SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

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lijoe408 wrote:

The easiest solution would be just to adjust the Damage done by Traps. There is no reason that a lvl 70 should die to spinning spiketraps that are offscreen in normal difficulty. Just set the traps to deal a certain amount of damage, so that characters can actually gear/tech for them. There is no reason that traps should deal a % of life at all difficulties. They should deal static damage to provide a gear check. Maybe at the highest difficulty they can deal % based damaged, as you should have all your ascendancy points you need at that stage.

This would be the best solution that I can think of and requires the least amount of work from the dev team. The can literally patch/hotfix this and I would be 100% satisfied.

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Turtledove wrote:

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lijoe408 wrote:

The easiest solution would be just to adjust the Damage done by Traps. There is no reason that a lvl 70 should die to spinning spiketraps that are offscreen in normal difficulty. Just set the traps to deal a certain amount of damage, so that characters can actually gear/tech for them. There is no reason that traps should deal a % of life at all difficulties. They should deal static damage to provide a gear check. Maybe at the highest difficulty they can deal % based damaged, as you should have all your ascendancy points you need at that stage.

This would be the best solution that I can think of and requires the least amount of work from the dev team. The can literally patch/hotfix this and I would be 100% satisfied.

Thinking about this simple proposal, I think it would actually work fairly well. I mean, I'd rather see GGG make labyrinth more fun with one the other proposals but this probably would be fairly easy to implement. It would make it easier to over level the content to minimize it's disgusting unfun game play for people that would be so inclined. I think the HC crowd would likely be appeased somewhat. This solution would seem to go along with GGG's idea in 3.0. That is to do something quick and easy.

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Archwizard wrote:

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This would be terrible. The whole point of having traps do a % of your EHP is so that you can't simply overlevel and trivialize the content. And you can gear and whatnot to defend against the traps, phys mitigation works you know.

And I have never once seen a trap that can be lethal come from offscreen. The only one I can think of is the darts, but those are never lethal solo (in combo with sawblades or roombas they can be downright nasty) and 95% of the darts are always firing so you can see their travel path ahead of time.

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EnjoyTheJourney wrote:

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Archwizard wrote:

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This would be terrible. The whole point of having traps do a % of your EHP is so that you can't simply overlevel and trivialize the content. And you can gear and whatnot to defend against the traps, phys mitigation works you know.

And I have never once seen a trap that can be lethal come from offscreen. The only one I can think of is the darts, but those are never lethal solo (in combo with sawblades or roombas they can be downright nasty) and 95% of the darts are always firing so you can see their travel path ahead of time.

Getting hit from off-screen is usually seen as not particularly fair to players or good design, and yet here you are defending it by arguing that it seldom happens, so that makes it OK. Why is off-screening OK in lab when it's typically considered bad form in other parts of the game (except stuff like frostbolts, which are easy to see and very easy to dodge)? Also, if it's not important for any other content in the game to have "% of hit points" damage, then why would it be so "terrible" to switch to the usual damage mechanics in lab? And, if it really is "terrible" to over-level content and trivialize it, then why isn't "% of hit points" damage the norm throughout the game? More generally, ARPGs seldom make use of the "% of hit points" damage mechanic and if it's not essential to making another ARPG a good game, then why would it be so critical for POE?

A few might drop by here to characterize this kind of change as a catastrophe that would permanently destroy the integrity of POE and its developers, as well cause birth defects in the children of everybody who ever played the game, plus the destruction of civilization itself. It might even be claimed that the proposed change would lead to outcomes even worse than all of the others mentioned before, such as Beverly Hills 90210 coming back to broadcast television or Arnold Schwarzenegger winning an acting award other than a Razzie. But, claims of how "terrible" it would be to switch to a usual damage mechanic in lab are reactionary and overinflated.

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EnjoyTheJourney wrote:

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Archwizard wrote:

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This would be terrible. The whole point of having traps do a % of your EHP is so that you can't simply overlevel and trivialize the content. And you can gear and whatnot to defend against the traps, phys mitigation works you know.

