Over 430 threads discussing labyrinth problems with over 1040 posters in support DONE!!!!!

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Pyrokar wrote:

Nope sry, where there arent any timed spike traps, there were trigger spike traps with sentries flying on top of them and the sentries fly up until the end of the room including over that ledge you say has no spikes.

Seriously, run and pray gameplay on hc. Uber izzaro was nothing for my build but 2sec on a trap and i am dead. Great design.

The spiked traps aren't triggered, they follow a pattern, a sequence something you can learn and predict. The roombas are on a pattern as well.


Its not like the lab is any different on HC then it is on SC. One of the 40\40 challenges that I did was uber izzaro, so its not like I haven't ran the lab and encountered similar trap setups before.

If it took 2 seconds to die on the traps (which it should take more), did you not have flask charges?

Look at the picture again plz. There are triggered spiked traps on top of the sentries, that trigger when you step on them. I didn't say they are different on sc, but asking a hc player to run and pray not to die is bad design.

And no, i didn't die. If i afk for 2 sec on a blade sentry i am dead. If i afk for 2 seconds on Uber izaro i am nowhere near as dead. Maybe if it was 30+ seconds.

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Pyrokar wrote:

Look at the picture again plz. There are triggered spiked traps on top of the sentries, that trigger when you step on them. I didn't say they are different on sc, but asking a hc player to run and pray not to die is bad design.

Those are FLOOR SPIKES, they are just like the ones you see in the trials, they alternate which ones are up and which ones are down, they are predicable and 100% avoidable if you learn the pattern.

I see the sentry, I don't recall this specific encounter, but the sentry is avoidable as well, they always are.


There is no just pray to not die, you simply don't understand the mechanics involved and therefore call the design shitty. The trials were\are there to introduce you to the mechanics, if you got rushed thru them or ignored them, then its no surprise to me that you don't understand the challenge.

Ok look right infront of my feet, what do you call that trap? I call it a triggered spike trap that triggers if i step on it.

Also, it's irrelevant if it's avoidable 100% by your leet sonic skills. There is no safe space to see whats going on ahead and that in hc means it's run and pray not to die.

Also, saying that someone who did all uber trials and uber lab in hc is unable to understand the mechanics is very valid. Wow. Much argument.

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I don't claim to be a labyrinth expert but, I've read a whole bunch. It appears to me that the labyrinth traps are much less balanced across different builds than Atziri, to use your example. There seems to be two attributes, life regen and movement speed, that can make labyrinth traps pretty easy. If a build doesn't have at least one of those two attributes then labyrinth becomes much more difficult. Of course, life regen rules in the labyrinth but I've played a character with high movement speed and the labyrinth was pretty easy. There was a post that said they played almost the same builds only one was 20% movement speed and the other was over 50% and the 50% was easy and the 20% one was significantly harder. I don't think the same is true for Atziri is it? I mean that there is more combinations of good builds with different attributes than just two that can beat Atziri. My assumption with this is that labyrinth is really poorly designed/balanced to be a good "test" or "gate" for something as universally important as ascendancy points.

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As for the comparison to atziri I don't think that is the right line of thinking, while atziri is a set of various challenging mods, the content was designed before players got this much power. People can beat atziri with positioning and technique or they can just destroy her with insane DPS.

it is a perfect comparison. both are mechanic tests.
in one it is all about how well one can deal with the attrition of traps
the other is how good you are at neutralizing the bulk of the atziri map damage.

both have well established critera for success.

for atziri its either make her attacks do nothing to you. or kill her before she attacks you.
for lab its run fast enough so dot doesnt murder you. or have enough life regen so that dot doesnt matter to you.

and the middle grounds that fall between the two extremes

they are perfect comparisons to each other. especially since neither are technically mandatory for beating the game... just desired.. heavily

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goetzjam wrote:

Who says the lab needs to be a test or a benchmark for a build?

Many people have said that lab is a test of the build. I thought you had said it but maybe not. It is a favorite Sidtherat statement as another example then.

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Pyrokar wrote:

Ok look right infront of my feet, what do you call that trap? I call it a triggered spike trap that triggers if i step onto it.

Also, it's irrelevant if it's avoidable 100% by your leet sonic skills. There is no safe space to see whats going on ahead and that in hc means it's run and pray not to die.

I marked this image so it is easier to see.

The yellow is circling the trigger things you are referring to, which are 100% avoidable.

The 1's and 2's are showing the sequence, when 1 goes down 2 will go up, when 2 goes down 1 will go up.

3 is the safe spot in this series of traps to assess the next series of traps.

You could address this in many ways:



Or you could yolo panic like you did and just run in and die.

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Many people have said that lab is a test of the build. I thought you had said it but maybe not. It is a favorite Sidtherat statement as another example then.

I mean I do view it as a test if your build is worthy of ascension, but doing the lab isn't a test to prove you can do XX content, except the lab itself, because its rather unique.

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goetzjam wrote:

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Pyrokar wrote:

Ok look right infront of my feet, what do you call that trap? I call it a triggered spike trap that triggers if i step onto it.

Also, it's irrelevant if it's avoidable 100% by your leet sonic skills. There is no safe space to see whats going on ahead and that in hc means it's run and pray not to die.

I marked this image so it is easier to see.

The yellow is circling the trigger things you are referring to, which are 100% avoidable.

The 1's and 2's are showing the sequence, when 1 goes down 2 will go up, when 2 goes down 1 will go up.

3 is the safe spot in this series of traps to assess the next series of traps.

You could address this in many ways:



Or you could yolo panic like you did and just run in and die.

"

Many people have said that lab is a test of the build. I thought you had said it but maybe not. It is a favorite Sidtherat statement as another example then.

I mean I do view it as a test if your build is worthy of ascension, but doing the lab isn't a test to prove you can do XX content, except the lab itself, because its rather unique.

I already told you, the 2's are always down unless i step on them and over 3 flies the bladed sentry. Why don't you understand the mechanics? Did you get rushed through them in softcore? Hilarious...

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Pyrokar wrote:

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I mean I do view it as a test if your build is worthy of ascension, but doing the lab isn't a test to prove you can do XX content, except the lab itself, because its rather unique.

I already told you, the 2's are always down unless i step on them and over 3 flies the bladed sentry. Why don't you understand the mechanics? Did you get rushed through them in softcore? Hilarious...

He asked "Who says the lab needs to be a test or a benchmark for a build?", so I answer then he admits that he also sometimes says that.

I really have no clue why I still sometimes respond? I'm going to have to redouble my efforts to resist.

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I already told you, the 2's are always down unless i step on them and over 3 flies the bladed sentry. Why don't you understand the mechanics? Did you get rushed through them in softcore? Hilarious...

So 2's are always down unless you step on the 100% avoidable pads?

The bladed sentry isn't over 3 in the picture so it obviously gives you some time to navigate the suggested path.


This isn't about me, I'm not the one complaining I died to "unavoidable traps" when clearly you died to traps, at least by looking at the picture that could have been avoided.


For your information I did most of my lab runs solo, simply because its quicker.

What is hilarious is you aren't able to describe the scenario or the issue and you thought the best idea was just panic run thru and hope to get lucky. How you survive in HC the rest of the time is just a indication as to how much easier this game has gotten. Instead of learning the game you want to point the blame game at anyone that points out the flaws in your approach or the lack of knowledge of the content presented.

If anything GGG needs to see an argument like this to realize that the trails aren't really accomplishing what they should be if people get to this stage in the game and aren't able to do the lab because the lack of how to approach the challenge.