Game is dropping like a stone

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Toaru_Majutsu_no_Index#1288 wrote:

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Kimsektnan#7571 wrote:

Worst part for me is GGG silence, they released a game in a rough state then took xmas break. Id rather they released this after xmas and worked on fixing the issues.

At this point the frustration is rotting and people would rather just stop playing which is evident in what your saying.

Personally i'm frustrated with the economy the most, the POE1 trade function is attrocious and an ingame / alternative solution should come out.

GGG went silent after saying why they are going to be silent

Doing bad thing because you said you would do bad thing, does not make bad thing less bad.

Pretty basic reasoning there.

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Samsca239#7647 wrote:

Based on Steam achievements what does the POE1 playerbase look like?

Half barely play the game. Only 45% kill Siren.
Only 15% clear the campaign and get into maps.
About 12% clear merciless lab. 8.5% Uber lab.
6% killed Shaper. 3% killed Sirus.

Now maybe this is special pleading but my point is that the bulk of the playerbase are going to be "casual". They may well be coming to the end of their PoE2 play experience. Or will do so in coming weeks. (This is also true for Diablo or any other comparable game).

Just about every POE1 season has seen massive drop off. Unless the EA is to have significant shake up every few weeks why would it be any different?

I guess what I'm saying is that even if you started with millions, you aren't going to have that many people doing high level maps forever.

I will blow your mind here -how about adding many difficulties with added drop rates, making the standard mode accessible for the 90% of people never getting to shaper or sirus?
Or evolve the altas passive to do this at a much larger scale?
Add uber bosses to maven trials at the extreme?
The elite 10+ hours a day POE1 players have no problems spending a week running 100 maps with the same mods to farm.
Most people do not.
So the change doesn't really hurt the end-end game players, but makes the game accessible for a lot more people.

The fact that only 15% of the players clear the campaign isn't a staple of success or some great "pleb filter". It speaks of a game most people dislikes.

The launch of POE2 gave GGG a "clean slate" to reach out to a bigger audience.
Like I said, the 1-3 acts are mostly good after the loot buff.
After that there is bottleneck after bottleneck, where the game is either too slow, too hard, too easy, or have too few rewards.
They locked ascendancies inside a spider cabinet most people hate going into.
Currency is botched, magic find just underlined that twice making the rich richer and the poor perpetually poor.

Yet somehow the hardcore elites that play 100 hours a week are TERRIFIED of anything touching "their game", they can't even stand the idea that other people should get a game mode that makes it enjoyable to them, because they want bragging rights about completing a game nobody else bothers touching.
.....you aren't a hero for holding your hand over the bonfire a minute longer than the rest. It just gets you a burnt hand.

Feedback points aside, I think many are valid.

You said this is “not normal”. I think I hard disagree with you - Can you name another recent game (last 4 years?) on steam that launched with >200k players and steadily grew/didn’t shrink at all for 2+ months?

From a purely data driven perspective I think PoE’s curve can basically be empirically proven out as normal, despite that not fitting into your own mental narrative.

The data is all publicly available and there for us all to see, so I’like happily be proven wrong if anyone can find some games that meet the criteria I called out above though. I did a few quick searches and everything looked like PoE’s curve.

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damir21#1543 wrote:

what are you all talking about , that is how games work since games existed.

game comes out , a lot of people come in coz of the hype after a few months only fanboys are left . this is normal this is how it works.

there are stand out cases like fortnite and league of legends and some others .
but those are well you know what they are .
do you want that for poe? just so it can have massive numbers ?

only thing i agree with , the game is not in the state where you can call it a job well done and go on a holiday .

This is a "what about them thought" fallacy.
It doesn't matter that other games did poorly and had drop offs.
It doesn't make the drop off less of a problem.

If you by a supermarket, have 600.000 costumers the first week, and then the next week you have 400.000, you wouldn't even bother asking questions?

Gamers have no clue about business usually.
"POE1 only has about 100k players in every given league, so it's fine that POE2 drop to that".
No, it's not fine. When you have almost 600k players and then lose 150k of them in a week, that is a disaster. That other games had similar disasters doesn't make it less of a disaster.

Don't think for a second none of those 150k player's couldn't have been kept around with a few quick changes. I'd beet 50k of them with changes to ascendancies, drops and endgame access alone, at least. Maybe more.

Instead GGG went on holiday with the bonus they god from early access sales.
It's bad business, a horrible strategy, and incredibly disrespectful to a player base that spend money on it, and have been loyal fans for 10 years and made the studio what it is today.