And I have never once seen a trap that can be lethal come from offscreen. The only one I can think of is the darts, but those are never lethal solo (in combo with sawblades or roombas they can be downright nasty) and 95% of the darts are always firing so you can see their travel path ahead of time.

Getting hit from off-screen is usually seen as not particularly fair to players or good design, and yet here you are defending it by arguing that it seldom happens, so that makes it OK. Why is off-screening OK in lab when it's typically considered bad form in other parts of the game (except stuff like frostbolts, which are easy to see and very easy to dodge)? Also, if it's not important for any other content in the game to have "% of hit points" damage, then why would it be so "terrible" to switch to the usual damage mechanics in lab? And, if it really is "terrible" to over-level content and trivialize it, then why isn't "% of hit points" damage the norm throughout the game? More generally, ARPGs seldom make use of the "% of hit points" damage mechanic and if it's not essential to making another ARPG a good game, then why would it be so critical for POE?

A few might drop by here to characterize this kind of change as a catastrophe that would permanently destroy the integrity of POE and its developers, as well cause birth defects in the children of everybody who ever played the game, plus the destruction of civilization itself. It might even be claimed that the proposed change would lead to outcomes even worse than all of the others mentioned before, such as Beverly Hills 90210 coming back to broadcast television or Arnold Schwarzenegger winning an acting award other than a Razzie. But, claims of how "terrible" it would be to switch to a usual damage mechanic in lab are reactionary and overinflated.

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Turtledove wrote:

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EnjoyTheJourney wrote:

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Archwizard wrote:

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This would be terrible. The whole point of having traps do a % of your EHP is so that you can't simply overlevel and trivialize the content. And you can gear and whatnot to defend against the traps, phys mitigation works you know.

And I have never once seen a trap that can be lethal come from offscreen. The only one I can think of is the darts, but those are never lethal solo (in combo with sawblades or roombas they can be downright nasty) and 95% of the darts are always firing so you can see their travel path ahead of time.

Getting hit from off-screen is usually seen as not particularly fair to players or good design, and yet here you are defending it by arguing that it seldom happens, so that makes it OK. Why is off-screening OK in lab when it's typically considered bad form in other parts of the game (except stuff like frostbolts, which are easy to see and very easy to dodge)? Also, if it's not important for any other content in the game to have "% of hit points" damage, then why would it be so "terrible" to switch to the usual damage mechanics in lab? And, if it really is "terrible" to over-level content and trivialize it, then why isn't "% of hit points" damage the norm throughout the game? More generally, ARPGs seldom make use of the "% of hit points" damage mechanic and if it's not essential to making another ARPG a good game, then why would it be so critical for POE?

A few might drop by here to characterize this kind of change as a catastrophe that would permanently destroy the integrity of POE and its developers, as well cause birth defects in the children of everybody who ever played the game, plus the destruction of civilization itself. It might even be claimed that the proposed change would lead to outcomes even worse than all of the others mentioned before, such as Beverly Hills 90210 coming back to broadcast television or Arnold Schwarzenegger winning an acting award other than a Razzie. But, claims of how "terrible" it would be to switch to a usual damage mechanic in lab are reactionary and overinflated.

When I read Archwizard's post, I kept thinking, this is almost exactly what he probably would have argued previous to 3.0 release if someone had suggested exactly what GGG implemented. The reason I thought he would have argued that is for the exact same answer to the many questions you asked him. For example, "if it's not important for any other content in the game to have "% of hit points" damage, then why would it be so "terrible" to switch to the usual damage mechanics in lab?". Because whatever, GGG does is perfect and anyone arguing against it has a terrible idea. Therefore, it's a terrible idea to make labyrinth work like the rest of PoE. What a disaster that would be! Not only for the reasons you suggest but also because it would cause everyone playing PoE to get terrible painful external hemorrhoids and so they would no longer be able to sit to play PoE!.

