freaking lab leaking into the game under the guise of boss rework!

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morbo wrote:

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e1337donkey wrote:

You guys complaining about the lab don't even know why the lab sucks to begin with. The lab has these trap gauntlets that have you duck and weave through them. You don't engage them with your skill gems,...

-> Leap slam, WB, L.Warp, Blink arrow

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...you don't build for them with your passive skill tree...

-> Life regen, ES recharge, HP pool, armor...

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...and your items don't mean very much against these traps.

-> Movespeed, armor, phys. reduction flasks, HP flasks, QS


Just pointing out glaring BS.

The more I read the "feedback", the more convinced I am that a good portion of the Lab-haters havent played it more than once or twice...

his point was actually that traps do % ehp damage, but you guys both made it superficial and easy to pick holes in.

/edit: going off this thread, getting sucked into the lab arguments again, silly

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Razis wrote:

his point was actually that traps do % ehp damage, but you guys both made it superficial and easy to pick holes in.

He was trying to "prove" that traps can't be mitigated by build & gear, which is obviously false. All this time spent shitposting would be better spent learning the Lab and it's mechanics. No wonder GGG doesn't take you seriously - with the exception of a few people, most anti-Lab posts seem to be just ramblings & dishonest assumptions.

I didn't like the Lab much at first, citing similar reasons: backtracking, too long, hard to see ahead in trap gauntlets, etc. Then I played it 20, 30, 40 times and learned layouts, trap gauntlets, adapted flasks & learned Izaro mechanics...

It's the same with every new addition GGG makes: first we complain it's a clusterfvk, then we learn it and it's not a huge problem any more (in between GGG nerfs it a little, because it's always overtuned at first)

Let's just look at what universally helps against all traps.
- movementskills that let you jump over traps.
- movement speed boosters like boots and QS
- hp/es regeneration

Everything else gets countered by trap type. So, if we ignore the regen stat, the other stats needed make it feel like a jump&run plat former game like Mario. If the traps weren't as many and if your hp/es pool was relevant it would feel much more like the choices made mattered. Who doesn't have ms boots or qs? The only choice regarding traps according to rpg standards would be getting a lot of regeneration or not.

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Pyrokar wrote:

Let's just look at what universally helps against all traps.
- movementskills that let you jump over traps.
- movement speed boosters like boots and QS
- hp/es regeneration

Everything else gets countered by trap type. So, if we ignore the regen stat, the other stats needed make it feel like a jump&run plat former game like Mario. If the traps weren't as many and if your hp/es pool was relevant it would feel much more like the choices made mattered. Who doesn't have ms boots or qs? The only choice regarding traps according to rpg standards would be getting a lot of regeneration or not.

You skipped another thing that helps with traps - avoiding them. Even if you don't avoid them all, avoiding enough of them not to die helps too. And then there's Reduced Damage from Traps and Reduced Damage over Time options available.

You act like it's such a hardship to even use the 3 you listed. You really make builds that intentionally have slow movement speed? You never use movement skills on your builds? You avoid quicksilver flasks like the plague? Are you trying to make a build that can't do the lab or what?

Something that work well against traps : one's brain.

was too slow tho, someone mentioned it before =((

I forgot. Apparently there's also this guy called Lenny, who can craft %ES recharge and more importantly DoT reduction that helps with traps (?? never tried it). If you really have troubles, you might try this additional improvement of survivability too.

So: Armor, regen, recharge, all movement skills, movespeed, basalt, granite, insta pots with anti-bleed, DoT reduction... lots of ways to outplay traps.

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mark1030 wrote:

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Pyrokar wrote:

Let's just look at what universally helps against all traps.
- movementskills that let you jump over traps.
- movement speed boosters like boots and QS
- hp/es regeneration

Everything else gets countered by trap type. So, if we ignore the regen stat, the other stats needed make it feel like a jump&run plat former game like Mario. If the traps weren't as many and if your hp/es pool was relevant it would feel much more like the choices made mattered. Who doesn't have ms boots or qs? The only choice regarding traps according to rpg standards would be getting a lot of regeneration or not.

You skipped another thing that helps with traps - avoiding them. Even if you don't avoid them all, avoiding enough of them not to die helps too. And then there's Reduced Damage from Traps and Reduced Damage over Time options available.

You act like it's such a hardship to even use the 3 you listed. You really make builds that intentionally have slow movement speed? You never use movement skills on your builds? You aboid quicksilver flasks like the plague? Are you trying to make a build that can't do the lab or what?

You said the exact things I said. What's your point?

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Pyrokar wrote:

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mark1030 wrote:

"

Pyrokar wrote:

Let's just look at what universally helps against all traps.
- movementskills that let you jump over traps.
- movement speed boosters like boots and QS
- hp/es regeneration

Everything else gets countered by trap type. So, if we ignore the regen stat, the other stats needed make it feel like a jump&run plat former game like Mario. If the traps weren't as many and if your hp/es pool was relevant it would feel much more like the choices made mattered. Who doesn't have ms boots or qs? The only choice regarding traps according to rpg standards would be getting a lot of regeneration or not.

You skipped another thing that helps with traps - avoiding them. Even if you don't avoid them all, avoiding enough of them not to die helps too. And then there's Reduced Damage from Traps and Reduced Damage over Time options available.

You act like it's such a hardship to even use the 3 you listed. You really make builds that intentionally have slow movement speed? You never use movement skills on your builds? You aboid quicksilver flasks like the plague? Are you trying to make a build that can't do the lab or what?

You said the exact things I said. What's your point?

I thought you were saying traps were bad because there weren't enough ways to deal with them so I added a few. I don't even know why people think movement skills are required. I never use them for traps. Quicksilver is plenty movement speed to get through them.

You obviously want the QS and the movevementskill gems to avoid the traps so that's what I am saying. The other options are very situational as they need for you to have a shield and a Leo at level X. Cannot be considered as the norm.

How is that different from bring ruby or topaz flasks to do Atziri or Sappjire flask to deal with Merveil? Flasks are meant to be used situationally. That's the point. Until they added surgeon's mod that's how everybody used them. Now some builds can keep them up all the time.

And i don't even use my quicksilver most of the time in traps. Mostly I forget I even have it. So it's definitely not required.