SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

"

Randomzx wrote:

You seriously need to go back to elementary school, because your reading comprehension is just terrible. No wonder GGG never bother to listen to you.

Here's what is being discussed.

(quote="Zalhan2")
No offense but this game used to be fun and now I think it isn't, is not opinion, it's a fact.(/quote)


How about a lesson in English and logic.

Let's build a sentence.

A) "The Labyrinth is fun."
B) "The Labyrinth is not fun."

A and B are both sentences, that appear contradictory. However, they can both be true since the word "fun" is inherently subjective. These sentences are implicitly giving an opinion of the person that wrote them.

Let's modify them.

C) "I think the Labyrinth is fun."
D) "I think the Labyrinth is not fun."

These sentence are no longer contradictory. They are no longer implicitly giving an opinion. They are stating two simple facts. Those stated facts are that the person is holding the thought as described.

X) Sentence C is stating that the person holds a thought that the labyrinth is fun.
Y) Sentence D is stating that the person holds a thought that the labyrinth is not fun.

Sentences C & D are now in the form of the first part of Zalhan2's sentence. If we add the last part of Zalahan2's sentence then

E) "I think the Labyrinth is fun, is not opinion, it's a fact."
F) "I think the Labyrinth is not fun, is not opinion, it's a fact."

We have two sentences that are completely valid as described above in X and Y.

If the sentence instead took the form,

G) "The Labyrinth is fun, is not opinion, it's a fact."
H) "The Labyrinth is not fun, is not opinion, it's a fact."

then you guys would have an argument. Although since the word "fun" is inherently subjective, the issue could reasonably be argued both ways.

1) the poster already stated "used to be fun", which directly implies "is not fun right now"
2) facts are objective
3) thinking of stuff != facts
4) your interpretation of the post would make a silly post even more silly.
5) The poster clearly wants to give the idea that his post is the indisputable truth.

No wonder you grasp of the word logical is tenuous too.

Technically what he said was true, but following it with "it's not an opinion, it's a fact" is extremely weird sentence structure. Best case scenario it's just poorly written, worst case scenario it's being intentionally baity by saying "my opinions is this, and that's a fact, not an opinion" because seriously who talks like that?

"

Randomzx wrote:

1) the poster already stated "used to be fun", which directly implies "is not fun right now"
2) facts are objective
3) thinking of stuff != facts
4) your interpretation of the post would make a silly post even more silly.
5) The poster clearly wants to give the idea that his post is the indisputable truth.

No wonder you grasp of the word logical is tenuous too.

Your number 3 above indicates that you did not try very hard to process the simple facts. Try again: The fact is that I'm thinking PoE is not as much fun as Diablo 3. That is a fact not an opinion. My opinion is that PoE is not as much fun as Diablo 3. It is a fact that I hold that opinion.

Your number 5 is correct because that sentence you quoted from Zalhan2 is the indisputable truth. I posted what I thought was a very clear explanation of the sentence. If you don't understand the explanation or if there's another sentence that you're having difficulty understanding then please let me know.

edit:
______________________

"

j33bus wrote:

Technically what he said was true, but following it with "it's not an opinion, it's a fact" is extremely weird sentence structure. Best case scenario it's just poorly written, worst case scenario it's being intentionally baity by saying "my opinions is this, and that's a fact, not an opinion" because seriously who talks like that?

I can't really disagree with this being an awkward sentence structure. Although I reserve judgement on the motivations since I haven't reread Zalhan2's post that contained the sentence to get the full context.

"

Zalhan2 wrote:

"

raics wrote:

All of you should brush up on PoE mechanics, that was a local fact, not a global fact.

That is a really illogical statement since many of us stopped playing because we were not having fun. Why practice something I would get no value from at all when I could do something fun, like post here!

I must be losing my touch, this is another joke today that fell on its face.

"

raics wrote:

"

Zalhan2 wrote:

"

raics wrote:

All of you should brush up on PoE mechanics, that was a local fact, not a global fact.