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Turtledove wrote:

<Some random guy wrote something here, whoever the heck he is>

When I read Archwizard's post, I kept thinking, this is almost exactly what he probably would have argued previous to 3.0 release if someone had suggested exactly what GGG implemented. The reason I thought he would have argued that is for the exact same answer to the many questions you asked him. For example, "if it's not important for any other content in the game to have "% of hit points" damage, then why would it be so "terrible" to switch to the usual damage mechanics in lab?". Because whatever, GGG does is perfect and anyone arguing against it has a terrible idea. Therefore, it's a terrible idea to make labyrinth work like the rest of PoE. What a disaster that would be! Not only for the reasons you suggest but also because it would cause everyone playing PoE to get terrible painful external hemorrhoids and so they would no longer be able to sit to play PoE!.

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EnjoyTheJourney wrote:

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Turtledove wrote:

<Some random guy wrote something here, whoever the heck he is>

When I read Archwizard's post, I kept thinking, this is almost exactly what he probably would have argued previous to 3.0 release if someone had suggested exactly what GGG implemented. The reason I thought he would have argued that is for the exact same answer to the many questions you asked him. For example, "if it's not important for any other content in the game to have "% of hit points" damage, then why would it be so "terrible" to switch to the usual damage mechanics in lab?". Because whatever, GGG does is perfect and anyone arguing against it has a terrible idea. Therefore, it's a terrible idea to make labyrinth work like the rest of PoE. What a disaster that would be! Not only for the reasons you suggest but also because it would cause everyone playing PoE to get terrible painful external hemorrhoids and so they would no longer be able to sit to play PoE!.

I worry daily about external hemorrhoids being caused by changes to POE. It's the single greatest fear in my life.

I worry not only for my own sake, though. I also worry about children everywhere who haven't had the good fortune to play a game with "% of hit points" damage as one of the mechanics in a game. Well, at least not in a labyrinth, in a game. Or, at least not in a labyrinth with trap gauntlets, in a game. Or, perhaps I just mean not in a labyrinth with trap gauntlets, in an ARPG game. Repeated four times per character, in a slightly different way each time.

Because we all know how sad it would be for children to not have that kind of experience.

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Archwizard wrote:

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EnjoyTheJourney wrote:

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Turtledove wrote:

<Some random guy wrote something here, whoever the heck he is>

When I read Archwizard's post, I kept thinking, this is almost exactly what he probably would have argued previous to 3.0 release if someone had suggested exactly what GGG implemented. The reason I thought he would have argued that is for the exact same answer to the many questions you asked him. For example, "if it's not important for any other content in the game to have "% of hit points" damage, then why would it be so "terrible" to switch to the usual damage mechanics in lab?". Because whatever, GGG does is perfect and anyone arguing against it has a terrible idea. Therefore, it's a terrible idea to make labyrinth work like the rest of PoE. What a disaster that would be! Not only for the reasons you suggest but also because it would cause everyone playing PoE to get terrible painful external hemorrhoids and so they would no longer be able to sit to play PoE!.

I worry daily about external hemorrhoids being caused by changes to POE. It's the single greatest fear in my life.

I worry not only for my own sake, though. I also worry about children everywhere who haven't had the good fortune to play a game with "% of hit points" damage as one of the mechanics in a game. Well, at least not in a labyrinth, in a game. Or, at least not in a labyrinth with trap gauntlets, in a game. Or, perhaps I just mean not in a labyrinth with trap gauntlets, in an ARPG game. Repeated four times per character, in a slightly different way each time.

Because we all know how sad it would be for children to not have that kind of experience.

Very cute. I love how you ignore your hypocrisy.

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Turtledove wrote:

I notice that you once again ignore the fact that your assertion that it would somehow magically be terrible for traps to behave like the rest of the game. What magical thing would make it so terrible? I mean besides causing hemorrhoids, causing birth defects, and destroying human civilization?