Maybe you didn't realize but it's christmas time....not everyone is a no lifer like u, most of us spend the holidays with family and friends instead of playing POE2. ^^

And show me 1 game pls that didn't drop in playerbase....You cry here for nothing.

Game is amazing and the difficulty perfect, you're simply to weak and want to "finisih" all content within 1 week with crappy gear.

Go play Diablo 4 if you want a game with 0 challange and appalud yourself while 1 hitting all content without taking any damage. ;)

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eldheim#2436 wrote:

Instead GGG went on holiday with the bonus they god from early access sales.
It's bad business, a horrible strategy, and incredibly disrespectful to a player base that spend money on it, and have been loyal fans for 10 years and made the studio what it is today.

WTF...aren't they allowed to spend holidays with family and friends only because the game isn't 100% to your satisfaaction?...Esp in a Beta?

They've even put out a big patch before they went in theyr well deserved holidays...give the devs time to breathe man, the world doesn't just revolve around you.

Don't get me wrong, but you're the only disrespectful person in this room....merry christmas, go out and touch some pinetrees kid. ;)

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pattw555#0071 wrote:

Feedback points aside, I think many are valid.

You said this is “not normal”. I think I hard disagree with you - Can you name another recent game (last 4 years?) on steam that launched with >200k players and steadily grew/didn’t shrink at all for 2+ months?

From a purely data driven perspective I think PoE’s curve can basically be empirically proven out as normal, despite that not fitting into your own mental narrative.

The data is all publicly available and there for us all to see, so I’like happily be proven wrong if anyone can find some games that meet the criteria I called out above though. I did a few quick searches and everything looked like PoE’s curve.

POE2 has been out 2 weeks.
Not 2 months.

And "shrink or grew". Well, there is a hell of a difference.
Good games get good reviews and player feedback, and it gets more people into the game.
Elden ring ROSE with 100k players over the first month across platforms.
POE2 lost 150k players in two weeks.

Everything looks like POE's curve if the time is long enough.
For single player campaign style games with no concurring endgame.

POE2 claimed 40+ hours of campaign for the average players, alongside 200+ endgame hours. This is GGG's stated metrics.
If the average player plays for two hours a day, that is 20 days -three weeks for campaign, and a couple of months in endgame at least.
Double that, and most players should still be in new game content for at least 60 days.
For the super nerds, 8 hours a day plus players, it should give them a full month still.
So if the drop off is across all players, the drop off metric is insanely premature.
I'd like to add that there are a bunch of classes and 12 ascendancies, replicability is enormous. Which it is not for the majority of the games you compared them too.

They're on holiday and the playerbase needs time to catch up to the rest of us who've been saying Endgame has some serious problems so they can give feedback too. Too soon to say the game is doomed.

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Moerlin#4140 wrote:

They're on holiday and the playerbase needs time to catch up to the rest of us who've been saying Endgame has some serious problems so they can give feedback too. Too soon to say the game is doomed.

Oh I can't wait for a big chunk of the playerbase to get to maps and see the endgame. It's gonna be more entertaining to watch than new years fireworks.

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CroDanZ#1818 wrote:

Maybe you didn't realize but it's christmas time....not everyone is a no lifer like u, most of us spend the holidays with family and friends instead of playing POE2. ^^

And show me 1 game pls that didn't drop in playerbase....You cry here for nothing.

Game is amazing and the difficulty perfect, you're simply to weak and want to "finisih" all content within 1 week with crappy gear.

Go play Diablo 4 if you want a game with 0 challange and appalud yourself while 1 hitting all content without taking any damage. ;)

Calling people a "no lifer" if they are alone and have nobody to be with with over xmas is about as evil as you can get.

You should be deeply ashamed of such statements, and think about what they can do to a lonely person. There are many of them, and they do not deserve this.

Maybe you didn't realize but my metrics was for the first two weeks, didn't include Christmas AT ALL.

Also, you clearly are clueless about metrics, stats and trajectories.
Times matter. The drop off coming after 2 weeks is a world of difference from the drop after 2 months.
That means one of the games has players completing the content, the other one people are leaving because it is not enjoyable.
Guess which category POE2 falls into?

How about YOU go play POE1 ruthless mode? You have no more right to dictate what I find fun and engaging than I do you.

You should contemplate how you engage with others, and how you behave. Shameful, disgusting stuff.

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eldheim#2436 wrote:

Yeah. Check steam charts.

For those that does not understand player count and ratings, its both going down, fast.

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eldheim#2436 wrote:

Maybe you didn't realize but my metrics was for the first two weeks, didn't include Christmas AT ALL.

I checked :



Your case is dismissed .