That is a really illogical statement since many of us stopped playing because we were not having fun. Why practice something I would get no value from at all when I could do something fun, like post here!

I must be losing my touch, this is another joke today that fell on its face.

My point which I thought even captain obvious could understand is that this feature has ruined the game for many the members of the list which has been accrued.

Any discussion about the quality of this game is pointless to this debate since at the end of thew day, you play a game because it is fun.

The point is if a significant group of people's game experience is ruined over a feature that is not
even a skill cap (since you can cheese it by paying someone else to do it) maybe it should not be in the progression path.

At the very least make it a non groupable skill cap, It would still not find the game fun but I would respect the decision.

I also was saying (in a nice way, which fails a lot of people's logic here) who the fuck are you to tell me what I enjoy or do not.

Hopefully your response is play another game. I am so we agree on something!

I was hoping to get others hating the game but still playing to see my logic.
For the record if the game feels fun again I will play it, Lab or not.

"

Turtledove wrote:

Your number 3 above indicates that you did not try very hard to process the simple facts. Try again: The fact is that I'm thinking PoE is not as much fun as Diablo 3. That is a fact not an opinion. My opinion is that PoE is not as much fun as Diablo 3. It is a fact that I hold that opinion.

Your number 5 is correct because that sentence you quoted from Zalhan2 is the indisputable truth. I posted what I thought was a very clear explanation of the sentence. If you don't understand the explanation or if there's another sentence that you're having difficulty understanding then please let me know.

Thinking something doesn't make it a fact, there's no possible confirmation that the person actually think that way or even think at all.

And with the way the poster used "I think", it is a transitive verb with the way it used in the sentence.

merriam webster:

"

a : to have as an opinion think it's so
b : to regard as : consider think the rule unfair

cambridge dictionary:
British English:

"

to believe something or have an opinion or idea:
I think (that) I've met you before.
I don't think Emma will get the job.

American English:

"

to have or to form an opinion or idea about something:
....
[ I ] I’ll always think of him as someone I can rely on.
[ + (that) clause ] I think (that) I’d better go now.
I still think of myself as (= believe I am) her friend.

Business English:

"

to have a particular idea, belief or opinion:
...
think (that) Some analysts think that rates will continue to rise.
I think the figures speak for themselves.

Also:
https://ell.stackexchange.com/questions/4803/can-a-sentence-starting-with-i-think-be-used-to-state-a-fact

"

Zalhan2 wrote:

My point which I thought even captain obvious could understand is that this feature has ruined the game for many the members of the list which has been accrued.

That's nice, my point was to lighten up.

"

Randomzx wrote:

"

Turtledove wrote:

Your number 3 above indicates that you did not try very hard to process the simple facts. Try again: The fact is that I'm thinking PoE is not as much fun as Diablo 3. That is a fact not an opinion. My opinion is that PoE is not as much fun as Diablo 3. It is a fact that I hold that opinion.

Your number 5 is correct because that sentence you quoted from Zalhan2 is the indisputable truth. I posted what I thought was a very clear explanation of the sentence. If you don't understand the explanation or if there's another sentence that you're having difficulty understanding then please let me know.

Thinking something doesn't make it a fact, there's no possible confirmation that the person actually think that way or even think at all.

And with the way the poster used "I think", it is a transitive verb with the way it used in the sentence.

merriam webster:

"

a : to have as an opinion think it's so
b : to regard as : consider think the rule unfair

cambridge dictionary:
British English:

"

to believe something or have an opinion or idea:
I think (that) I've met you before.
I don't think Emma will get the job.

American English:

"

to have or to form an opinion or idea about something:

Business English:

"

to have a particular idea, belief or opinion:

Also:
https://ell.stackexchange.com/questions/4803/can-a-sentence-starting-with-i-think-be-used-to-state-a-fact

I never claimed that thinking something made it a fact. I claimed that it was a fact that he was thinking that PoE was not fun.

"

Turtledove wrote:

I never claimed that thinking something made it a fact. I claimed that it was a fact that he was thinking that PoE was not fun.

What's the point of saying so? Nobody said he was trolling.