC" or it's stupidity depends