SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

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patirce wrote:

Then the game will change, and its playerbase with it, I suppose.

There's much anecdotal evidence that a significant percentage of the player base dislikes labyrinth. The GGG goal should be to keep the players that they have and to add new players to the player base. I'm afraid that Labyrinth is chasing away more players than it is adding and reducing retention rather than improving it.

Here's threads I found on the subject and just reading the thread titles tells a compelling story, in my opinion.

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Prisus wrote:

Is it the complete end of the world doing something 3 times? I don't think so.

Nice post, except this part. This is a straw-man argument.

I'd explain exactly why if it hadn't already been done dozens of times by others. ;)

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gibbousmoon wrote:

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Prisus wrote:

Is it the complete end of the world doing something 3 times? I don't think so.

Nice post, except this part. This is a straw-man argument.

I'd explain exactly why if it hadn't already been done dozens of times by others. ;)

I need to admit to the world now and for the first time in the history of the Universe. When I'm playing solitaire by myself and I'm about to lose, I sing these lines from an old song.

It's the end of the world as we know it
It's the end of the world as we know it
It's the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine

R.E.M. 1987

So, from the point of view that even the wind created by the beat of a butterfly wing changes the world as we know it, going into the future - Everyone is right. It is in fact the end of the world as we know it and at the same time it is not the end of the world. And I hope that you feel fine too.

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Pyrokar wrote:

Why are you so mad? I am just trying to help you since you seemed confused about the meaning of a word... :(

Ugh...

For the record, that's another spam/clutter/offensive comment, but I'm not going to report it because LOL at doing that.

Speaking of the meanings of words, LOL stands for 'laughing out loud', and 'laughing' means... well, google it, I can't do all the work.

I'm not even sure why you'd think I'm mad, even 'mad' in the 'U MAD' internet sense. This whole thing to me is interesting and fascinating and tbh fun.

There's an apropos concept, eh? 'Fun' is subjective.

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Also,

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Pyrokar wrote:

Hey dick, if you want to argue about the word gate or about the wiki definition of an arpg, do it in another thread as i believe it to be offtopic on this one. If it isn't, then plz elaborate.

Nothing new on that front huh?

If you honestly believe, in a thread about what and/or what doesn't belong in an ARPG, that agreeing on a acceptable definition of 'ARPG' is offtopic... Well I honestly don't even know how to respond to that.

Don't worry though, I'll probably think of something soon and make another 'mad' post.

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Shovelcut wrote:

Considering that the people he's talking to constantly fall back on the "it's a different genre" argument to justify their agenda, it's my opinion that it's very much on-topic.

It's not a shocker that they don't want to go that route in the discussion.

Shovelcut, srs question here: Did you die a little inside having to spell that out or what?

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Pyrokar wrote:

Ah, ok. So the argument is that person X is wrong in feeling that the lab has different gameplay than previous versions of PoE, because he doesn't use the word gate correctly or has a weird definition of an arpg?

The best I can do here is say that the person using the latter to argue the former will have much less impact.

Really thought this just deserves a 'WTF' but I feel I cry wolf too much with my 'WTF's. You probably chased away poor Shovelcut again behind that.

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Let's try your method of debating:

Spoiler

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borderlands_(video_game)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Now try and guess what my point is.

I have no idea what your point is. Maybe if you asked a simple Y/N question I could answer it and we could make some progress.

still no change in lab/ac yet?

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dickhole_mcghee wrote:

in a thread about what and/or what doesn't belong in an ARPG

Offtopic. Read OP again. Stop generalizing.

Yes, you sound mad. Mad can have several meanings you know, like the word gate. And oh boy, you certainly seem to qualify for some of them.

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aonezu wrote:

still no change in lab/ac yet?

No change.
_____________

Regarding the topic of a definition of ARPG, I really don't know what this is about but, I don't see any key weakness in the OP logic related to this? Labyrinth being a different genre is a secondary issue. The primary issue is that trap game play is boring tedious and not fun for many people. Being a different genre is an explanation (a partial explanation?) as to why so many people that enjoy PoE game play find the trap game play boring tedious and not fun.

You see Turtledove, by dick's logic, this thread might as well be about exploding barrels and how they don't belong in PoE, since they are traps. Which is completely offtopic and irrelevant.

So yea, i am sorry for wasting my time with him. Not gonna derail this thread anymore than i already did by trying to make sense of him.

So what im suggesting here is for GGG to consider at some point to remove the ascendancy points from labyrinth. Not make them completely free, but remove that tedious, frustrating and unfun playstyle as a requirement to acquire them.


Agree. LAB SUCKS BAD, Get rid of it, does not belong in this game. It is not fun.

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Pyrokar wrote:

You see Turtledove, by dick's logic, this thread might as well be about exploding barrels and how they don't belong in PoE, since they are traps. Which is completely off topic and irrelevant. ...

Actually, this is an excellent point. I've seen people that don't really understand, state that darts coming out of the wall in Diablo 2 or cold patches on the ground in maps prove that traps belong in ARPG games. The point being that those occasional "traps" in the game are not sufficient to change the fundamental game play. When one must navigate a computer screen of traps then the fundamental game play of the game is changed for some people. It is enough for some people to feel that the basic game play has changed. Many do not enjoy that kind of game play.