[2.6] life Mjolner done right by Rico - Berserker version

Soooo, i crunched some numbers just 'cause i didn't know what to do and could not stop thinking about mjolner, so here are the preliminary results of nerfs

-Just bear with me, i use a heavily modified version of the build, with different gem setup, so numbers will be off for some of you, it's just to give an overall impression on the changes in %

So, let's start:

I normally use Dis-Dis-IncAoE for normal mapping. With all the bonus I took on the tree + jewels and various sh1t, my discharge does around 13.4k damage with 1/8 POW/END charges. So 26.8k total damage*.

- Mjolner will support 1 skill per trigger and discharge will do 35% less damage when triggered. Assuming both of theese hits this setup (the triggered discharge one is uncertain 'cause wording issues) i changed my mapping layout to Dis-IncAoe-Controlled Destruction.

With controlled destruction, a single discharge raises for me from 13.4k to 18.6k damage. Then, 18.6k*0.65= around 12.1k damage. No double discharge, so it remains 12.1k.

Then, we must take in account that power charges will be 8 around 30% of the time, so we gain every time an average of ((8*0.3)+(1*0.7))=3.1 charges.

Now, after some tests with the Doedre Elixir, i pinned down the damage per endurance charge of new discharge at around 1300, so:

damage of unaffected power charge is: 12.1k-1300*8= 1700 Lightning damage
damage of new average power charges is: 1.3k*3.1= 4030 Fire damage

Grand total: 5730 total of nerfed discharge damage. Compared to the starting 26.8k is about a -78% damage


*actual damage is a little higher due to multiple power charges instead of 1/8 fixed, but i avoided to count that on purpose to ease the math

EDIT: Seeing at theese low numbers makes me wonder if going dual mjolner, as ricokgb said, will be a good idea: instead of -78% damage we could obtain -56% damage with a second discharge setup.

Oh, right, life recovery from charges will suffer too, from 1600/trigger of old discharge setup to around 310... an 80% decrease, on average? At least dual wielding will patch it up to a 60% decrease.

In conclusion: dual wield will net us -56% damage & -60% life recovery.

Those are painful numbers.

Mjolner doesnt process in offhand like that. Other than the 15% ias boost, there is no benefit to dual wield mjolner. Using a skill that hits with both hands will not proc the offhand mjolner, and even if it did, there would be no benefit over a discharge-echo.

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BloodBaneBoneBreaker wrote:

Mjolner doesnt process in offhand like that. Other than the 15% ias boost, there is no benefit to dual wield mjolner. Using a skill that hits with both hands will not proc the offhand mjolner, and even if it did, there would be no benefit over a discharge-echo.

This.

Question I have is... could we have been going Discharge-Spell Echo all along instead of double Discharge? What's the difference assuming 20/20 Spell Echo?

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chilipino wrote:

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BloodBaneBoneBreaker wrote:

Mjolner doesnt process in offhand like that. Other than the 15% ias boost, there is no benefit to dual wield mjolner. Using a skill that hits with both hands will not proc the offhand mjolner, and even if it did, there would be no benefit over a discharge-echo.

This.

Question I have is... could we have been going Discharge-Spell Echo all along instead of double Discharge? What's the difference assuming 20/20 Spell Echo?

I was not aware of spell echo working with discharge, not sure if it works/will work after changes either.

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Used_As_A_Shield wrote:

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chilipino wrote:

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BloodBaneBoneBreaker wrote:

Mjolner doesnt process in offhand like that. Other than the 15% ias boost, there is no benefit to dual wield mjolner. Using a skill that hits with both hands will not proc the offhand mjolner, and even if it did, there would be no benefit over a discharge-echo.

This.

Question I have is... could we have been going Discharge-Spell Echo all along instead of double Discharge? What's the difference assuming 20/20 Spell Echo?

I was not aware of spell echo working with discharge, not sure if it works/will work after changes either.

I wasn't either until I saw some people talking about it. I don't think it would work since Spell Echo only supports self-casted spells AFAIK.

Unique Item Balance:
Mjölner: Its chance to cast socketed lightning skills on hit has been increased from 30% to 100%. Use a Divine orb if you want your legacy one to change.

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Evander1992 wrote:

Then, we must take in account that power charges will be 8 around 30% of the time, so we gain every time an average of ((8*0.3)+(1*0.7))=3.1 charges.[/b]

Everything is fine untill this. This is where it gets wrong imo.

Imagine Mjolner as it was before Unrelenting: it was able to generate 3/3 charges at average vs single target with secound spell such as Arc.

Leaving Arc behind it will now generate 2/2 charges at minimum (note: not going into cooldown vs aps debate here).

So you have guaranteed 2+2 charges and a 30% chance for additional 6 endu charges (2+2+6). It should look like this than:

4 + 0.3 * 6 = 5.8 for a 3/8 setup

and: 4 + 0.3 * 7 = 6.1 for a 3/9 setup.

vs 11 guaranteed (2 + 9) before Unrelenting nerf.

Thats 45% less charges per Discharge on average, or 45% less dmg in its root.

But that is something we can live with. Really.

The main issue here is that f_ing internal cooldown (if it exists, how long it is?).

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BloodBaneBoneBreaker wrote:

Mjolner doesnt process in offhand like that. Other than the 15% ias boost, there is no benefit to dual wield mjolner.

I think this is incorrect (I could be wrong thou).

Mjolner has 30%/50% chance to trigger socketed (in it) lightning gems on hit.

Two Mjolners, two Discharge setups in each one of them. From the Wiki:

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Dual Wielding: Dual wielding attacks with Molten Strike will alternate the weapon being swung.

So wheres the problem ? :)

BTW: Anyone with acces to 2x Mjolner can check it right now - replace Discharge with Arc in main hand Mjolner, socket Discharge in off hand Mjolner, see if both triggers.

If theres an internal cooldown on Mjolner and it will be 500ms like CoC it will limit single Mjolner to 2 Discharges / s no matter what you do. The only way I can think of to walk around this issue is to use secound trigger setup (secound Mjolner in this regard) with its own trigger cooldown timer.

This hovewer, needs to be tested ingame. But from what we know abuot triggers (such as CWDT) each one of them has its own cooldown timer.

If dual wielding Mjolnmer will work as I expect it to do, than we will raise the 2 Discharge / s limitation to 4 Discharges / s. Still this will be abut half than we had before with Double discharge setup but might be playable (should feel like non-legacy single Discharge 2.3 setup).

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I don't think it would work since Spell Echo only supports self-casted spells AFAIK.

Exactyl that. Echo wont work with any triggered spell. Even if it was there will be 0 charges to repeat Discharge with.

Oh... mjolner now 100% trigger on hit and also jugg chance for max endur down further to 25%. No mention of internal cooldown either.... HHMMMMM

Yeah, i imagined something was wrong with the numbers, i was quite tired yesterday...

Btw, no more need for dual wielding mjolners, now we have 100% proc chance
With rico calculations, we have an average of 50% less charges on top of 35% less discharge damage if triggered, so it is still a hefty reduction. Adding to that, we loose another 5% to have full endurance